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Bit Information (Snaffle and English-Type Bits)

133K views 286 replies 97 participants last post by  Horsebitsgalore 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
English/Snaffle-Type Bit Information

Non-Port Mouthpieces

Mullen Mouth

This bit is especially mild, as it has no breaking points within the mouth. It is great for a horse with a low palate that cannot accommodate excessive bulk within the mouth. Its disadvantage is that it can have a very unrefined signal to the horse, as there are no independent sides to work off of.

Single Joint

A fairly mild mouthpiece with very slight independent action. Usually horses with low or shallow palates are going to be irritated by this mouthpiece. When put in action, the mouthpiece breaks at the single joint, flexing upwards into the palate and downwards onto the horse’s lips. Some horses do not like this type of contact, as it is quite sharp and can pinch at the horse’s tongue.

French Link

A very mild bit that has two joints. Having two joints eliminates the crackerjack action on the tongue, eliminates upward flexion, and has a more “full mouth” feel to it. This type of bit works well on horses with all varieties of palate heights. A favourite of many horses.

Berry/Oval/etc Mouth

Same “full mouth” feel that so many horses like so much. The shape and size of the link influences the breakover point on the tongue; the shorter the link, the more “single joint feel” you are going to have. Some horses prefer a longer breakover point/link, some a shorter link.

Sprenger mouthpiece

A very nice mild mouthpiece. This is a double joint bit, similar to an oval link, except that the center piece is rotated 45 degrees to the rest of the mouthpiece. Sprenger claims that this gives the bit a more anatomical bend to the bit so it sits nicer in the horse’s mouth.

Myler/ Billy Allen

Very nice mild mouthpiece. The barrel serves two functions: an anatomical curve without allowing the bit to collapse inwards, and independent side action. This bit cannot have a crackerjack action, as it does not collapse. The independent side action is common to all double joint bits, bit seems to be more refined in this mouthpiece. Really a nice, nice mouthpiece.

Dr. Bristol

Long, flat, angled double joint bit. A true Dr. Bristol will have the center link at a 45 degree angle to the rest of the mouthpiece. This angle and length of center piece makes the bit slightly more harsh than other double joint bits. It is designed for lots of tongue contact and pressure. I would recommend this only be used by an experienced rider.

Waterford

The ultimate in “full mouth feel.” This bit collapses at every link so you get direct contact on the horse’s entire mouth. Since it has so many links, horses with a shallow palate shouldn’t have a problem carrying this bit. The bit collapses at each link, so the idea is that the horse cannot grab onto the bit and take it too much in its mouth, as the side will just collapse under pressure. A con to this bit is that some horses really dislike a “full mouth” feel.

Icky Mouthpieces
(mouthpieces I think should require a test in skill before being sold to anyone)

Slow Twist

All the lovely advantages of a single joint (nutcracker action, palate protrusion) with the added bonus of a twist to the mouthpiece. The twist makes this bit more harsh, as the raised edges are rough on the horse’s lips.

Corkscrew

Like the slow twist, but with more raised edges, this bit is quite harsh. The raised edges irritate and hurt the horse’s lips.

Single Twisted Wire

Even harsher than the slow twist, it uses pain to get the horse to “pay attention.” The single joint crackerjacks on the tongue, the twist irritates and hurts the lips.

“I will hunt you down and torture you if you use these” Mouthpieces

Chain

This bit acts much like the Waterford in action, but the slim chain and roughness of the links makes it a harsh bit. Mostly seen in western events.

Double Twisted Offset Wire

This bit is very very harsh. You have two different mouthpieces protruding up into the palate at once, they both crackerjack on the tongue in different places, then two wires irritate and hurt the horse’s lips to “make it listen.”

Woodscrew

Very very very harsh, it utilizes pain to get the horse to yield to the rider’s will. If you have ever gripped a screw tight with your hand, you can appreciate the pain; imagine that against your lips.

