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Should horse racing be banned?

11K views 53 replies 33 participants last post by  Foxhunter 
#1 ·
I'm under the opinion that it should be banned because of the countless unnecessary deaths it has cost to both rider and horse. Mainly horse.

I would like to discuss both sides and hear what other peoples opinions are.
 
#2 ·
Personally I don't think so, and I'm sure aubie would agree with me.

The industry has gotten a lot better about taken care of its horses, though there is still room for improvement. Some of these horses absolutely love what they do. You can see the light in their eyes when they're racing. Without a doubt they are born and bred athletes. I don't think the industry is perfect but also don't think it needs to disappear. Look around the forum and you'll find a lot of threads from race enthusiasts, regardless of what it's about, rather honoring a life or celebrating a victory. :)
 
#3 ·
If you'd like a well reasoned perspective on the highs and lows of the industry (particularly the breeding and after care sides), I'd highly recommend reading the blog A Yankee in Paris: https://ayankeeinparis.com

I'm a fan with no direct connection to the industry (though I have extended family who have been owners and trainers in both TB and STB racing, primarily around Saratoga Springs, NY). I wish US racing was medication free and that poorly conformed horses (or those who can't race without Lasix or other drugs) weren't rushed off to the breeding shed. Otherwise, I mourn the loss of horses and riders just like everyone else, but also recognize that all horse sports, professional or amateur, involve risk.
 
#4 ·
See it is all and well that the standard of care has improved but it doesn't stop the needless deaths.

At most I loathe the grand national, as I'm from the UK I know most of what goes on here not as much as what goes on in America.
In my opinion any life lost is a life too many regardless if it is horse or human.

I do not agree with using any animal as a way to entertain human greed. This is one subject I won't be swayed on.

I have a low tolerance of human beings, with personal things that have happened to me as I grew up and what I've learned about humans.

Animals should not suffer at the expense of a day out to the races. It is pure greed. But I do respect your opinion and thank you for sharing it.
 
#9 ·
Sure you can re-home them but like any animal you can re-introduce them to the wild. Horses are and were wild before humans had their way with them, Sure it is an awful large task but it's a better choice that selling them off to meat markets or dealers. So don't throw that card at me and be so narrow minded.
So, if you are so against using horses as a way to entertain humans, why are you on a horse forum where we all share out the love of riding/interacting with our horses? And returning them to the wild is laughable. Given the option, my mare would curl up in bed and sleep in my house. I know another that would have practically laughed at you if you thought you could turn him loose and "return him to the wild."

Honestly, you seem to have the view that horses should just be turned loose because you have this strange notion they'd be all super happy. What you're missing is the horses that practically vibrate with excitement to do their job. My mare is one of them.

I followed along well enough with you regarding the Grand National, and your worry about horse racing (though I'm not at all against horse racing, I just see how those not involved with the industry could question it.) But then to toss basically all horse owners under the bus? Yeah, I'm not sure how well that will fly on this forum.
 
#5 ·
Well, let's see. There are thousands of horses out there who have homes because they are show horses, are in training to be show horses (or substitute racing horses for show horses if you like), or have the potential to be show or race horses. Stop racing and where do they go? What will happen to them when they no longer have a function? How many will YOU take?
 
#6 ·
Dreamcatcher makes a good point ^^^

Also think about how many amazing show horses are OTTBs who once raced. If not for the programs that rehome them, so many that have found loving homes that give them care and a job to do would have gone to slaughter. Like she said, all the horses who have been bred to race, if they suddenly couldn't race, what would happen?

I've got a friend who owns an OTTB and another race-bred TB (she was bred to race but never did). Both have amazing homes with someone who cares for them. Both would be dead if not for this home, that is a fact based on their past, not an assumption.

I agree that some of what goes on in the racing industry is inexcusable, and respect the opinions of people who do not like racing though, as you also make good points.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Sure you can re-home them but like any animal you can re-introduce them to the wild. Horses are and were wild before humans had their way with them, Sure it is an awful large task but it's a better choice that selling them off to meat markets or dealers. So don't throw that card at me and be so narrow minded.
 
#8 · (Edited by Moderator)
These horses are DOMESTIC. You can't 'reintroduce' a domestic horse to the wild. Horses have been domesticated for thousands of years. Feral horses live typically short, brutal lives, and turning a domestic animal loose to fend for itself is the cruelest thing you can do. Slaughter would be kinder.

You have some very strange ideas about horses, especially considering you seem to know very little about them or the industry. I guess maybe that's typical of suburban people who have no clue what rural life is really like, and how livestock are cared for.

All sport horses have been specifically bred for their sports. These are not some mutts grabbed off the plains, that have been allowed to breed willy-nilly.
 
