Using a S-hack and Snaffle together - Page 2

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Using a S-hack and Snaffle together

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  • Ebay kineton noseband
  • Picture of kineton nose band used with full check snaffle

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    03-12-2013, 04:24 PM
Super Moderator
On upper level event horses, I have had to use tougher bits, on occasion. I have used a full cheek gag with double reins, which I liked a lot. I rarely used the gag, but it was there just in case.

For horses that were simply pullers, I love my kineton noseband. It is a great piece of equipment.

Only once have I ever used a hack. It was a horse whose tongue had been cut halfway through by a previous owner. The scar tissue and the deep gully in his tongue made any bit awful for him. The hack worked well for him, but it wasn't because he was willful.

I am not a fan of pelhams, personally. They have the toughness without any of the refinement. But, a double in uneducated hands could be too tough for many people to handle.
NBEventer likes this.
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    03-12-2013, 04:27 PM
Super Moderator
Originally Posted by gottatrot    
Thanks, I think I like the idea of the Pelham more than the gag because I don't care for the gag action.

Do you fully understand the "gag" action? Or, are you not liking it because it sounds so nasty. The gag doesn't actually "gag" the horse. It applies poll pressure that hits the poll nerve getting the horse's attention. It is much kinder than putting thinner, sharper, nastier bits in the mouth, IMHO.
bsms and NBEventer like this.
    03-12-2013, 06:32 PM
Green Broke
IMO gags are WAY nicer then pelhams in the way they work. No curb action.

I'm currently hunting for a kineton noseband for my mare as she is very soft in the mouth but sometimes can get a bit strong so I need to catch her attention. Allison suggested the kineton to me and described its action and its exactly what I need. If I can't get one on time I am going to use my full cheek gag for her. I can use the snaffle rein and the rare time I need the extra "woah" cross country I can use the gag rein.

People get scared off by the gag thinking its a harsh nasty bit, when in reality its one of the nicer bits, especially compared to the pelham.
Allison Finch likes this.
    03-12-2013, 06:52 PM
Super Moderator
Here's a kineton on ebay

kineton noseband | eBay

That's a lot cheaper than the one in Dover catalog

Dang I just noticed ebays doesn't have a horse size right now
    03-12-2013, 07:09 PM
Green Broke
Oooo that's cheaper then the one I saw on ebay the other day!! When I checked a couple days ago they were $100. I actually would need a cob, my 15.2 horse wears a 69 blanket and cob bridle... Can we say tiny 15.2? Lol

Hoping that one is still there in a few days! I will be grabbing that on pay day *dances*
    03-13-2013, 04:27 AM
The Kineton noseband is very interesting. Now that I could see using as a "hybrid" type of setup since there doesn't seem to be any leverage in play. It doesn't appear to interfere with the direct-to-rein aspect of the snaffle, and the horse should still be able to accept the contact from the bit. That is an option I'd never considered...thanks.

I can ride with double reins and am extremely careful with a curb, but my hands are small and if there is a single rein option like that I'd prefer it.

The Pelham is not the best option I am sure...I much prefer a bit with curb action to have an unbroken mouthpiece and no mixed signals. And an unbroken pelham does not give good communication with the snaffle rein either.

As far as the gag is concerned...I'm still not secure about using one. I know that it basically strengthens the force of the snaffle and also adds poll pressure, but it seems there is potential to either bring the bit back into the horse's teeth, or else to pinch the cheek between the bit and teeth.

Have any of you gag users had this happen?
    03-13-2013, 09:10 AM
Originally Posted by Allison Finch    
Do you fully understand the "gag" action? Or, are you not liking it because it sounds so nasty. The gag doesn't actually "gag" the horse. It applies poll pressure that hits the poll nerve getting the horse's attention. It is much kinder than putting thinner, sharper, nastier bits in the mouth, IMHO.
FWIW...I've been trying a variety of bits with Mia. She will neck rein and ride off of seat when calm. When she gets excited - happy-excited or scared-excited - she is entirely willing to ignore any snaffle I've tried.

When I first tried a gag bit, and realized what the action was, I rejected it because it didn't make sense to ME. However, I haven't been able to get around the fact that SHE seems happier and more responsive in it than in any other bit I've tried. If bits are about communication, then what makes 'sense' to the horse is more important than what makes sense to us.

That is a sample size of one horse, and I haven't settled on any particular bit for her yet. I wouldn't recommend a gag bit as a first choice, but based on Mia's response, I wouldn't rule them out either...
    03-13-2013, 09:52 AM
Great point, BSMS. It's about the horse and what they like best. I'll give a gag a try, and probably the kineton noseband too and see what my mare likes. I could live with the idea of double-reining with a gag so it only was used when necessary. I kind of like that full-cheek one.

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