Bike Chain/ Mule bit

Works off of nothing but pain for the horse. I had to mention this bit to make sure nobody mistakes it for a nice bit, ever.
 
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#171 ·
thank you for such a great thread - my boy is fresh ott and although i have chosen an egg butt snaffle with single joint- the only thing that i find with it is that he tends to chomp when i first put it in his mouth but after about 5 mins he settles. He is very responsive on it (from the ground) and it does seem to make things easier for him to understand - simple straighjt forward thread thank you :)
 
#174 ·
hi this is my first post so forgive me if i am in the wrong place, i would like some help regarding a bit i have bought. It is an ozbits Campdraft bit and i have bought it because the actual bit is the same as the bit i have always used but it has side pieces to stop it going thru the horses mouth.I didnt want to go to a tom thumb and i did like the look of this one, but now i have it i am a little confused as to how to attach it to the bridle i dont want to put it upside down and after considering a few options on where i think the cheek pieces and the reins go i wondered if someone could offer advice. Thankyou
 
#180 ·
Technically it should not be called a curb strap but a chin strap. It has no action on the bit bar preventing it from sliding through the horses mouth.

A curb strap acts as a fulcrum to allow the pressure of the bit in the mouth to increase and poll pressure to be generated.
 
#185 ·
OK - I found the answer from JulieGoodnight on this subject - thanks everyone.

There are many excellent questions that you pose and I applaud your efforts in trying to get things right for the safety of your riders and for the welfare of the horses you influence. First, let me address the use of the curb strap with the snaffle bit. You are right that the curb strap will only come into play on a leverage bit; on the snaffle (direct pressure bit) the curb strap will never engage. This does tends to break down along English and Western lines because English riders think it is absurd to have a curb strap on a snaffle because it seemingly serves no purpose on the snaffle, since there is no 'curbing' action.

From the Western point of view, the snaffle is a tool that is only used on young, green horses; once the horses mature and are more 'finished' in its training you use a curb bit (which is better for one-handed riding).Those finished horses are referred to as 'bridle horses,' because they are well enough trained to ride one-handed in a full bridle, with very little pressure actually used on the bit. This is the end result in training the Western horses while some English horses will remain in the snaffle forever.

If your use of the snaffle is strictly for colts, you know that you'll be occasionally using a lot of pull to guide the horse in a certain direction and the curb strap is there to help hold the bit in the center of the horse's mouth. You should not need this advantage on a well trained horse, which is the perspective most English people have since they are not oriented toward colt-starting.

However, a beginner rider may also take hold of a horse's mouth and put more pressure on the bit than is necessary, so the curb strap might help in that instance, too. Even though the horse is theoretically trained enough that it shouldn't require that much pull, the rider is not discriminating enough to give subtle cues. So the purpose of the curb strap on the snaffle is to help balance the bit in the horse's mouth, regardless of why you need that balance. You shouldn't use a curb chain for this purpose; it just adds unnecessary weight and noise; the chain (as opposed to the strap) does not increase the pressure on the chin with the snaffle as it does in the curb bit. If your purpose is just to keep the bit centered, you should either use a leather curb strap or just a cord to connect the two rings of the bit.

You are totally correct that a snaffle, in many instances, is a safer bit than a curb and if someone is having a training issue with a horse, going to a harsher bit is rarely the solution and will usually make things worse. I spend a lot more time trying to get riders to go to a milder bit than the other way around. For more information on this, please visit the 'library' section of my website, www.JulieGoodnight.com.
Whether the horse or the rider is lacking in training (sadly it is often both), if you use a curb strap on the snaffle, it should be attached to the rings of the bit above the reins, like on any bit for any purpose. Remember its only purpose is to align the bit in the horse's mouth, so its adjustment should be with no tension between the rings of the bit, but it should come into play if one side of the bit is pulled out of normal position. The adjustment is without too much tension, but without too much slack.

