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Western Dressage - Thoughts ?

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        11-28-2012, 02:37 PM
      #311
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    All the arguments here started when some people said it can't be called dressage , can't be judged like dressage by dressage judges and can't be done in their dressage arena.
    We now, hopefully, agree that lower level dressage IS dressage, that nobody wants to take anything away from upper level dressage riders.
    And a warmblood has a chance in WD as long as it can perform the western working gaits jog and lope, not only trot and canter. I wouldn't go as far as saying it would win automatically.
    "working jog" and "working lope" are essentially the same as our working trot and canter. In the rules it states something about "to the horse's ability" I think. But anyways, as the WDAA representative doing the clinic in my area put it to the judges "It should be judged the exact same as a normal dressage test". Too slow/unrhythmical is penalized, head too low is penalized, behind the bit is penalized, shuffling gaits are penalized, etc..

    WDAA uses USDF judges. It is judged like a dressage test. Honestly the outcome will be the exact same as a normal dressage class and eventually people with non-traditional dressage breeds will be complaining again how their horses are beat by the elitist snobs on horses bred for dressage, just now it's in different tack. As was suggested in a previous WD thread, it would be far more "WD" like to have a western gaming event, like pole bending or barrels, and then go do your dressage test and the combined score determines placing. Like in eventing.
         
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        11-28-2012, 02:38 PM
      #312
    Weanling
    Cows do dressage....This was my husband riding Rodney our prize bull. Now tell me his conformation is all wrong and he isn't doing it right. In fact I'll send old Rodders round and you can tell him yourself....
    franknbeans likes this.
         
        11-28-2012, 02:41 PM
      #313
    Weanling
    Here is my dressage contender! He's called Rodney and anyone who tells me his conformation is wrong...I'll send Rodders round and you can tell him yourself.
    Schweppes Bull - YouTube
         
        11-28-2012, 02:42 PM
      #314
    Super Moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ~*~anebel~*~    
    QHs of certain lines are prone to far more deadly diseases, Drafts to EPSM, grey horses to cancer, etc...

    Your point?
    That their ability to deal with the strains of high level dressage might not be any better than another breed
    What they do have is a natural length of stride and elevation that at higher levels make it so much easier for the rider to get results but not essentially any less strain on their joints especially in the ones that are pushed on too fast as young horses simply because it does appear to be more natural for them.
    You must know yourself that when you go from riding another less elevated breed to a warmblood the difference at first is quite amazing
         
        11-28-2012, 02:43 PM
      #315
    Banned
    Had to quote this:

    'Of course, there's a certain type of person who feels that anything which becomes mainstream has to be rejected immediately. And that's part of the snobbery, hierarchy and elitism.'
    Author unknown

    Makes sense.....
    ~*~anebel~*~ likes this.
         
        11-28-2012, 02:43 PM
      #316
    Trained

    Here's my Clydesdales having a snowball fight - aren't they cute!! The small ones are Burt, Jack, Jane and Curtis and the big ones are Kid, Buck and Josie.
         
        11-28-2012, 02:45 PM
      #317
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ~*~anebel~*~    
    "working jog" and "working lope" are essentially the same as our working trot and canter. In the rules it states something about "to the horse's ability" I think. But anyways, as the WDAA representative doing the clinic in my area put it to the judges "It should be judged the exact same as a normal dressage test". Too slow/unrhythmical is penalized, head too low is penalized, behind the bit is penalized, shuffling gaits are penalized, etc..

    WDAA uses USDF judges. It is judged like a dressage test. Honestly the outcome will be the exact same as a normal dressage class and eventually people with non-traditional dressage breeds will be complaining again how their horses are beat by the elitist snobs on horses bred for dressage, just now it's in different tack. As was suggested in a previous WD thread, it would be far more "WD" like to have a western gaming event, like pole bending or barrels, and then go do your dressage test and the combined score determines placing. Like in eventing.
    No.....let's just have have WD for Western horses......that way it won't be a ribbon sweep for you....as you seem to think that's what will happen....
         
        11-28-2012, 02:48 PM
      #318
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jaydee    
    That their ability to deal with the strains of high level dressage might not be any better than another breed
    What they do have is a natural length of stride and elevation that at higher levels make it so much easier for the rider to get results but not essentially any less strain on their joints especially in the ones that are pushed on too fast as young horses simply because it does appear to be more natural for them.
    You must know yourself that when you go from riding another less elevated breed to a warmblood the difference at first is quite amazing
    So because a higher fraction of WBs develop a bone disease then the whole breed group is crap??
    Horses with OCD are usually field ponies. The ones with OCD are not the ones you see at the Olympics.

    QHs fall over dead from HYPP?? Oh quick all of them are crap for reining.
    EPSM kills Draft horses? Oh no they must all be terrible at pulling things!

    It is basic geometry and physics. A horse who is biomechanically able to easily perform a movement will find less strain with it then a horse who is not. Of course we still need to properly condition the horse, that's why I said "two things break down horses, bad conformation and bad training".
    Get a well conformed horse with good training and then you get a Bonfire that is still winning at international levels at the age of 18.
    paintsrule, Kayty and core like this.
         
        11-28-2012, 02:49 PM
      #319
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deserthorsewoman    
    All the arguments here started when some people said it can't be called dressage , can't be judged like dressage by dressage judges and can't be done in their dressage arena.
    We now, hopefully, agree that lower level dressage IS dressage, that nobody wants to take anything away from upper level dressage riders.
    And a warmblood has a chance in WD as long as it can perform the western working gaits jog and lope, not only trot and canter. I wouldn't go as far as saying it would win automatically.
    I didn't say they couldn't use dressage everything (I'm assuming me since I posted the replies listing all the dressage specific stuff WD uses). I was saying that they need to adhere to the principles and concepts of dressage if they want to do dressage (in any tack they want). Current examples of WD do not show the basics of dressage training. That was all I was trying to say. Not that they couldn't in time create a broader understanding of the basics of dressage training and apply it correctly to a western horse if the rider so chooses. I just wish WDA would remove the slower gaits so the horse could be allowed to move out freely.
    Posted via Mobile Device
         
        11-28-2012, 02:51 PM
      #320
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Muppetgirl    
    No.....let's just have have WD for Western horses......that way it won't be a ribbon sweep for you....as you seem to think that's what will happen....
    Define "western horses".

    What happens when you tell all the arabian people they can't put western tack on their horses, or draft people, or gaited horse breeds??

    Anyone is apt to put whatever tack they want on their horse and go compete in whatever they want. It is the subjectivity of the judges that decides who will win. If dressage judges are used for WD and told "judge it exactly like a dressage test" it's no small wonder what is going to happen..
         

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