Need help with finding a bit for our Haffie - Page 2 - The Horse Forum
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post #11 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 03:46 PM
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Spies, nobody is criticizing, just putting their thoughts out there without sugarcoating anything.

Generally speaking, I agree with GamingGrrl, the horse is lacking training. A well trained mount that is suitable for a child would not be running through any bit, regardless of how little strength the rider possessed. The only exception to that would be the ability of the child. If the child cannot ride effectively enough to avoid giving conflicting signals (perhaps digging in with heels and pulling on the reins at the same time), then they are going to have problems with most horses.

So, I believe that either the horse needs training or your daughter does...perhaps both.
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post #12 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by spies04 View Post

- those who walk around in glass houses shouldn't walk around naked.
Not walking around in a glass house. Horses are bigger and stronger and faster than you, and they can think AND they'd rather eat than work. If you lived close to me you could pay ME and I'd fix your horse's problems.
It's easy to be prideful being around horses. People are emotional, and horses are emotional. Sounds like a romance novel. I have broken in several horses, retrained many more and trained 15 to be fearless around traffic, gunfire and cannons. (Retired from CW Reenactments, including the big, national events.) I've also been thrown and only broke my humerous after being thrown 9 ft. in the air. It was a small horse, btw. Falls and breaks are inevitable around horses.
BUT, if you haven't trained one, you need help!
Your horse probably weighs 900-1,000 pounds and could kill you if cornered and frightened by you. That SHOULD give you food for thought.
We get many posts here about horses that are beyond the training ability of the new horse owner. We also get the stories of their accidents. You asked for help, and nobody here can give you blanket advice without being there to see the problem. I noticed that you didn't tell us that you have years of horse training under your belt.
"Bit" advice can be given if someone is trying to finish their horse, or prevent head tossing, or get better collection. A bit will never stop a horse, or else nobody could ride horses bitless. A well trained horse WILL stop on a simple snaffle. I still school my 7yo geldings on a snaffle. My big head, left is 16'3hh, THAT means his withers are 5'7" and his back is a few inches lower. I am 5'4" tall. He's a big, POWERFUL horse, and I've worked hard to gentle and train him to behave.
Perhaps you'd like to post a different question?

A Jack and Three Queens, the latest book by James C. Dedman,
Hope that you fall in love with "Trot", like I did!

Last edited by Corporal; 05-07-2013 at 04:00 PM.
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post #13 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 03:57 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you but I am really done as I would rather not turn this post into a "discussion" point of my choice of horses. You do not know my background nor do you know my experience or my daughter's age as you are assuming she is a young child. I will think twice when using what I thought would be a helpful tool, but have since reconsidered that.
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post #14 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 04:28 PM
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It's not like we're attacking you, you can use the search feature and in every single "bit help" thread, the same answer is given. More training, less upping the bit.

As for the glass houses bit, I'm an adult, I bought horses at my level, and I can make my own choices and be responsible for my saftey. Your daughter cannot. My horses go in sidepulls if needed. My horses go bridleless, if I want to show off it's nothing towards you, just a community of concerned horse owners who don't sugar coat.
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post #15 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 04:53 PM
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My parents bought me a Haflinger as a first horse.. A green broke one. My parents were totally mislead by trainer and salesman..

I still own the horse, but she was very tough to retrain once we left and still has many issues. My parents insisted we stayed at the boarding barn/trainer she came from -- Harsh bits, incorrect spur usage, and crop.

Haflingers in my opinion, generally don't make a good first horse unless they are very well broke and your kid is in lessons with the horse. :) That goes for any breed, honestly. But you didn't ask for that advice, did you...

I use a kimberwicke (kimblewick is the same thing) most of the time, and occasionally, a pelham, but I wouldn't suggest that bit for a green rider AND horse combination, unless your trainer suggests it (Assuming your kid is in lessons)

I personally don't like the Kimblewick/Kimerwicke because I believe it gives mixed signals, with the constant curb action. With a pelham (NO roundings), you can control what's going on -- Curb action, or just snaffle action.

This is what I have been told/taught, anyway!

Last edited by Princess Bubblegum; 05-07-2013 at 04:56 PM.
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post #16 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 05:30 PM Thread Starter
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I had thought I would not reply again, however, I am concerned and annoyed with the assumptions that most of you are making. To end this post, she is not a new rider, this is not her first horse, she is in training who has also made recommendations on a bit but I wanted to research other thoughts to benchmark what others have found successful. Every horse person could identify a breed of horse they would not purchase for a child but out of respect for others and my difference of opinion, I have opted not to bring up those breeds. Each individual horse for every breed is different and until you have come into contact with that specific horse, you do not have the right to post an opinion or decision on how that horse will react. The posts you have decided to return have identified the reason why others will consider some horse people difficult to work with. I only asked a question on the bit others were using for a Haflinger. I did not ask your opinion on the training for my child or her horse. The bit is one tool in a multitude of areas that we are using to improve her skills and her horse. I may have been incorrect in identifying that he is running through the bit as he at no time has ever taken off or she has lost control. I was only looking for guidance on an additional tool to utilize while we go down our path. Remember that people ask for facts on these posts and not your unfounded opinions.
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post #17 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 05:48 PM
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My view, for what it's worth, is this.

A horse, however well schooled it first appears, will often try out a knew owner or rider. Anyone who's had horses for any length of time knows this simple fact, but it seems some people either don't, or have forgotten.

Since the tiniest pony is far stronger than any child, a straightforward way must be found to impress on the pony the child is in charge, until such time as that once again becomes its normal behaviour. And that usually happens quite quickly.

I used to grumble about lead-rein ponies being lunged (even ridden, sometimes) by adults before showing classes, on the basis that they should be quiet enough for a child to ride straight off the lorry or they didn't have suitable temperaments for their job.

Once we had such a pony for our daughter, however, I found that in practice I was wrong - simply stabling the darn thing overnight so she stayed clean for show day was enough to make her want to buck and mess about for the first five minutes. After she'd got that out of her system she was quiet as can be - her normal behaviour at home.

Just goes to show you have to treat ponies (and children) as individuals :)
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post #18 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 05:50 PM
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I believe that it's also a training issue. Have you been able to get on this horse and ride to see what this horse is doing (whether ignoring the bit or just bracing against it) ?

"Strength is the ability to use a muscle without tension"
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post #19 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 10:39 PM
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When adequate information isn't supplied, we have to fill in the blanks. You didn't mention your daughters age or training level, so I think we'd all be hesitant to suggest an 8 year old use a curb. But if she was a teen, sure, maybe a curb is i order while you work things out. Since you didn't give us the information, we could imagine your daughter being a little kid or even a grown adult. It's also pretty ridiculous to get mad at people giving their opinions out for free. That's what trainers and instructors are for, but you pay them so everything evens out it's free advice, take it as such. Maye next time, if or when you post, provide more details to rule out any miscommunication or having us try to fill in the blanks.
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post #20 of 22 Old 05-07-2013, 11:46 PM
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I still fail to see how any of us where ever being rude.

Pssh.I didn't pick up the wrong lead
It's called a counter canter...
...A very advanced maneuver.
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