Ironically, most people use the equipment they use because that's what everyone else uses; they have no idea what they are doing, let alone why. It is important for us as instructors to know why and to question why they are doing things. It is also important for us to be able to answer students when they ask why they should do something we told them to do. I hope this helps you realize that you were on the right track and asking the right questions.
 
#188 ·
FYI - a "cavesson" and "noseband" mean the same thing

you can have a plain noseband, rolled noseband, crank noseband, figure 8 noseband, flash noseband, dropped noseband, etc. All also called cavesson.

figure 8 & flash have a chin strap in addition to the jaw strap.

I do not understand why the western rider just doesn't use a noseband, but again, only idle curiosity!

link to info on western snaffle with curb/chin strap:
SNAFFLE
 
#189 ·
FYI - a "cavesson" and "noseband" mean the same thing
Don't know where you are getting your info from but 'Noseband' is the generic name for a variety of types of equipment that is worn with a bridle and goes around the face. Cavesson is a type

Cavesson Noseband


Flash Noseband


Drop Noseband


Grackle Noseband


Mexican Noseband - identified by the rings at the ends of the headpiece


Crank Noseband


And finally a Lunge Cavesson
 
#190 ·
As someone who rides both western and english, I use the chin strap on a snaffle to prevent it from going through the mouth (yes it does that) and to keep it centered. One thing that would be nice is if people who ride and know the discipline would comment instead of making assumptions.
 
#192 ·
As someone who rides both western and english, I use the chin strap on a snaffle to prevent it from going through the mouth (yes it does that) and to keep it centered. One thing that would be nice is if people who ride and know the discipline would comment instead of making assumptions.
Thank you, that is exactly what Julie Goodnight said! I wish now I had just googled the information first instead of asking a simple question. I did not expect to get such hostility back. Thank you once again for your simple, concise answer.
 
#191 · (Edited)
You know, I had wondered if I should have edited that post to say "the term noseband is generally used to mean the same thing as a cavesson, although you can purchase a nose band without the headstall attached" after I hit "submit" so quick, just in case you wanted to throw this back at me. I really had hoped you would learn and not argue the point...

But if you insist on the technical, a cavesson is not just the noseband, the term includes the strap that goes over the head, the headstall. So a cavesson is a headstall, separate from the bridle, with a noseband attached.

But no, the cavesson does not only come in a plain, flat style and in general the terms are used to mean the same. There are several types of cavessons, as I listed above. Check back with Dover's you will see them used randomly.

But - since you ask, I am from America! What you show as a "grackle" is what we here call a figure 8.

As you asked - here is a "definition" for my info:
"A noseband is the part of a horse's bridle that encircles the nose and jaw of the horse. InEnglish riding, where the noseband is separately attached to its own headstall (headpiece), it is often called a Cavesson. In other styles of riding, a simple noseband is sometimes attached directly to the same headstall as the bit."

Now the link for a "sourse" of the definition of the cavesson and it's use & some history:
Define Cavesson | Dictionary and Thesaurus

Please, I find it strange that you keep on with this subject, but I hope you are bringing this up because you are that interested.

I also hope that you continue to learn about all the different type of equipment and their uses. Knowledge is always good:D
 
#197 ·
I really had hoped you would learn and not argue the point...
I find your post very rude and patronising. For a start I have been involved with horses for around 45 years, I am a BHS instructor, ABRS Grooms Dip, and a Pony Club B certificate level examiner. I trained in the UK in the yard owned by a master saddler, and so know my tack very thoroughly. I teach students for exams with a very high success rate.

A cavesson noseband is a plain basic noseband that just encircles the nose. Adjusted to sit two fingers below the projecting cheekbone and with two fingers between face and noseband. Generally used to 'finish off' the turnout. The width and placing can help improve appearance. Its true function is for use with a standing martingale. If you want to get picky then you can add the headpiece to the equation,


The rest of the nosebands have specific purposes along with specific names.
EG: - The Flash (Hanovarian) was developed to replace the use of two nosebands, the Cavesson and the Drop in a time when standing martingales were used a lot and the rider wanted help keeping the horses mouth shut, and didn't want the uglyness of two nosebands and all the extra headpieces..

