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Question for ANYONE LIVING IN TUCSON/Southern AZ!!

This is a discussion on Question for ANYONE LIVING IN TUCSON/Southern AZ!! within the Horse Talk forums, part of the Keeping and Caring for Horses category

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        07-19-2012, 04:30 PM
      #21
    Yearling
    Whoa...Dreamcatcher, was not indicating you are GREEDY at all. Was making a generalized statement about the people in the horse industry (based in total on the very facts/figures financial in's & out's of leasing from someone THEORETICALLY in a position such as yours, at least that was how I perceived your statements...I would have been much more direct and obvious if I had intended to sling an insult that unkind! Hope you understand where my comments were derived from.

    I got the impression from you that there was a great amount of required input from ANY POTENTIAL LESSEE in order for you to feel safe in said situation. I fully understand that, as I would likely be just as cautious in your position, if not moreso (would not lease out any horse I owned at all, simply because I am SO NEUROTIC that knowing my horse was not under my DAILY CARE AND IN MY LINE OF SIGHT, I COULDN'T SLEEP AT NIGHT!)...I TRULY, no sarcasm, envy those with the ability to relax and trust when it comes you their loved ones, be it pets or children or spouse!

    Now I don't want to leave anything anyone mentioned unaddressed, but I have to work off of memory here as my iPhone is hard to look back and edit with, so if I get something a bit off, it is accidental, but an intentional slight, ok guys?

    Let me also begin with the fact that the LAST THING I WANT/NEED is a debate with people becoming upset over the topic of "To lease or not to lease...", as that was NOT really meant to be the question. I wondered why it was that leasing is commonplace and often done elsewhere, yet not so in Tucson, AZ!? You go to Scottsdale, a city in Phx, AZ, and there are lease opportunities aplenty!

    Dreamcatcher, I think it WOULD be nuts for you to lease a horse from OK to some practical stranger in AZ! I was never insinuating that would be "commonplace"...as well, I have personal reasons for feeling ten thousand is a fair amount of horse security money...yes, I would certainly insure any horse I owned for medical, but that only covers medical. To be more specific...it does not cover trailering or the purchase/repair of a trailer if one were needed to provide SOMETHING UNEXPECTED for said horse. It could cover rebuild of a structure if my horse were kept at my home and fencing was destroyed/something flooded and requires re-grading...or any other "unthinkable circumstance"...I just want to be prepared. In brief, my indoor 13# chi/rat terrier mix was attacked last year, in the middle of the city where we live, by a BOBCAT (!) which jumped over our 12foot concrete wall, ripped her trachea and esophagus out of her neck, punctured a lung, punctured her posterior neck in 25 places, all in a matter o of 5 minutes, when instead of being outside
         
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        07-19-2012, 04:44 PM
      #22
    Trained
    I didn't take what you said personally, at all. Just saying, that leasing to a stranger and doing it for $200/mo for a horse I would put at least a $20K price tag on wasn't practical. Not upset with you or the topic at all, please don't read into that. I may have come across a little brusque because my hubby had cooked brunch and was hollering, "It's soup, it's getting cold!" while I was typing my reply to you so I wound it up real quick.

    I was just pointing out some of the reasons that leasing is possibly, probably not being done out there in Tucson, it's just a whole lot cheaper to buy your own horse.

    In your position, I would probably wait for one of the trainer's horses to become available and I'd probably kick up my lessons to 2 or 3 a week while I waited. Then you wouldn't maybe feel so much like you're wasting time in between lessons. Just a suggestion.

    I remember some of the LOVELY (sarcasm intended) wildlife there in Tucson. I actually lived just above Oro Valley right above Miravall and near Sierra Tucson, so Mojave Green Rattlers, Gila Monsters (lived under my water softener tank) and Colorado River toads were the bane of my existance. Them and the friggin' chollas, don't miss those at ALL! We were also a stage stop on the Javelina Highway, much to my chagrin. We didn't have too many brushes with the wild cats in the area but when I rode out at night in the washes I was always looking up.
    Back2Horseback likes this.
         
        07-19-2012, 05:07 PM
      #23
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Back2Horseback    
    Whoa...Dreamcatcher, was not indicating you are GREEDY at all. Was making a generalized statement about the people in the horse industry (based in total on the very facts/figures financial in's & out's of leasing from someone THEORETICALLY in a position such as yours, at least that was how I perceived your statements...I would have been much more direct and obvious if I had intended to sling an insult that unkind! Hope you understand where my comments were derived from.

