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Feel like I wasted $1300 - vent post

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        10-18-2013, 09:43 PM
      #131
    Weanling
    I guess that in the end I hope this thread saves someone else from making a mistake. I still believe that this was a pretty crappy way for a professional to run a business, and I DO still believe that (as the thread title says) I wasted $1300. But it's done.
    beau159, demonwolfmoon and Heinz57 like this.
         
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        10-19-2013, 05:05 AM
      #132
    Green Broke
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ropinbiker    
    Faye, really?? Killed me? If that is the case then he must be a true glue factory horse! (that's a joke...and no, he would not of killed me...he would have been dog tired at the end of the first day though...as would've I) .
    No you wouldnt have, you would at the least have been in hospital if you took your normal approach with him. Most people have told me to have him shot and the BEST trainer in the UK who only ever takes on RANK and problem horses took 9 weeks to even have him walking and trotting under saddle (and yes he originaly went away for 6 weeks I was wanting w,t,c under saddle, took 9 weeks and only w,t achieved but I'm well versed enough in horses to know when it goes wrong it takes more time)

    To give you an idea of the horses my trainer takes on, she only ever has 3 in at a time, when Reeco was there the 2 others that were there were a 16.2hh warmblood with potential to go to 3* eventing (international level) that a major international rider had brought in to her, they couldnt break it in (and they have broken some quirky stuff in) and when they tried to long rien it, it bolted out through the wall of the indoor school, through the closed gate, 6 miles up the A62 (dual carriage way with 70mph limit) bounced off several cars along the way and ended up in a field bound up in its lines and still thrashing, as it was so valuable that at this point they sent it to my trainer.
    The other horse she had there was 15.2hh and had taken to throwing itself over backwards everytime it was asked to do anything.


    My horse often tried to kill himself rather than cooperate with us. He galloped head first into a brick wall the first time a saddle was put on him, fracturing his skull. My trainer has 10ft panels on her round pen, he tried to go over the top of them and then through them (and succeeded in going through).

    He was not dangerous to handle on the floor in any way shape or form, he could be handled by small children, he was bitted and he lunged like a dream before he was sent to her. He was not spoilt as I can't stand spoilt horses, he wouldnt dream of coming for you with feet or hooves, infact i'm fairly sure it never crossed his mind that he could.

    Now, with a lot of time and patience my horse is out competing at national level and holding his own (well not right this second, right now he is probably engaging in his favorite pasttime or digging himself a wallowing hole and pretending to be a hippo)
         
        10-19-2013, 07:00 PM
      #133
    Showing
    But Faye, you were told by your trainers that he was going to need more time. I've done that myself, told a customer what I can normally get done in a set amount of time only to call them a few days later and tell them that some behavior had popped up and caused the training to stop progressing.

    The point is, the trainer needs to make the owner aware of something like that, not just wait until the end of the time, take the money, and then make excuses about how "they didn't have time" or "the horse has a behavioral problem" when they return a horse that isn't rideable.
         
        10-19-2013, 08:15 PM
      #134
    Green Broke
    ^I love you, smrobs! <3 That's exactly the attitude with which this should be handled.
         
        10-20-2013, 10:14 PM
      #135
    Foal
    Faye, yes, if, after a day or so I would know if he was going to be somewhat "normal"...then I would not have guaranteed he would safely w/t/c after 30 days; I did have a horse that rared up everytime she was asked to trot/canter....I told the owner I would need an extra 5-10 days and would charge them an extra $100/week(plus feed) until she was safe....

    I am still a bit perplexed by your focus on me getting killed or put in the hospital...
         
        10-22-2013, 09:31 AM
      #136
    Weanling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ~*~anebel~*~    
    Yes, they were. The horse will take far longer than 6 weeks to be broke, regardless of how much $ you pay. And if some cowboy wants to bronc out the horse in a week for $100 then all the power to him, but the horse will still not be broke.

    I get irked because this is the prevailing attitude and it wrecks horses and makes trainers lives not fun. When owners expect a show ready horse in 2 months it is not realistic, but of course the customer is always right...
    Not picking on you, just be realistic with your expectations. Should a toddler read at a Grade 4 level in 6 weeks?
    Posted via Mobile Device
    I agree with what you've said. Being realistic keeps us, for the most part, because accidents do happen, from being disappointed.

    But I bolded this because, funny thing is, I was one of those toddlers. :)
         
        10-22-2013, 11:24 AM
      #137
    Green Broke
    ^ xD I was too, actually!
         
        10-23-2013, 02:09 PM
      #138
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ripplewind    
    I agree with what you've said. Being realistic keeps us, for the most part, because accidents do happen, from being disappointed.

    But I bolded this because, funny thing is, I was one of those toddlers. :)
    I get irked at folks that don't read and then address something totally differnt from the original post...the horse was supposed to be rideable and w/t/c safely .... NOT be a premier show horse/finished bridle horse...

    There are numerous trainers, ranches, etc.(check out the WYO ranch sale horses -- they are riding them at all speeds, safely, out on the OPEN range after 3 days....they do it EVERY year with DIFFERENT apprentices helping under the same head trainer...and their horses are very prized possessions); it is VERY rare that a horse can't be made to ride at all gates, safely, with a loose rein or collected, move off the legs, stop well, yeild the hind and forequarters, stand ground tied, and walk out in any terrain/environment. The fact that you feel this somehow is NOT the standard is what, in my opinion, is "ruining" some horses, not the other way around. It's folks that treat the animals like dogs, or children that get them into trouble.

    And not that it matters, but most folks don't "bronc" horses out anymore...but, when they did, it was out of necessity and lack of time; however, most of those horses were solid since after they were broke the first day they were ridden out over the range for a few days straight, a week of riding the range, chasing cows, mending fence, fixing pens, etc. is worth 2-3 months of ground work/walking around an arena...
         
        10-23-2013, 06:06 PM
      #139
    Weanling
    Yea, I know it's all been said, by 2 cents is 2 cents.

    The going rate for a good trainer (around here), with good reputation, open door policy and years of experience is about $500/month (including board). To start a colt, they generally want 2 months time for a foundation (though are generally backing them within 1 month, usually a week or 2 depending on the horse). You can get decent (though less experienced) for 300$ (English trainers are $650, but they aren't popular around here, so I don't know what to expect)

    For a "solid" start, the average is about 90 days. Horses in this time (again, average) get a decent handle on a loose rein, decent stop, yielding front/behind, moving away from pressure, trailering, feet handled, backing up, exposure to shows and obstacles and introduction to what discipline you are trying for. (Even if you don't plan on showing your horse most will tag clients' horses along for the experience). They may begin more "advanced" skills if the horse is ready. (And yes, ground work is done in beginning and throughout training, and in addition to riding.)

    If there are problems, the TRAINER needs to say so. Period. I don't expect a trainer to have the time to send me a minute by minute account of progress (I would expect them to be training), but I would expect to know if any issues arise- whether it's weather or behavioral issues- or an exceptionally good or bad day, and the occasional heads up on progress, good or bad.

    Again, all skills may not be PERFECTED in that time period. Some horses do better than others, some are better at certain activities, less graceful at others. But I don't think that it is at all unreasonable to expect a decent foundation on a horse in 2 months- whether touched or not, and should be manageable by an experienced person to finish out, and pretty confident at 90 (Unless the horse is just a complete wreck of a horse, but this horse sounds no different than 90% of the horses that are generally sent off to trainers- at least your average backyard type). I wouldn't expect much in less time, but from what the OP explains I think what she was told (and expected) were perfectly reasonable.

    BTW- I'm glad he's doing well and coming along.
    demonwolfmoon likes this.
         

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