Feel like I wasted $1300 - vent post - Page 8
 
 

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Feel like I wasted $1300 - vent post

This is a discussion on Feel like I wasted $1300 - vent post within the Horse Trainers forums, part of the Training Horses category

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        07-09-2013, 11:20 PM
      #71
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SnowCowgirl    
    I KNOW a horse can be going under saddle in 1 month because my family has done it for decades. My grandpa raised work horses. They were born on the range and stayed on the range til they were 3, only run in to be halter broke as weanlings and branded. If they made it to 3, they were started and put to work. You think there was any lunging or anything beyond minimal groundwork done?
    Posted via Mobile Device
    And that is why it didn't seem like you were expecting too much. You seen it done with results.
    People may think that taking a few weeks to halter break and ride an untouched colt within weeks creates holes, but I have seen the opposite be just as bad. I have seen colts that were man handled from birth to starting age be resentful and tired of being handled or not any better off. Of course the personality of the horse, trainer/technique and learning speed is the major factor but reading and dealing with it in the best way possible is the key. (I kind of assumed that went without saying). Some one being handy enough can identify those personalities and issues then figure out the best way to deal with it that makes everyone happy, especially the horse. If the trainer was having those issues and decided she needed more time or was prepared to deal with him, she should of said so. I would have more respect for someone who said that she couldn't handle him rather than make a blind stab in the dark(without owners consent).
    If I remember right the OP was in a slight pickle given she was moving for schooling/work and would not have the time or facilities to break him out herself. Rather than letting him set longer, she opted to spend the money to send him out for training. Not to get him show ready but manageable for the facilities and time available to her. She asked for advice on this forum as how to find a suitable trainer for this horse and admitted she had never sent a horse out for breaking. I think she tried to do the right thing by making a go of it instead of letting him suck oxygen and unused, in my opinion.
         
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        07-09-2013, 11:30 PM
      #72
    Weanling
    Thank you!!! You definitely hit the nail on the head haha.
    Posted via Mobile Device
         
        07-09-2013, 11:32 PM
      #73
    Green Broke
    So this is my rant-
    I don't understand why everyone thinks groundwork stops because you can get in a saddle or why just because you can get on a horse that it's broke.
    The paint mare my sister had came to us with 30 days of training broke to ride after being stalled untouched for 2 years. I wouldn't say that she had holes in her training, but she definitely had a long way to go. On the 1st few rides we took her on, she had no idea how to maintain her balance with a rider while going down an incline or at a canter. Maybe if she would have had more conditioning and training on the ground that wouldn't have been an issue. She figured it out eventually, but it was little hairy there for a while.
    OP -I don't think it was unrealistic for you you expect the horse to had a least have a couple rides in within the time frame given. I would be the same way. The trainer should have told you that it was going to take longer and let you decide where to go from there.
         
        07-10-2013, 01:24 AM
      #74
    Foal
    I'm so impressed due to time constraints that the op sent this horse out!!!! So sorry that I don't think she got what she paid for, kudos to anyone to get training on a horse. How many on CL are not broke at 5 + years old, that drives me crazy, and then we wonder why they go to slaughter. I don't think she was looking for anything unrealistic, and I feel that trainer took the opportunity away from that horse to be a good equine citizen.
    Celeste, EliRose and cpr saves like this.
         
        07-10-2013, 09:50 AM
      #75
    Super Moderator
    Well, actually if the 'elitists' think that only World Class competitive horses are worthy of training and that any horses worth training should receive at least $20,000.00 dollars or more in professional training by World class trainers, maybe they think all the others SHOULD go to slaughter. Maybe they also think that the 95%+ of horse owners that only consider their riding passion to be recreational and be a hobby and never intend or desire to ride competitively (much less at a World level) should all just ship their junk horses to slaughter and find another hobby.

    I've shown at World Championship and National Championship AQHA and Arabian shows. I've sold many horses, both trained and prospects, to high level owners that went on and won World Championships (one won 8 AQHA World Championships and won his last one a year ago at age 16) and I sent one we raised and started to a World Champion Reined Cowhorse Trainer just last winter, but I greatly prefer dealing with and selling horses to recreational riders.

    Now I know why. Cherie
         
        07-11-2013, 01:54 PM
      #76
    Showing
    ^^
         
        07-11-2013, 03:24 PM
      #77
    Green Broke
    Really it boils down to this. If you are training a horse yourself you probably will do it differently.. maybe take more time.. then if you send the horse out to a pro.

    Yes.. there are dressage trainers who take a LOOOONG time to back a horse and so forth.. but here you are building a horse for one thing if the horse is good enough. It takes years..

    But to get a horse backed and reasonable and a foundation laid (on an unbroken horse) you just get to it. Most professional trainers will get that horse pretty good in 60-90 days.

