Can a 15.1 hh, 1100 lb quarter horse carry a 300 lb man for a short 1 hr trail ride? - Page 6
 
 

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Can a 15.1 hh, 1100 lb quarter horse carry a 300 lb man for a short 1 hr trail ride?

This is a discussion on Can a 15.1 hh, 1100 lb quarter horse carry a 300 lb man for a short 1 hr trail ride? within the Horse Riding forums, part of the Riding Horses category
  • Can a big man ride a quarter horse
  • Horse that can hold a 300# rider

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    03-15-2013, 12:19 AM
  #51
Trained
I've debated a while before posting this, but here we go anyway, what 300 pounds actually looks like, posted purely for enlightenment and to give some 'substance' to the debate.

Here are 4 riders, all of them to my best knowledge are around the 300 pound mark. The vary from sat on this horse once and it felt bad, to love to ride this horse, to I ride and show and lastly I ride long trail rides often.

The horses range from 14.2hh Haflinger, 15hh Rocky Mountain, 15.2hh appy cross and 16hh QH.









All the horses are fit and well, to the best of my knowledge, so yes there is a lot to the thoughts and equations.
     
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    03-15-2013, 12:30 AM
  #52
Banned
BSMS, you said this:


It is normal for a horse to carry more weight on the forehand. That is what their bodies are built to do. Just IMHO.

And that ^^^ is true.......but not with a rider, that changes the whole theory......JMHO.
     
    03-15-2013, 01:12 AM
  #53
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsms    
I watched the whole video. It has nothing to do with longevity in a horse, or the ability to carry weight efficiently.
My friend owns a 25 year-old, 16.2 OTTB (built like thick WB) that she rescued about 4 years ago. He wasn't emaciated but had no muscle. It took about about 6 months before she could start riding him (she weighs about 300lbs and 5'10") because his back was sore. After a year of owning him she started taking him to low-level dressage shows (and placed). His back, however, despite the development in his top-line, began getting sore again (it was not a saddle fit issue either, she spent about $6000 on a custom fit saddle!).

But anyway, IMO stretching can improve the comfort level of the horse and the longevity, but only to a certain point. I think my friend's horse's back began to give out to her weight.

I'm not trying to make a point on either side of the debate, just throwing my 'experience' . . .


As bsms said, I think it just depends on what THE rider is planning on doing with their horse because in the end, our horses adjust to how WE ride...

I don't think my friend's horse could graduate on with the more advanced movements in dressage with my friend's weight. In a way her weight was hindering certain areas of muscle development. But she could take him on a long trail ride and be fine...
     
    03-15-2013, 01:15 AM
  #54
Yearling
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsms    
I watched the whole video. It has nothing to do with longevity in a horse, or the ability to carry weight efficiently.
Actually, I disagree. To first clarify, while I ride with a primarily dressage trainer, I don't ride "dressage". I ride English, as in, in an English saddle. The concepts bring taught (albeit, briefly) in this video are taught in nearly all disciplines of riding today. The point I was focused upon was that if the horse has effective musculature, (just like the runner, the martial artist, etc...) he can use his body more safely and more productively, & likely, for a longer period of time, as he can user his muscles to protect his bones, ligaments, tendons...what muscles are intended, on one level, to do. I'm pretty sure this is an observable point.

Folks may disagree regarding the length of time which it takes to get a horse to carry itself most effectively and build a very solid topline, but the overall point that HAVING SUCH makes the horse a more athletic creature isn't something I can see any reason to disagree about.

As well, muscular topline or no, a tiny horse cannot carry an enormous amount of weight safely or comfortably. This too, I see no point in debating. My points were essentially that a more athletic horse, trained to use his body properly, is going to have a generally easier time carrying any load comfortably....
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    03-15-2013, 01:31 AM
  #55
Yearling
Apologies for the double post (& the smartphone typos in my previous post!) but before I could be misunderstood, I wanted to say that I was not referring to 300#'s as "an enormous amount of weight", per se.

I was simply saying that ANY small, or weak, or malnourished, or improperly cared for (from feet to nutrition to lack of hydration to...) horse is not going to do well with any large amount of weight (& that includes packing around ITEMS, as well as humans!).

A smaller horse with minimal muscle or fitness, or one with any of the above issues to contend with is going to struggle with any act it is asked to comply with, and certainly, just like with human beings, as the task becomes more overwhelming (more speed, difficult weather, more weight, WHATEVER; that horse is going to struggle more than one which is better matched in every way to the task at hand!

Horses built to carry it were asked to cart around knights wearing full metal armor in the middle ages. It's POSSIBLE, it just has to be the right animal capable of doing the job!
     
    03-15-2013, 04:40 AM
  #56
Super Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Horse    
I've debated a while before posting this, but here we go anyway, what 300 pounds actually looks like, posted purely for enlightenment and to give some 'substance' to the debate.