    I got the impression from you that there was a great amount of required input from ANY POTENTIAL LESSEE in order for you to feel safe in said situation. I fully understand that, as I would likely be just as cautious in your position, if not moreso (would not lease out any horse I owned at all, simply because I am SO NEUROTIC that knowing my horse was not under my DAILY CARE AND IN MY LINE OF SIGHT, I COULDN'T SLEEP AT NIGHT!)...I TRULY, no sarcasm, envy those with the ability to relax and trust when it comes you their loved ones, be it pets or children or spouse!

    Now I don't want to leave anything anyone mentioned unaddressed, but I have to work off of memory here as my iPhone is hard to look back and edit with, so if I get something a bit off, it is accidental, but an intentional slight, ok guys?

    Let me also begin with the fact that the LAST THING I WANT/NEED is a debate with people becoming upset over the topic of "To lease or not to lease...", as that was NOT really meant to be the question. I wondered why it was that leasing is commonplace and often done elsewhere, yet not so in Tucson, AZ!? You go to Scottsdale, a city in Phx, AZ, and there are lease opportunities aplenty!

    Dreamcatcher, I think it WOULD be nuts for you to lease a horse from OK to some practical stranger in AZ! I was never insinuating that would be "commonplace"...as well, I have personal reasons for feeling ten thousand is a fair amount of horse security money...yes, I would certainly insure any horse I owned for medical, but that only covers medical. To be more specific...it does not cover trailering or the purchase/repair of a trailer if one were needed to provide SOMETHING UNEXPECTED for said horse. It could cover rebuild of a structure if my horse were kept at my home and fencing was destroyed/something flooded and requires re-grading...or any other "unthinkable circumstance"...I just want to be prepared. In brief, my indoor 13# chi/rat terrier mix was attacked last year, in the middle of the city where we live, by a BOBCAT (!) which jumped over our 12foot concrete wall, ripped her trachea and esophagus out of her neck, punctured a lung, punctured her posterior neck in 25 places, all in a matter o of 5 minutes, when instead of being outside
    Whoops. Post cut off...to continue, instead of being outside with her, he ran in to get something and this happened!
    E-vet required $3000 to START SURGERY, or we coups euthanize. Had that money not been available that minute, no more beloved dog. Four weeks and $5000.00 later she was good as new and my neurosis was a mess. She is our responsibility! We never want to be in a place where we cannot save a loved animal (within REASON, of course) sure to being a few hundred dollars short!!

    Please realize...I do not wish to show. I have no lofty goals for others to be a part of. All of my horse related goals are four my happiness, being able to show a horse love, give him/her great care, and try and pray he/she will love me, at least a little, in return. It's therapy for me, it's relearning trust in myself physically after an illness almost took my life 9 years ago...it's a lot of things. But on MY END? I know I will never intentionally do harm to any horse, and was some freak accident to occur? Well , I would do everything in my power to make it right....its funny you brought up checking in on any horse you leased out to be sure all was well? I would prefer that, and likely would be contacting any person I leased from with questions constantly (within reason, naturally)...I would need to know if said horse does x, what does that usually mean and how would you like me to handle it?" If I do lease, I will love the horse, that is a for sure. But I will not blur the ownership lines, and will follow the owner's wishes to a tee! I am just that WAY, & so the more involved the owner, IMO, the better.

    I hope this all helps to clarify some of what I want and why, and again, advice always welcome, thanks four reading my dissertation!
         
        07-19-2012, 05:28 PM
      #24
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsms    
    There is health insurance available for horses, altho I don't know the details.
    "However much the premiums might be, they're still much cheaper than buying a new horse or paying for major surgery. "A lot of people think insurance is more expensive than it really is," says Andy Beauchamp of Equine Insurance Specialists in Muncie, Indiana. "If you purchase the minimum mortality coverage, which costs $150, along with major medical insurance for $150, you're paying only $25 per month ? Less than a dollar a day."
    Options in Basic Equine Insurance

    My two larger horses probably have a fair market value in the Tucson area of around $800-1200. Cut that in half if I want to be picky about who buys them. Compared to the price of keeping them at a stable, that is darn near free. In Dec 2010 I sold a purebred Arabian mare with a sweet personality (I wanted to keep her and sell a different horse) for $600. If your trainer lets folks know you will take care of a horse, you can get a good tempered horse in Tucson for peanuts. Or free, if the horse is only 13 hands...

