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Dangerous Advice!

This is a discussion on Dangerous Advice! within the Horse Riding forums, part of the Riding Horses category

     
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        05-24-2011, 10:17 AM
      #21
    Banned
    Giving people the option is very different than saying 'if you were a real horseman you would not need one'.
         
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        05-24-2011, 01:48 PM
      #22
    Banned
    Yes, Fledge. I think you have it. They want to put out their vids, but they still want to look cool. Linda Parelli was thrown while jumping helmetless a year or so ago and was unconscious on the ground for a while. And I wear a helmet not only as a safety measure for myself but as a good example for my kids.
         
        05-24-2011, 05:21 PM
      #23
    Banned
    Yes, MHFoundation. That is another thing that puts me off about RG. I don't know if the dude's wife left him for the mailman or what, but he rails on women, one way or another, in nearly every vid now. Like I said, his early vids are great, and his philosophy on horses is great, but his ego is getting the better of him. He rants, he condescends, he tells women they had better have "their big girl panties on" to watch his videos, but then, like a coward, he blocks anyone who criticises him and even, on his website, encourages his followers to harrass a woman with whom he had a dispute, revealing her personal info. In the process.
         
        05-24-2011, 06:01 PM
      #24
    Trained
    FWIW (and I had never heard of this guy until this thread):

    "1. Between 1999-2002 there were 76 fatal injuries to youth under 20 years. The most frequent cause of death and serious injury is head injuries.
    2. Over 23,000 youth (under 20) are injured every year.
    3. The severity of equestrian injuries is greater than other sports-related injuries.
    4. Between 20% - 30% of the injuries are while dismounted while leading, grooming or playing around the horse and most of those are by being kicked.
    Let's bring this down to earth - what should we do about it?
    Here are a few points you can ponder:
    1. To wear or not to wear a hard shell helmet. With so many injuries and deaths caused by head trauma it can literally save your life. I know it's not sexy and all. But why do you think football players, motorcycle riders and race car drivers wear helmets? I do not wear a helmet unless working with a known bucker or troubled horse. My choice." - Rick Gore

    Horsemanship-Think Like a Horse-Rick Gore Horsemanship

    But he also writes this:

    "I love horses, but they are freaking DANGEROUS. Don't underestimate the gravity of this statement. They will kill themselves if they are scared and trapped, if they think they can get away. It is their nature. So people want to wear a plastic helmet and feel safe. A helmet will not stop your neck or back from getting broke. It will not stop you from breaking a hip or leg. It will not help keep you stay in the saddle or stop your from being dragged with a foot in the stirrup when you fall off. A helmet gives a "false since of security" and causes people to do things they would not normally do without a helmet, because they FEEL safe. This is bad when it comes to horses. A horse does not care if your head is protected or if you ride him in a Styrofoam body suit. If he gets nervous, scared or feels you are not in control and you are putting his safety in jeopardy, he will take charge and react. And when he does it will be with extreme force and strength and you and your safety will be of no consideration to him."

    Horsemanship-Think Like a Horse-Rick Gore Horsemanship

    Speaking for myself only, I have never said to myself, "Since I've got a helmet on, I'm safe!" I've had two falls, one with and one without a helmet, and on the one without I landed about 18 inches from rocks that would have killed or crippled me if I had landed there with either back or head. That was why I started wearing helmets. It would not have hurt, and it may have helped.

    When I had to get off Mia while moving a couple of months back, I was glad I had a helmet - but I needed to get off regardless. She was getting more agitated, not less, and staying on longer wasn't going to make things better. I didn't make the decision based on wearing a helmet, but I was sure glad I was - although I landed on my feet. (And as soon as Mia saw me, she came back and wanted me to take care of her...so why not while I was on her back? Oh well.)

    Anyone saying 'I wear a helmet, I am invincible!' would deserve what they get, but who says it?
         
        05-24-2011, 06:28 PM
      #25
    Showing
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DSJ46    
    I don't know if the dude's wife left him for the mailman or what, but he rails on women, one way or another, in nearly every vid now.
    She might have and if she hasn't maybe she should
         
        05-24-2011, 06:38 PM
      #26
    Banned
    BS MS His latest video certainly seems to be giving certain of his followers the idea that horse riding helmets are bad--perhaps because the video is called "Why Horse Riding Helmets Are Bad." (while you are on his website, see how he encourages the harrassment of the woman with whom he had a dispute) Watch the vid--the overall tone is anti-helmet (I think there's some anti-woman in there too), despite him half heartedly saying "I am not telling you not to wear a helmet..." a couple of times. (Overall tone often speaks louder than words.) Also see if there is anything on his site about charging a mounted horse at a horse rolling on the ground, like he does in his "One Rein Stop" video. In the end, I think the guy could have been a great video instructor. No matter what the guy has in the discipline of riding, he doesn't seem to have much in the way of self-discipline, and ego often overrides genius.
         
