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Throwing head around in halt

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  • Horse opening mouth and throwing head around

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    01-05-2012, 01:50 PM
  #11
Foal
Ok I'll ask about them. The lesson horses seem to mainly respond to the reins though, if I try to use my legs to control the direction, they just think I want them to go faster. They also will only slow down when I am pulling on the reins a lot, and that is what I get told to do. I keep getting told that I won't hurt the horses by heaving on the reins, but it can hurt them, can't it?

And will any of this stop him from throwing his head around? Or should I just let him have all of the rein?
     
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    01-05-2012, 02:47 PM
  #12
Super Moderator
Vergo,
I know that you are dealing with a lesson horse, and as such he might not be very responsive. Probaby has a mouth of steel.

Here's my thoughts on the halt and on him walking off.
At the halt, like when you are waiting for your turn in the group lesson, give him so much rein that there is some loop in it, so there is NO pull on his mouth. HOWEVER, put your hands on his wither (in fists , 'cause you're holding the rein tightly) on each side of the wither . If the horse barges down to try and rip the rein out of your hand, you will have such a firm grip that he will hit the bit and decide to "bounce" off of that bit and come back to where the rein is loose. Just be sure that he does have plenty of loose as long as he keeps his head in a natural, relaxed position, but is NOT barging down (pigrooting).

If the horse starts to walk off toward the others who are in the middle of the arena, you take up one rein and turn him in a very tight circle a couple of times, then let him out when he is facing the way you want him to be. Again, you have to be able to lengthen and shorten your reins, quickly and adroitly. YOu can actually practice holding reins when off horse. Get yourself a practice pair, tie to a chair and pretend away!

I know you are in group lessons and read your other thread about wanting to start dressage soon. I think that spending some more time learning to be ok on the back of the horse, and deal with some of these less fun issues will untilmately make you a stronger, better rider.
Good luck!
Skyseternalangel likes this.
     
    01-05-2012, 03:22 PM
  #13
Trained
I would not discuss but DEMAND a different horse. It is your safety!! I taught (with my own horses) for 10 years, so I know the fearful student and the fearless student, and YOU have a legitimate complaint. It's different when the stable provides the horses, but it's a business, all the same. The owner of this horse (Stable?) NEEDS to get the problem fixed bc I'm sure you are not the only student who is unnerved by this. Maybe if it costs them some $ they'll fix or replace this horse in their lesson program. Also, some lesson horses at some stables with lessons are animals being re-trained through the lessons. THIS is unacceptable, if it is the case. After all, you are not abusing this horse, so YOU don't need to be sensitive about his problem. If you are hurt by this horse it will take you months to heal up. My broken arm took 6 months before I could return to normal riding/training.
     
    01-05-2012, 04:14 PM
  #14
Foal
I've tried going on different horses and Charlie is the best one. He has bad manners on the ground, but is ok once i'm on the saddle. Other horses at the stable have bucked me off, gone way too fast, bitten me ( a rescue horse that was "sensitive"), not let me get on them.... A lot of the horses have far worse problems than Charlie does.

This is the only issue Charlie has once I'm on him, I wouldn't want to risk being moved onto another horse. Also, I like big horses and there aren't many big horses there, especially now they are selling the other horse that is a simular horse to Charlie because she kicks in the stable and bites. I wouldn't want to end up on a horse a few hands smaller than him.
     
    01-05-2012, 04:19 PM
  #15
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by vergo97    
I've tried going on different horses and Charlie is the best one. He has bad manners on the ground, but is ok once i'm on the saddle. Other horses at the stable have bucked me off, gone way too fast, bitten me ( a rescue horse that was "sensitive"), not let me get on them.... A lot of the horses have far worse problems than Charlie does.
Did you READ what you just wrote?!?
When I took lessons as a teenager none of the lesson horses mishaved like these do. When I taught lessons, my horses never mishaved like this either. I believe you should find a better place to ride.
     
