Draw reins? - Page 5 - The Horse Forum
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post #41 of 48 Old 01-12-2008, 07:17 AM
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^^^ i wasnt referring to you in particular. it was more a general comment about the seeming lack of tolerance for her views at the moment and the general rise in arguments over the last week or so.

dont be offended. if it was aimed at you in particular i would have pm'd you :)
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post #42 of 48 Old 01-12-2008, 05:18 PM Thread Starter
Green Broke
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There are great ways to teach your horse to lower his head or whatever besides throwing on a piece of equipment to MAKE him do it. "
Draw reins also teach a horse to have a head set to. Its just easier to use them, it less time consuming. Either way, if you want your horse to have a head set, you going to find a way to make them do it, or "teach them" as some people might say. Unless you are going to let your horse "do what they want"
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post #43 of 48 Old 01-12-2008, 07:27 PM
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Teaching and making are two very different things. And I DON'T want a "head set." I want total body collection. Collection comes from the hind quarters, not from a "head set."
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post #44 of 48 Old 01-12-2008, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Spirithorse
Teaching and making are two very different things. And I DON'T want a "head set." I want total body collection. collection comes from the hind quarters, not from a "head set."
Then do what you want, but you seem to have some funny impression about some methods being more thorough or substantial than others. We're not taking any more shortcuts than you are when it comes to training.

I'd also like to claim that teaching and making are very similar when it comes to horses. If I can make my horse perform with a proper headset then I've taught him to do it. Otherwise, there's nothing. And for the record, the headset is not intended to make a horse more collected. It's purpose is to display the overall easy going nature of the animal you're riding.
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post #45 of 48 Old 01-13-2008, 12:27 AM
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Collection and "headsets" are codependent to a degree. You can't have collection, suppleness, impulsion without a horse on the bit. Yes, you can have a horse manipulate his neck so he is on the bit, but he isn't collected, supple, or impulsive.. but then he generally still doesn't look very nice. (he might be dragging his hind feet or moving lazily)

In order to get a collected horse as a rider you cannot wait for the horse to engage itself. You ask for the horse to come round with the reins and push him from behind with your leg. For a difficult horse you include a lot of bending exercises, transitions, circling, counterbending.. All of this can be done with or without draw reins. They are not essential, and for people new to riding or lacking confidence.. They should build it up by learning to engage a horse with minimal interference from other equipment. For people who know what they're doing and can execute it well, there is nothing wrong with using draw reins to get a little more from a horse from the beginning than waiting a half hour or longer for the horse to finally get the message and to stop trying to avoid your aids.

On the other hand, riding a really difficult horse without draw reins will only strengthen you as a rider (and possibly stiffen up your hands!).. Whereas using draw reins as the only method to gaining a collected, bending horse can catch up to you!

So I use them once in awhile, but you can put me on an extremely stiff, stubborn horse and I can collect them, bend them, get through to them.. they might fight me every step of the way and it might take me a half hour/45 minutes (like it did today).. but I can do it.
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post #46 of 48 Old 01-13-2008, 12:28 AM
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oh and okay Jazzyrider! I just wanted to make sure! =]
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post #47 of 48 Old 01-13-2008, 06:22 AM
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Originally Posted by drop_your_reins
oh and okay Jazzyrider! I just wanted to make sure! =]
no worries :)
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post #48 of 48 Old 01-16-2008, 11:28 PM
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I haven't read through all the pages of this topic, but here's what I posted in another thread, and it's what I firmly stand by. Thank you to Tim for referring me over to this thread.

draw reins, when used correctly are a very useful tool. They are meant to show your horse's nose the way to the ground, not to prevent impulsion. Unfortunately, a lot of people use them incorrectly, with both draw reins tight so the horse can't move forward.

I have used draw reins before with a horse that didn't seem able to grasp the idea of a frame, and it helped wonders, only had to use them for a couple weeks, then he held a frame consistantly. They are not to be used by someone that doesn't know how to use them though...!

I agree, horses should work from the hind end, but the need to come up and underthemselves through the back, then comes the head and neck. draw reins are useful for showing your horse's nose the way to the ground; they're a tool used to crate the correct frame in the neck. If a horse has the resemblance of a giraffe (head waaaaaay up in the air) then you might want to consider draw reins, as they just guide your hrose into the correct frame.

You can achieve this many other ways, however I found with my gelding that he would not hold a frame no matter what kind of bending and flexing I did, so I resorted to draw reins, and they worked wonders - and definitely didn't stop his impulsion... my sig pic (the one below my posts) is one of him doing an extended trot (taken at a funny time though!) with draw reins on. He is not behind the vertical, does have a nice frame, and is most definitely working from behind, with a good amount of impulsion. This was back when I was first training him to extend.

The lovely images above provided by CVLC Photography cvlphotography.com
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