#10 · (Edited)
Agree with the above, and simply calling someone narrow minded without offering any evidence as to why you're right and they're wrong holds no ground with me. I'm happy to discuss but will not argue. I see no point in arguing online with someone you have never met.

Can't type more due to slow internet connection, but I'll suffice to say to each their own opinion.
 
#11 ·
Haha, You are extremely deluded and make too many assumptions about my life.

I live in one of the most rural parts of Scotland, I have studied agriculture for four years and again, I repeat myself I have been around horses most of my life. For love of god, stop making assumptions about my life just because I do not own a horse.

Not once have I attacked you on your opinion, I have respected it so again please respect mine.

Slaughtering horses would not be kinder. I do not agree with horse slaughter. That is another discussion in itself.

Regardless if the horse was domesticated, regardless if they've been domesticated for thousands of years. That is a humans doing and humans should do their best to take horses out of such dangerous things. I understand the wild is a cruel place. The whole world is a cruel place. But humans are the cruelest of all. You can easily have horses on a reserve or what please you.

It is apparent to me that our opinions clearly are polar opposites of each other, which is fine but do not go around thinking you are better than other people who have a different opinion to you it just makes you out to be ignorant and blind to alternatives for horses that would clearly be better for them.
 
#12 ·
I would like to discuss both sides and hear what other peoples opinions are.

I do not agree with using any animal as a way to entertain human greed. This is one subject I won't be swayed on.

Animals should not suffer at the expense of a day out to the races. It is pure greed.

Sure you can re-home them but like any animal you can re-introduce them to the wild. Horses are and were wild before humans had their way with them, Sure it is an awful large task but it's a better choice that selling them off to meat markets or dealers. So don't throw that card at me and be so narrow minded.
Do you really want to discuss, or do you want to get snarky with those who have different opinions?

I disagree that you can re-introduce any animal into the wild. Domesticated animals are not wild animals. Yes, humans have influenced their lives but it can often be for the better. They don't have to fight each other for food, or fight against predators.


I do not agree with using any animal as a way to entertain human greed.
What do you classify as "human greed"? Just horse racing? Or does it extend to ANY equestrian event?

Do you own any pets yourself?
 
#13 ·
I cannot find the link now but saw a fantastic article showing the fate of many wild horses after a few drought years in the central plains of the US. Most of the article and video were of ranchers showing the interviewer what wild horses really look like when nature is unkind. The pictures of dead foals and thirsty dieing horses was heartbreaking. And before we blame ranchers I would add that these horses were being fed and watered by the ranchers as well. They too had animals suffering. Ranchers can sell their stock in times when mother nature is unkind. Wild animals suffer and die agonizing slow deaths.

I used to cringe watching steeple chasing on CBS sports when I was young. Still not a fan but I understand that there are those that love the sport - as well as horse racing and cart racing. As others have said show horses, rodeo horses and even some back yard horses also suffer due to how they are ridden how they are cared for etc.
 
#14 ·
Definitely can't re-introduce a domestic horse into the wild.
If I threw Redz into the wild...he'd die, no doubt. Wouldn't be able to survive. He was never in the 'wild', so he would not know how to take care of himself. LOL, he'd run back home as fast as he can. :rofl:

Same with my guinea pigs. If I threw them outside...they'd die. Not how it works.

It does not work that way, and it is not that simple.

But no, I do not think it should be banned. I personally do not watch it, I am not into it.
I believe in ANY industry (any discipline, any sport regarding horses, etc.) there are good and bad people. Yes, some are mistreated. Same with some jumpers, etc.
But not all of them are.

You should look up the Retired Racehorse Project. :) To give you some insight, those horses get a second chance and it's pretty amazing to read up on the stories. Not every horse that was raced was neglected though, that is untrue.

And nobody is bashing you for not owning a horse.
You don't have to own a horse (or even ride!) to realize that is NOT how things work. :lol:
 
#15 ·
I do want to discuss it, I do apologise if what I said came across as snarky, it was unintentional.

Like I said I have a low opinion of humans. But that is a different story. You can say that about any wild animal anywhere, but that is life for them I guess and yes that is a point can be used against me but it is the truth.

I have the same opinion for any animal that is used for human entertainment, zoos, racing, dog racing etc etc. My opinion applies to anything that involves animals for human greed and the animals suffer.
Though a grey area for me is showing your horse, not dressage, show jumping or cross country. Just showing your horse and taking pride and joy in the your life. It is a grey area because I don't know much about therefore I cannot make an opinion that isn't biased or false.

And yes I do own pets, 4 cats and a dog but other animals have passed away recently due to old age, but I have looked after a horse while her owner was away in Spain for a few months.
 
#21 ·
Sure you can re-home them but like any animal you can re-introduce them to the wild.

And yes I do own pets, 4 cats and a dog
So if you took your 4 cats and your dog and put them in the wild tomorrow ...... do you think they would survive?