A 'figure eight' noseband is really just a description rather than the correct name for the noseband. The Grackle and Mexican are physically different and fitted differently too.

The Grackle is fitted lower than the Mexican, the centre cross is usually rivited while the straps move along the cheeks. There is also a strap that links top and bottom straps under the jaw.

The Mexican has rings where the cheeks and nose straps meet. The crossover point is usually free running to allow for adjustment. The rings are fitted above the projecting cheek bone while the Grackle is fitted just below the projecting cheekbone.

American terminology is sometimes simplified and occaisionally the spelling may be altered - as in Kimberwicke bit - the correct name is Kimblewick after the town in the UK where it was invented.

The link was interesting and a simple explanation.
Noticed though that it refered to a Cavesson as a particular type and everywhere else used the term 'Noseband'.

When I post about equipment you can be generally assured that that my information is accurate. :)
 
#194 ·
Anita, don't get too riled up over what Tnavas says. She is one of those posters that is always right about everything and nobody better say any different *eyeroll*.

Anyway, the strap on a snaffle has several different names, depending on where you're from and what environment you were raised in. Just in my area, I've known them to be called curb straps, chin straps, bit hobbles, and since coming on here, I've also learned that they are called "lip straps" in Australia.

One reason why they are so much more common in western riding than they are in english riding is that western bridles don't have the various styles of noseband to act as a security measure on the bit/bridle. So, a curb strap is used, especially on loose-ring snaffles.

Since, in western riding, snaffles are primarily a bit used on young horses, it's not uncommon to have a horse resist and gape their mouth when you try to stop/turn them. Thankfully, I've never had it happen to be because I've always kept the strap on my snaffles, but I've seen the result of a young horse that gets the bit pulled through the side of their mouth. It's not pretty LOL.
 
#199 ·
Please would you care to tell me where I got all huffy? We too use a chin strap on snaffles in English riding, we certainly don't describe them as curb straps when they are not on a curb bit!! No one identified whether the OP was discussing Western or English or am I supposed to be a mind reader!
 
#201 · (Edited)
Okay guys... I don't know a thing about curb bits or curb straps. But I don't see anything wrong in Tnavas explaining the curb and the chin strap and their differences. It got slightly O.T when nosebands and cavessons came into play, which may be why the debate got so heated... but again, pieces of leather people!

But wow, why is everyone getting upset? It's just a piece of equipment. These are people's feelings you are tampering with.. and over what a piece of leather?

Chilllllllllllllllllllll down. It's hard to know the tone of a post when it is read from the internet. In person this convo may have gone differently because I am sure Tnavas did not mean to make smrobs grumpy or cause her to think she is "lowly"

Anita you asked a question, it was explained to you and then you researched it yourself. Good! Now you know :) And now we can move on.

Hugs for everyone.. we aren't each other's enemies...!
 
#204 ·
Hugs for everyone.. we aren't each other's enemies...!
When discussing horses we quite frequently do become so. Thanks Sky for reminding me just because someone doesn't see it my way doesn't make them an enemy, or wrong!

I needed this :lol: as I was starting form my own very strong opinions and preparing to post them. Now I can go back to selecting the "right" bit for Rascal using this resource.

Hugs back btw.
 
#205 ·
Horse Acting Up lately

Hi ...

My horse Guinness is acting up lately ...he is no longer responding to me riding him without a bit! Lastnight, I rode him in and Egg butt, and it seems he was still pulling very hard.

It seems that I am fighting him to do what I want constantly these days in the arena. I can never loosen up on the reins as he feels this is a single to act out.

Please help , I really need a good bit that he will respond to without my arms and hands being sore every other day when I ride.

I am going to start lunging him every other day as well so he can get use to voice commands which might help when I am up in the saddle.
 