        05-24-2011, 06:57 PM
      #27
    Banned
    I love cars, but they are freaking DANGEROUS. Don't underestimate the gravity of this statement. They will crash if a tire blows, and some lighter ones have flipped simply from the wind getting under them. It is their nature. So people want to wear a cloth seat belt and feel safe. A seat belt will not stop a broken window from cutting your face up or a crushed piece of car metal going through your skull. It will not stop you from breaking a hip or leg. It will not help if the car flips and the roof caves into your head. A seat belt gives a "false since of security" and causes people to drive faster than they normally do without a seat belt, because they FEEL safe. This is bad when it comes to cars. A car does not care if your head is protected or if you ride in it in a Styrofoam body suit. If it flips, it will flip, and if it explodes, it will explode. And when it does it will be with extreme force and strength and you and your safety will be of no consideration to it.

    This is Gore's argument EXACTLY. Now, you tell me--HAVE I MADE A GOOD ARGUMENT AGAINST WEARING A SEATBELT OR MAKING A CHILD WEAR A SEATBELT??? Or is most of this argument simply based in the logical falacy of "begging the question"?

    AND WHAT ABOUT ACCIDENTS, ON HORSES AND IN CARS, THAT OCCUR DUE TO FREAK OF NATURE OR SOMEONE ELSE'S FAULT? Gore can not defend his position here! (and if you bring this up, or anything else he views as remotely critical, on youtube or on his site, you are blocked and mocked)
         
        05-24-2011, 07:25 PM
      #28
    Banned
    And just to keep this in mind, I am free choice...I don't believe the government should tell me when to wear a helmet, or a seatbelt, for that matter...but helmets, like seatbelts, clearly save lives and should be used
         
        05-24-2011, 07:44 PM
      #29
    Banned
    Wait...I have another one (and you can begin to see where the logic breaks down... Again, using Gore's riding logic and many of the words in the quote BSMS cited...)

    I love sex, but it is freaking DANGEROUS. Don't underestimate the gravity of this statement. Sex causes unwanted pregnancies and you can end up dead from certain diseases. It is the nature of sex. So people want to wear a latex condom and feel safe. A condom will not stop your wife from finding out you are cheating, and it will not protect you against the crabs. It will not stop you from breaking a hip or leg during particularly wild sex. It will not help if the condom itself breaks. A condom gives a "false since of security" and causes people to have sex more casually than they normally do without a condom, because they FEEL safe. This is bad when it comes to sex. Sex does not care if your head is protected or if you do in it in a Styrofoam body suit. (Yeah, that works!) If you have a heart attack during, you have a heart attack during, and if your wife finds out, your wife finds out. A condom will not help you. And when your wife does find out she will punish you with extreme force and strength and you and your safety will be of no consideration to her.

    Good argument for unprotected sex?

    The "logic" goes like this:

    Argument: "I don't want to do X."
    Counter argument: "But X will protect you against A."
    Argument: "But X will not protect you against B, C, D, E F... so it is not necessary."
    Bad logic. It still protects against A, and A, if it is a freak head injury, is a very important thing to protect against.
         
        05-24-2011, 07:54 PM
      #30
    Trained

    WOW! Just WOW!

    He says, "I think they do more damage than good...Here's why helmets are bad, people!" The studies I pointed out earlier indicate a 50% reduction in head injuries when helmets are used. Even if you aren't at high risk for a head injury, a 50% reduction is not bad.

    Yes, good riding skills are better than just wearing a piece of equipment, but you cannot learn to ride a horse without actually BEING on a horse. And no matter how much experience you have, can you guarantee you will not ever fall? That Ol' Bombproof doesn't have at least one explosion left in him?

    If someone wants to ride without a helmet, all they need to do for my satisfaction is say they understand and accept the risk. It is like jumping - that increases the risk even more, but folks can understand and accept that risk. But to say a helmet is worse than going without?

    "A bit causes pain and increases your chance of getting hurt, I think."

    Yeah, I guess that is why they have been in use for 3000 years. I couldn't stand to listen to the end. Now I need to find a way to wash off stupidity. I haven't lost so many brain cells in such a short time since I tried to watch the movie "Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea"!
         

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