    Will the horse do a piaffe? Heavens no! That was not the question being asked. What was being asked is a horse that understands how to walk, trot, canter and stop.. maybe back up.. in 30-60 days. Most pros get it done in that time frame. I have gotten it done in that time frame.

    I have also done the other.. ground driving for miles and so forth.. but mostly on a young horse I cannot ride or cannot ride for miles. You can get a lot done (and yourself in great shape) doing all that. You can't be doing that with clients horses and expect to get paid.

    Is a horse with 60 days of training ready for a world title? Usually not.. Usually they need a lot more work.

    Of course the classical dressage folks also were aghast that I would back a two year old and were aghast that I started horses in a bosal and mecate.

    But it was OK. These same horses went on later to be their horses.. I was just laying foundations.. not building houses.
    smrobs, Endiku, waresbear and 7 others like this.
         
        07-11-2013, 08:45 PM
      #78
    Weanling
    I've been working with my gelding since he was 8 month old, tons of ground work, and up till 3 1/2 had been ground driven, saddled, bitted, everything...pressure on his back and had backed him a few times. He was at the trainers for 2 months after all of this. Yup, came back a horse that can do everything you wanted and expected of your horse virtually untouched in 1 1/2 months. To me training is not a rush, sure you have an end goal but I never but a timeline on that and we get there when we get there. It isn't about catching the horse, throwing on a bridle and a saddle and riding. There is a lot more training IMO that has to go on first before that. JMHO
         
        07-12-2013, 02:21 AM
      #79
    Weanling
    I just wanted to say that, again, horseforum hasn't disapointed haha. So many different responses and opinions. My reponses on here so far have been limited because I've only had internet access on my iphone which is SO frustrating to type on!!!

    I understand that a horse which is destined for higher competition obviously needs to have more specific and careful training. And I totally agree that it's the way to go! But, that is NOT where this guy is heading and most definitely is not where I'm going at this point in my life. I'm freshly out of college and I spend my time chasing jobs all over Canada. Do I have time to compete in ANYTHING or refine my horses' training? No. I scarcely have the time and money to ride them as it is. A lot of the time spent with them is just brushing and hanging out since I spend all my riding time working with the 3 year old I'm breaking in exchange for board! (ironic, yes?)

    But I will find a way to keep them in my lives. The crappy part comes when I budget to allow for training fees and come up with near nothing out of it anyway. FRUSTRATING, yes! Considering all I want to do with him at this point is trail ride.

    Ah well :) summer project I guess. But I reeeeeeeeeally didn't intend to have a $1300 (actually $1800 after considering trailering costs from where I moved) 4 year old grade project. Pretty pricy project in the horse world I grew up in.

    It's not the end of the world, but I seriously don't think I'll ever use a trainer again. Some of the opinions on here are (IMO) totally insane. The thing about horses is that there are very few definite "rights" and "wrongs". It makes it so frustrating and I HATE how I feel like I have to walk on eggshells around so many horse people. But to heck with 'em. I know what it takes to get a horse started and wandering down a trail or around an arena. And that's all I want or need at this point in my life. If I want more I'll work towards it. But that's ALL I need for my horses to know in the beginning.

    In the end, the trainer promised me something that she didn't anywhere NEAR deliver. That was walk, trot, canter, move off pressure, have his feet handled, and allow himself to be caught. I didn't get most of that. But on the other hand, I likely prevented that uncatchable, wild-eyed, quick hind-footed gelding from ending up in the meat pen. I suppose that's worth it *shrugs*
    smrobs, Celeste, doubleopi and 3 others like this.
         
        07-12-2013, 10:21 AM
      #80
    Foal
    So sorry! I was looking yesterday for an update on your project. This was not the update I was hoping to find

    And it wasnt like you were asking much either in the 45 days of training. Crap.

    Remember I sent my stud colt out the same time you did - he is home and doing fabulous after 37 days at the trainer (he kept him at no charge an extra week for me due to weather & said they had a lightbulb moment the last week and he really wanted the extra week to set that moment in stone). And all I asked for was about the same you did - w/t/c (though I didnt push for the canter left it if he was ready physically), stand tied, ground manners kept up, and trailering improved. I got back a colt that rides out solo or in a group, will go out after dark with minimal "spook" (plenty of look but I'm good with that given the shadows), works gates from the saddle, loads, stands tied not just at the barn but to the trailer at the arena, walk & trots & has been cantered a few times (no buck but still "finding his balance"). I mean if my guy can manage that in that little time ~ given it rained 3 of the 5 weeks he was gone, and he had 4 days "off" due to a bit of snotty nose.

    Then heck 2 months surely your guy should have had a bit more than what you got for your money I should think anyways!
    Cherie, Celeste, FlyGap and 3 others like this.
         

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