#206 ·
personaly i think you have a serious schooling issue not a bitting issue. you can keep chaning your bit but all that will get you is harsher and harsher bits. What do you do when you get to the breaking the horses jaw stage (yes there are bits that will do that if you pull hard on them)?

Haveyou had an instructor ride your horse?
 
#207 ·
Hi ,


Yes , actually an instructor rode my horse last night and really no reason to be so harsh with your response...

The instructor is the one who advised me to lunge him each time before I ride.

With your feedback you have given it just makes me not even want to ask or get help in these forums.

This site is for helpful hints and caring people.
 
#211 · (Edited)
Hi ,


Yes , actually an instructor rode my horse last night and really no reason to be so harsh with your response...

The instructor is the one who advised me to lunge him each time before I ride.

With your feedback you have given it just makes me not even want to ask or get help in these forums.

This site is for helpful hints and caring people.
It sounds to me like the horse just has a lot of extra energy that the instructor thinks you might be able to lunge off first.

So, that is a good plan to start with, but I would also add that once you are riding him, pull him into circles with only one rein if he starts to pull your arms out of the socket. You can also do this from the ground to help him understand.

When he is moving softly, reward him for going straight by releasing the rein a bit.

Hopefully that will help, but also is he getting any grain? Because sweetfeed can make some horses hot if they don't burn up the energy.

Another thing to try is to give the horse a treat at first when he does what you want, it can help to get the message across that riding is not a tug-a-war!

Good luck!
 
#208 ·
Guinness - is there any possibility that your horse has pulled back recently?

What you are describing could be a horse that is not comfortable in the poll region.

A chiropractor will be able to fix that problem quite easily.

Often when a horse starts to behave out of character its because they've been up to mischief in the paddock, racing around and slipping or falling over or pulling back when tied up.

Another thing to consider is the magnesium levels in the grass he's eating. Rapid grass growth will result in low levels of Magnesium available to the horse. Again this is easily fixed by a tablespoon Epsomo salts (MAgnesium Sulphate) in the feed twice daily. Though it is best given in a small feed about 1hr before riding. Low levels of Magnesium can make the horse flighty, spooky and a short attention span.

Hope you are able to get things fixed - its frustrating and dissapointing when youaren't enjoying your riding horse.
 
#209 ·
Hi Tnavas,

Funny, thing you mention pulling back when tied up. He has actually done that twice in the past month because something has spooked him.

He is let out every day in a huge pasture with two other horses. I do not think he has fallen or slipped but, than again I am not at the barn until around 7PM, each and every night during the week until. I spend most of my weekend mornings with him because by the time noon comes in TX , is way too hot for me to ride him!

The grass levels in the pasture are not growing at a very fast pace...so hopefully his magnesium levels are ok.

I used to have him on herbal calming meds approved by his vet. Maybe it is time for him to start taking them again!

Thanks so very much for your kind response and helpful hints.

It is just going to take patience and lots of work to get us both were we need to be ...so our rides can start being enjoyable!
 
#210 ·
Guiness - sounds like you have the answer to his naughty behaviour - the pulling back - do you have a chiropractor in your area? One or two tweaks and youo'll have your happy horse back.

I had a school horse years ago that was really naughty about pulling back - whenever he did it he'd be obnoxiouis until the chiro had been. Eventually chiro showed me what to do, after each treatment horse would be back to his normal helpful self.
 
#212 ·
I wasnt harsh, believe me that was NOT harsh, just probably something you didnt want to hear.

going up through the harshness of bits just beccause the horse isnt listening = schooling issue.

Any instructor who advises a stronger bit rather than schooling is not someone I would want teaching me. Getting a horse lighter in the mouth takes time, effort and schooling.

Lunging before riding is Ok short term however:
1) most competition centres wont let you lunge on site
2) all it does is get your horse fitter and fitter and then you end up having to lunge for longer and longer and your horse gets stronger and stronger. Believe me I lunge my pony before I get on him and it is a vicious circle.
 
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