Here are 4 riders, all of them to my best knowledge are around the 300 pound mark. The vary from sat on this horse once and it felt bad, to love to ride this horse, to I ride and show and lastly I ride long trail rides often.

The horses range from 14.2hh Haflinger, 15hh Rocky Mountain, 15.2hh appy cross and 16hh QH.









All the horses are fit and well, to the best of my knowledge, so yes there is a lot to the thoughts and equations.

Yes, and all of them are overloading the horses, even the haflinger. That weight on their backs is IMO too much and not something we should subject horses of their szie and shape too. Get bigger horses or smaller riders.
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    03-15-2013, 05:33 AM
  #57
Foal
I've seen this list of horse and rider combos before. The immediate thing I see is people in too small saddles. Along with saddle fit for the horse, the saddle needs to fit the rider too. I'm not going to comment really on if I think those people should be on those horse because A- I've seen them and the little backstories before, and B- one picture doesn't really say much. I could put one picture up of my horse and I, and you could say he's very unhappy, and another totally the opposite. Although, I like the last rider the best, probably because I like that saddle placement and fit the best out of the group, and they are moving, rather than posing standing still.
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    03-15-2013, 10:24 AM
  #58
Yearling
Rounding up is the weight carrying posture of the horse. If the rider cannot ask the horse to round up, the spinal column will sag over time causing a myriad of domino effect injuries, shortening the longevity and hindering the serviceable soundness of the horse.

This isn't collection, it isn't dressage. It is a basic riding principle. However, very few people concern themselves with this principle, unfortunately.

Horses are made up of tendons, ligaments, muscles, and bones. It isn't rocket science. These tissues can only take so much strain before they start to break down.

If you have a heavy rider that can support his/her own weight AND help the horse round up, that is infinitely more ideal than a heavy rider with dead weight that is simply a passenger.

So, go out there and learn how to round-up your horse that is in suitable condition and have fun.
     
    03-15-2013, 10:41 AM
  #59
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clava    
Yes, and all of them are overloading the horses, even the haflinger. That weight on their backs is IMO too much and not something we should subject horses of their szie and shape too. Get bigger horses or smaller riders.
What is strange about that one, you say even the Haflinger, well she is the one horse who was not happy with carrying a bigger person.The other 3 performed a lot better.
     
    03-15-2013, 11:25 AM
  #60
Trained
The four horses I've ridden enough to discuss intelligently max out at 900 lbs. My 180 lbs plus a 35 lb saddle gives the following percentages: 24, 25, 28, and 33. If Mia or Trooper have any trouble carrying me, they sure hide it well (24 & 25%). Lilly was very green broke when I rode her, but after 6-10 rides, she did fine...although I could sometimes feel her making adjustments for me when we did tight turns (28%). Cowboy can carry me, but he is adjusting his stride and particularly has to adjust in turns. At 33%, I'd say I'm too heavy for him for extended riding - but like a lot of ponies, he is structurally strong for his size. His legs are as big around as my larger horses, and he has a short back and broad loins for his height (13 hands). He shows no sign of strain when galloping with me, but we almost always use him as our third horse for trail rides - so I almost never ride him. Based on how he moves, I'd be concerned if I rode him regularly or long.

All of my horses are fairly slender. For western riders to reference, they use a 26 or 28" cinch, and I need a nylon latigo so I can loop it 3-4 times. For my Aussie-style saddle, I use a 30" girth, but I'll eventually replace it with a 28" - which is the next to smallest that DownUnder sells.

Based on that limited sample, I wouldn't worry too much at <25%. Above 25%, I'm going to want to think about it. After 30%. I'd want to watch carefully - can that specific horse, with his experience and conditioning and conformation, carry that specific rider? And WHY am I asking him to do so?

I think percentages give you a marker to say, "Whoa! Does this make sense?" Some may put that marker at 20%, which is fine.

Ponies will have higher percentages, but many ponies are built well for carrying a higher percentage. Arabians have a reputation for carrying heavy loads, but mine are both slender. I'd bet a 220-230 lb rider could sore Mia or Trooper, if they were not experienced riders using good fitting saddles. 30% for Mia would be 270 lbs (235 rider + 35 lb saddle). I'm pretty sure my tall, slender prima donna mare would protest...and I honestly wouldn't ever ask it of her. She is my biggest horse, but also seems to have the most sensitive back. She also has a strong preference for men over women, and would probably try a lot harder for a 220 lb guy than a 220 lb woman.

A lot of trail riding places set a 250 lb limit on riders, and some set it at 200 lbs. I can understand that. I am certain there are horses who can carry a 300 lb person just fine, but there are not a huge number of them.
     

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