    The advantage to owning is that you really DO get to influence the horse. Over time, the horse learns YOUR expectations, and you have to work thru the issues the horse has - and at the $1000 price range, they ALL have some issues. But learning to deal with that is a big part of learning horses. Balance is easier to learn than how to get into the horse's mind.
    Thank you for your post! Yes, I have looked into medical coverage in depth for horses, and it is GREAT, COMPARED to human coverage and dog/cat coverage (see continued posting to Dreamcatcher re: my little dog!)...my concern with that would ONLY BE if something such as what happened with the dog, and I had to come up with cash UPFRONT or euthenize, I would have to have said cash...

    Anyhow, I hear completely what you are saying re: the bond that develops when one owns their animal and the human and horse get to grow together...it must be amazing. That is something my husband has actually brought up many times when we have discussed buy vs. lease, and he wants for me to have that experience. I just have to be ready, money-wise and emotionally, as well for the decisions a horse owner must make vs. one who leases.
    I ask going to use your post to clarify something I said to Dreamcatcher...when I spoke of trust, I meant not that I lacked trust in husband, etc....I intended to describe that I horribly micromanage anything that happens TO MY HUSBABD (ie. When he had surgery, etc...I had to know every detail!) & with the pets, I have to question everything that is done with them, etc...

    This "letting go" a bit us something I'm working very hard to remedy, as its no fun for me and very oppressive for those close to me, obviously! (Thanks for letting me get that in...hence more micromanaging! Arghh!) :0)

    Best to you...
         
        07-19-2012, 05:40 PM
      #25
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsms    
    There is health insurance available for horses, altho I don't know the details.
    "However much the premiums might be, they're still much cheaper than buying a new horse or paying for major surgery. "A lot of people think insurance is more expensive than it really is," says Andy Beauchamp of Equine Insurance Specialists in Muncie, Indiana. "If you purchase the minimum mortality coverage, which costs $150, along with major medical insurance for $150, you're paying only $25 per month ? Less than a dollar a day."
    Options in Basic Equine Insurance

    My two larger horses probably have a fair market value in the Tucson area of around $800-1200. Cut that in half if I want to be picky about who buys them. Compared to the price of keeping them at a stable, that is darn near free. In Dec 2010 I sold a purebred Arabian mare with a sweet personality (I wanted to keep her and sell a different horse) for $600. If your trainer lets folks know you will take care of a horse, you can get a good tempered horse in Tucson for peanuts. Or free, if the horse is only 13 hands...

    The advantage to owning is that you really DO get to influence the horse. Over time, the horse learns YOUR expectations, and you have to work thru the issues the horse has - and at the $1000 price range, they ALL have some issues. But learning to deal with that is a big part of learning horses. Balance is easier to learn than how to get into the horse's mind.
    Thank you for your post! Yes, I have looked into medical coverage in depth for horses, and it is GREAT, COMPARED to human coverage and dog/cat coverage (see continued posting to Dreamcatcher re: my little dog!)...my concern with that would ONLY BE if something such as what happened with the dog, and I had to come up with cash UPFRONT or euthenize, I would have to have said cash...

    Anyhow, I hear completely what you are saying re: the bond that develops when one owns their animal and the human and horse get to grow together...it must be amazing. That is something my husband has actually brought up many times when we have discussed buy vs. lease, and he wants for me to have that experience. I just have to be ready, money-wise and emotionally, as well for the decisions a horse owner must make vs. one who leases.
    I ask going to use your post to clarify something I said to Dreamcatcher...when I spoke of trust, I meant not that I lacked trust in husband, etc....I intended to describe that I horribly micromanage anything that happens TO MY HUSBABD (ie. When he had surgery, etc...I had to know every detail!) & with the pets, I have to question everything that is done with them, etc...

    This "letting go" a bit us something I'm working very hard to remedy, as its no fun for me and very oppressive for those close to me, obviously! (Thanks for letting me get that in...hence more micromanaging! Arghh!) :0)

    Best to you...
         

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