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Jumping in western?

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  • Jumping western style
  • Western style jumping

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    04-26-2012, 10:53 PM
  #21
Weanling
Well, I'm seeing it as a battle I won't win. He was raised as a hunting horse, following elk around and such. He's also thick headed sometimes; to the point where there literally is no safe way to ride through a problem sometimes. But, I have aother thread out for advicce on buying a jumper. There's a lot more to that one, so you can read it.

But do y'all think that if I had a custom saddle built that's something at least similar to a western style with no horn, it'd be okay to do small stuff in?
     
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    04-26-2012, 10:54 PM
  #22
Showing
Please be careful, OP!

My horse didn't like western.. but recently we tried a western saddle on him and he was fine after a short while.

English saddles fit way differently than western saddles, which I am sure you know.

Have you tried finding/borrowing an english saddle that fits (with correct padding.. don't overpad!) and lunging him in that so he can get used to it.. then ride him w/t and eventually c and see how he does?

If he veers off funny.. it could be he's not used to the direct contact of your legs because there is a lot less leather between the horse and you. It could be the rider doesn't have balance in the saddle, and causes the horse to teeter off course. Or it could be his way of saying "This is new.. I'm going to see what I can get away with or what this feels like"

It could be anything.

But if you are going to jump, do so bareback. Western saddle jumping is very risky due to that horn. At least borrow an Aussie and you can jump with that no problem.


Stoddard, you could try an Aussie or endurance saddle.. or they have "troopers" that I'm not familiar with but are very similar to western minus the horn. But I'd still give the english saddle a go.. maybe have a saddle fitter bring a few demos to try on.
     
    04-26-2012, 11:01 PM
  #23
Weanling
I'm actually thinking of asking Nancy to have one of her Dressage pals to bring their measuring kit.
     
    04-27-2012, 04:24 AM
  #24
Foal
There is a correct way to jump in a western saddle. Obviously not for showing. But When I trail ride western and we come to logs that are down or anything else my horse decides he wants to jump, if you do it correctly, you don't get hurt. I agree with the other post about the Australian saddle or and endurance saddle without a horn. I have been training for a long time, just recently moved from 9 year of just outside of DC to where I am now. Your horse may like the wider tree if the Western saddle has QH bars. I read all your posts, and I am not trying to be a know it all, but I have never seen a horse that pitches a fit with an english saddle...unless it fits incorrectly, or doesn't like your position. Even if others have ridden in the english saddle he may not like the leg position or like others have said the saddle may not fit correctly. There are so many saddles out there these days, have you tried a treeless english saddle? What about dressage, just to see what he does. The main thing is fitting, no matter what the saddle is. An english saddle fits different on the withers, does he have any issues? Has a vet looked at that or his back?

Sorry to babble on and on, it is late and I got on a ramble. If you want him to be a jumper, I would not give up on the english saddles.

Good luck..
     
    04-27-2012, 06:11 AM
  #25
Banned
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoddard    
I'm actually thinking of asking Nancy to have one of her Dressage pals to bring their measuring kit.
That would be an excellent idea and would eliminate a lot of guesswork.

IDK how much you've read about english saddle fit so apologies if you know this already. But all english saddles are fit to a horse essentially the same way, regardless of what discipline they are for.

Here's a good primer on fitting them:
Points of Saddle Fitting
     
    04-27-2012, 12:29 PM
  #26
Green Broke
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoddard    
Well, I'm seeing it as a battle I won't win.
Then it wont be a battle you win. If you go into training a horse with that kind of attitude you might as well not even get on.

Sounds like the added leg pressure is what is bothering him. If it were me that horse would live in an english saddle till he got over it.
     
    04-27-2012, 12:37 PM
  #27
Green Broke
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoddard    
He's also thick headed sometimes; to the point where there literally is no safe way to ride through a problem sometimes.
There are alot of times when Im riding though a problem and its not safe at all. But how are you going to fix the problem if you don't face it head on? Challenges are what make people better riders. Its not supposed to be easy, if it was all horse trainers would be out of a job. You gotta ride though the rough patches, if you are scared of getting hurt then get a trainer to help you.