I know that my dog would not.
My parents' farm cats might be okay simply because they know how to hunt for food, by my mother-in-law's cat would be doomed (she is a lazy house cat that does not know how to hunt).

I strongly disagree with you that any animal can be re-introduced into the wild. That is false. And the same goes for domesticated horses that have homes. They cannot simply be put back into the wild and be expected to thrive and survive.

I have the same opinion for any animal that is used for human entertainment, zoos, racing, dog racing etc etc.

My opinion applies to anything that involves animals for human greed and the animals suffer.
How do you believe that animals suffer in a zoo?

I see it as
1) they do not have to worry about predators or being attacked
2) they do not have to fight for food
3) they do not have to worry about drought, flood, fire, or other environmental disasters

Honestly, I think the animals who are in the zoo are pretty lucky compared to one that has to fight to survive in the wild. I certainly do not think they are suffering.


Going back to your original thread question "Should horse racing be banned?" ... no, I do not think it should be banned. Sure, there are certain things I would like to change about it. Firstly, I don't like how young the horses are when they are raced. I think they should be older and let their bodies mature. Secondly, I think we need to continue to be strict against people who are trying to "sneak" drugs and medications into horses that are banned.

But the actual horse racing itself? For the horses that truly love to run, and for the trainers and owners who take impeccable care of them .... why, let them run their race. :gallop:
 
#18 ·
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#19 · (Edited)
To the OP:


I would like to ask why you started this thread? Are you writing a research paper or is your intention to re-educate the equine community? I ask because I find it odd that an new horse person would join a horseforum and start a thread like this. Now, don't get me wrong. You are more than welcome to join our community, in fact we encourage it. However, I feel like it's important to understand your topic so that we can better form our responses. You may also want to share some stats and personal experiences to explain your stance.
 
#22 ·
If we banned a competitive sport, there will still be a desire for that sport. People will still race horses covertly. People with go to other countries and race there.

Without a regulatory body like what is present in the current racing industry, there can be no oversight, enforcement of rules, welfare policies, no vets required. Any and all drugs could be used, abusive training. The people who would be participating in raving would end up being the kind of people who are already OK with breaking the law to get their kicks.

If racing was shut down tomorrow, where will those horses go? One big long convoy to the slaughter house? Set them free? On what land? Even in the States and Canada where there is lots of uninhabited land, you cannot house all of the track horses there. The amount of arable land cannot support herds that big. Plus they will become pests to farms in the area and will get themselves shot.

Northern Canada is basically empty, we can put them there. Except it is all boreal forest and permafrost up there. A herd of Shetlands could survive, but not TBs. They need too many calories, have too poor of coats, and not enough self preservation.

Then what when these horses start breeding?

What about any natural disasters, hard seasons, disease outbreaks? Is it worse to have 0.75% of starts die, vs thousands that would die to the elements?

Even the slaughter house. It is worse to have an animal experience 2-3 days of stress then have it cleanly ended. Compared to starving over a hard season, getting just enough food to keep them alive, water is scarce, then they meet their end to a pack of wolves who slowly kill after having chased the horse to exhaustion?
 
#27 ·
Just where in the UK would it be feasible to release ex racehorses into the wild?

You say that you have studied agriculture for four years so you should know that land and stock has to be managed.

You have no clue as to how these horses are cared for when in training nor just how much money the racing industry puts into equine research which benefits all horses not just racehorses.

Yes, horses do die racing, horses also die when not racing.

Euthanasia for equines in the U.K. is very tightly run, it is humane and quick.
 
#29 ·
No....horse racing should not be banned....because, once you ban something it becomes much easier to ban the next thing, and where does it end?

Competitive horse shows? Dressage? Rolex? etc?

Face it, horses are pretty much obsolete in that they no longer have much purpose other than for the enjoyment and entertainment of their owners.

I realize there are some communities and cultures who still work their horses, but for the most part, a beast of burden has been replaced by mechanical machines....

Horses are still relevant to a large extent because of racing and other competitive ventures IMO.
 
#32 ·
While i don't think it should be banned, I do think that very strict rules should be applied to it, such as tests for drugs, maybe banning or using better whips and maybe something like not allowing for horses with signs of abuse to race. But I really don't know much about this topic this reply shouldn't be taken too seriously. I have myself been to one horse race in Lexington and I think the sport itself is beautiful and test amazing limits, but it has become seriously abusive and cruel.
 
#35 ·
I'm under the opinion that it should be banned because of the countless unnecessary deaths it has cost to both rider and horse. Mainly horse.

I would like to discuss both sides and hear what other peoples opinions are.
For what you appear to be looking at you really needed to word your question differently. It's a bit like saying should drinking wine be banned.