    01-05-2012, 04:27 PM
  #16
Green Broke
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corporal    
I would not discuss but DEMAND a different horse. It is your safety!! I taught (with my own horses) for 10 years, so I know the fearful student and the fearless student, and YOU have a legitimate complaint. It's different when the stable provides the horses, but it's a business, all the same. The owner of this horse (Stable?) NEEDS to get the problem fixed bc I'm sure you are not the only student who is unnerved by this. Maybe if it costs them some $ they'll fix or replace this horse in their lesson program. Also, some lesson horses at some stables with lessons are animals being re-trained through the lessons. THIS is unacceptable, if it is the case. After all, you are not abusing this horse, so YOU don't need to be sensitive about his problem. If you are hurt by this horse it will take you months to heal up. My broken arm took 6 months before I could return to normal riding/training.

Unfortunately a lot of riding schools don't have the time, or the people to get on these ponies and re-educate them, for kids that learn and may pull, bump or whack a bit too much.

It may be irresponsible, and I would suggest the horse has a martingale on (most riding schools do anyway, so riders have a sort of 'neck' strap to hold on to) as well as the excellent advise already given.

OR you can ask the instructor WHY he does it, and ask how to stop it, or it may be learnt behaviour.
     
    01-05-2012, 04:37 PM
  #17
Weanling
My mare does both of those things from time to time. Of course it is a pretty picture when the horse stands still and very nice, but a horse is a horse and he could just as easily be playing with his bit and stretching his neck or back. It could also be that he is used to being given a loose rein when asked to halt because he was taught that is the reward and is confused as to what you're asking of him.

I do agree with earlier statements about being confident riding/allowing your horse to have a loose rein. The loose rein is a reward for a horse and a sign of relax...we always ride our horses home on a loose rein as it symbolizes cool down, relax and just be calm. But in order for the hrose to relax, you need to relax too. :) goodluck!
     
    01-05-2012, 04:46 PM
  #18
Showing
Quote:
Originally Posted by vergo97    
This is the only issue Charlie has once I'm on him, I wouldn't want to risk being moved onto another horse. Also, I like big horses and there aren't many big horses there, especially now they are selling the other horse that is a simular horse to Charlie because she kicks in the stable and bites. I wouldn't want to end up on a horse a few hands smaller than him.
But make sure you start out with soft contact (and sitting really deep) and then take a little more until he slows down (release to let him know that was a good idea!) and then start taking some more until he stops then well maybe once he stops, give him a huuuge release and a nice rub down.

I think you're doing well with what you are given.. a horse with no sensitivity anymore and no body mechanics training other than hands.

But honestly.. I would learn as much as you can possibly learn, and then look into partially leasing a horse that you can work with your body on. Your body is soooooooo much more important than just hands.

Good luck either way :) The advice tinyliny gave you is very good for a horse that plows through your cues!
     
    01-05-2012, 06:19 PM
  #19
Foal
I don't think they can re-train the horses because they have little money and not that many people work there. They tend to try to train them not to do things in lessons.

I don't think he does it to stretch, it is an insistant tugging and it stops as soon as I let go of the reins. I asked my instructor what I should do when he does it, and she said let go of the reins.

I'm not allowed to give soft contact, I am told to tighten up my reins a lot, more than I think I should, when I go into trot and even more when going into canter (probably because the faster he goes, the harder it is to slow him down). Once when I was trying to slow him down I relased a bit and I got told not to do that until he has done completely what I want him to do (like if i'm going from trot to walk, I should only release a bit when he has gone to walk, not if he slows down in trot a bit)

But to he honest, I haven't really been taught about release as a reward. All I am told it to tighten up my reins. I only learnt about release from this forum.

I would really like to lease, but I can't afford to do that and take lessons, and I think lessons are more important (and I wouldn't want to mess up a good horse!).

Thank you TinyLiny for the advice!

I have thought about moving stables, but my mum isn't too sure on it yet. If my stables don't become better (move me too a group more my age, help me out a bit more..) then we might move.
     
    01-05-2012, 06:23 PM
  #20
Showing
Unfortunately, from what you've said, your instructor has been enforcing this behavior in the horse for quite some time. Whenever he pulls and you throw him the slack in the reins, that is effectively teaching him to brace on the bit and pull constantly. So, that makes him harder to collect, harder to stop, and harder to control. It would likely take an experienced trainer and quite a long time to correct this behavior. BUT, even if it was corrected by a trainer, unless your instructor changed her teaching methods, the same problem would come right back.
     

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