I can bet that one of the reasons why he is so "thick headed" is because no one has stuck with it and pushed him through his problems. Alot of horses with nasty attitudes have nasty attitudes because they get away with it being like that.
Walkamile likes this.
     
    04-27-2012, 12:41 PM
  #28
Banned
Quote:
Originally Posted by .Delete.    
If it were me that horse would live in an english saddle till he got over it.
That would be my choice too.
     
    04-27-2012, 01:37 PM
  #29
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by .Delete.    
Then it wont be a battle you win. If you go into training a horse with that kind of attitude you might as well not even get on.

Sounds like the added leg pressure is what is bothering him. If it were me that horse would live in an english saddle till he got over it.
If added leg pressure bothered him, wouldn't he have flipped some serious balls when I rode him bareback and had constant leg pressure on him so he wouldn't stop to graze? I mean, I'm pretty sure I used more leg barebacking him than I did in English. Not to say I wasn't using enough leg in English, it's just that it took consistent contact and pressure to make sure he kept moving, which isn't a problem I face with him very often.

I will be looking to the problem of whether there's a problem with his withers. If there's no fix in my sights, I'll suggest to Nancy that a vet or chiro look at his back to make sure something isn't up with that area of his back (although he's never expressed severe sensitivity in his back).

All of you may be completely right. At the same time, I could be right. I'm also personally the type of person who wants a horse who wants to do the job I'm asking him to do. I ride purely for fun, not for showing or money. I was hoping he'd take to English with flying colors, but Nancy has had him for months and his English hate hasn't been cured yet, so like I said, I don't know. I'll push this subject on him, but like I've said, if it seems like there's no cure, I'm not going to force him. I'll be needing a second horse in the future anyway, and Nancy has plenty of jumpers I can borrow until then when it comes to riding English (because I need that skill whether I jump Western, bareback, or upside-down).

I want to let you all know that I don't wish to come off as rude. I make myself seem like a jackass and I poke holes and argue to make sure the debate is worth the debate. Trust me guys, I don't just pick, prod, and go "ick." When I'm not on this forum, I'm piecing together all the advice given and constantly testing new ideas on my horse. So far we've progressed with each other really well and I'm so proud of him.
     
    04-27-2012, 01:47 PM
  #30
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by .Delete.    
There are alot of times when Im riding though a problem and its not safe at all. But how are you going to fix the problem if you don't face it head on? Challenges are what make people better riders. Its not supposed to be easy, if it was all horse trainers would be out of a job. You gotta ride though the rough patches, if you are scared of getting hurt then get a trainer to help you.

I can bet that one of the reasons why he is so "thick headed" is because no one has stuck with it and pushed him through his problems. Alot of horses with nasty attitudes have nasty attitudes because they get away with it being like that.
Nancy informed me (when I first started him) that he has severe leadership issues. I've also discovered he was a hunting horse (elk hunting). So, I can see where some of his problems are bubbling.

Butterscotch is a very interesting horse, and I think that's why I fell head over heals for him as a riding partner. He's an amazing trail horse. There are some bad moments and habits, but still very fun to ride. In the arena, no matter what saddle, he gets crabby. I've ridden him through his crabbiness in Western until he finally did what I wanted of him, then rewarded him by opening the gate and riding him around the ranch.

I'm still trying to form ideas around training him to trail alone, but Nancy has yet to let me try again. And the only reason I didn't ride it out last time is because of how narrow the path was, with electric fence on both side with horses behind them. Then, there was the "New" barn which has a lot of sharp farm equipment. I don't care about falling or getting hurt, I care about my horse falling and getting hurt. I really didn't feel like having him rear or spin out of control and flop over onto something that could end his life, or get tangled up in the wire and create a hazard for not just me, not just him, but for the other horses as well. And when it comes to facing problems in English, I usually ride him through whatever the problem is until I'm physically incapable of continuing. (I've been noticing I've been getting weird upper/lower abdominal cramps, and my back will start murdering me out of nowhere.)
     

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