Reason being is that not all racing is created equally. From what I've seen the question you're looking for is should modern flat track racing (TB and other futurities) be banned. You'll get the same host of replies :D, but I'll explain why it's important to ask this sort of question as specifically as possible.

No, racing should not be banned. There are very well managed, horse conscious races. Endurance racing, in general, is pretty responsible (horse must be at least 60 months old, etc....). Horse racing can be done in a manner that is not so detrimental for the horse.

Yes, I feel modern flat track racing should be banned, but only because what it evolved into. Flat track racing today (or even for the past 100 years) is not about the speed of the horse. If it were about the speed they'd be racing 7 and 8 year olds. A 7 year old stallion that was trained conditioned for racing after it's body was properly mature enough for each stage will leave a 3 or 4 year old colt in the dust. Once upon a time there were raced at the older age and even TB races were longer (by miles). Once upon a time they didn't dump 5,000+ TB (that's from the TB racing industry alone) on the market every year with many of them suffering from physical problems caused by being ridden and raced too soon in their development (e.g. racing before even the leg bones have finished maturing, let along the back and rest of the skeleton and joints). This doesn't make racing bad. It just means the industry doesn't "really" care about the horse beyond it's value for winning and subsequently breeding (if it's a proven winner). It's an industry. It's about $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. The longer you wait to race the horse the longer you have to feed and care for it before finding out if it's even going to make you any money. The sooner you race it the sooner it can start paying for it's upkeep.....or get dumped, because it's a looser (so you don't waste more money on it). Always remember that it's a business and it's about making money. So if you can race for 3 or 4 years and win most of them and have a colt that you can charge a heft stud fee on then you've hit the racing jackpot. Of course then there's the issue of them using them for stud to early too, but that's a different topic (and they've developed rehab for that too). Now there are also successful fillies out there who make big money too. Just can't breed them as much and sort of limited to the number of foals you'll be able to sell out of them. Ruffian comes to mind (a contemporary of Secretariat), but her carrier (and life) ended after her breaking her sesamoids in that match race where she was proving that she could out run the colt who won Derby that year (Foolish Pleasure I believe), but she didn't get to finish the race. Of course she had already survived one broken bone that had healed up (the year before I think). Goes to show that they'll do whatever they can to keep a proven winner running. Bigger and or more numerous the wins, the bigger the pay off at the end. Imagine the money to be made on a foal out of her sired by Secretariat.

No, racing isn't bad, but the racing industry is not good for horses. It's a business and the horses are just a commodity used to make money. The way flat track racing is done today should be banned, but racing should be allowed with horses trained when the physical development of the horse allows for each level of training, conditioning and preparation. Racing 7 year old horses, who were started under saddle at 5 are not going to result in the kind and number problems you see today. But then I know people who start riding their horses at 2 years old which is years before they're ready. However, they have the big animal and it "looks" ready, and other people do it, and they don't want to wait all those years (and of course they don't know the actual development process for the equine skeleton and joints) so....they saddle up and ride, because they don't know any better (I prefer not to say they don't care, because I always like to think that they would if they knew.....but then I do sometimes hear them make arguments and excuses to excuse or justify it when they're informed) :D

But look at the bright side. With the many thousands of OTTB's dumbed out there for people who want cheap (or free) horses....added to the unwanted show horses, backyard horses, other racing industry horses (QH, etc...) no one should ever have problem finding a horse. Of course most of the horses end up having a problem finding home. The TB racing industry alone puts 50,000 animals on the market per decade. There's never going to be enough people to take them all. Not to mention that the racing TB are not bred to be physically hardy animals like they were hundreds of years ago. e.g. their bones are not has heavy...remember it's about speed and weight slows you down so lighter bones are better (unless you're not racing on a flat track).

As the those with the "feral" horse ideas. In fact, a horse will revert to a feral state relatively easily in an area with terrain that will support them. How do you think so many feral bands started to begin with (Crackers in FL, March Tacky in SC -although none currently exist in the wild, I remember when they did...and other associated horses now living on a couple of islands in VA and NC, Mustangs throughout most of the western states, Brumbies in Australia). If they have food they generally manage. And if they can find another horse (or more) they'll manage pretty happily. The problem isn't their ability to go feral. The problem is a place to live. Development will prevent them. They're not like cats or pigs. They're LARGE and move over a greater area. Grazing as they go. Human population density and development most areas make it impossible for horses to manage. At least in the eastern half of the US. That's what the few left from the earlier feral horses are restricted to islands where there are managed and protected.

:D Hope that answered your question and explained why.
 
#36 ·
If you don't want to see horses available to anyone but the wealthy, ban racing. Anytime you ban something that promotes using horses, this is where it is going to lead. Less horses bred to do something, less forage grown, less land needed to keep said horses and forage, it's a slippery slope. Look beyond your own nose.
 
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