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Alternative ways to us the Pessoa System

This is a discussion on Alternative ways to us the Pessoa System within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category
  • Horse hock hobbles
  • Hock hobble training

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    01-26-2013, 02:40 PM
  #11
Yearling
The things I have with hock hobbles and the Pessoa system, which IS similar...is that it doesn't take into consideration the conformation of the horse. Many horses have a conformation that makes it hard for them NOT to have their hocks trailing out behind them. The purpose of hock hobbles and a system like this one, is to change a trailing hock. So it's a mechanical means to do that and the horse is better served to be RIDDEN to get better use of hock, than to force a better use of hock with no deference to the phsyical ability for the horse to do so. I've seen more horses ruined physically with systems like this and hock hobbles.
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    01-26-2013, 05:39 PM
  #12
Green Broke
I love the passoa system and have used it to great effect on a young horse wgho needed to learn not to panic in the transition to canter and to balance himself properly. It enabled us to hang on to him when he paniced

This is him relaxing in the passoa

This is him panicing (so you can see why we couldnt hold him


Not everlyone has the skill to use double longreins and the passoa takes away the error from it.
The Passoa does not Force anything, it encourages but if the horse wants to trail along with its hocks out then it can

Hock hobbles have no give in them, thus you are essentialy tieing the mouth down and to the back legs and the horse gets hit in the mouth hard every time the hock goea back.

The aim of the passoa is not to force the head down at all, the triangluar nature of the passoa prevents the horse being hit in the mouth (if used correctly) and a horse can easily and safely move its head up and down and stretch into a contact.

I've met top dressage trainers who love passoas for young horses

To answer the OP no it wouldnt work on a noseband as it is designed to engage the hocks and encourage a horse to stretch into a contact without getting socked in the mouth you cannot strtch into a contact unless you have one in the first place and you can't have one in a halter
     
    01-26-2013, 06:00 PM
  #13
Yearling
But, I see no difference in the movement and mind set of the horse in the vids. He looks the same in all of them. The horse is not relaxed in any of the vids....legs churning, lots of up/down movement, no relaxation and softeness....sorry.
     
    01-26-2013, 06:07 PM
  #14
Trained
Really? I can see a world of difference between vid 3 and 2. In number 2 you can clearly see him rounding and softening and starting to stretch down into the contact.
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    01-26-2013, 06:12 PM
  #15
Green Broke
I would question your eyesight then. In the last video, his back is hollow, his head is up, he is panicing, not balanced and running through, yes lots of choppy movement.

In the 2nd video in perticular (40132) he is soft, round, stretching down into the contact and is thinking clearly. Deffinatly not panicing by any stretch of the imagination. The movement is not choppy at all.
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    01-26-2013, 06:13 PM
  #16
Green Broke
Golden horse, you'd be interested to know there was only 10 mins between video 3 (which chronologically happend first) and video 2
     
    01-26-2013, 06:24 PM
  #17
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by faye    
Golden horse, you'd be interested to know there was only 10 mins between video 3 (which chronologically happend first) and video 2
That is awesome, I can see the improvement, very impressed in such a short time frame. Is this taken during his comeback?
     
    01-26-2013, 06:27 PM
  #18
Green Broke
Yep, this was his first session with the passoa, this is when we started makeing massive leaps forwards.

Weve taken a step backwards due to the weather (the school has been out of action for 2 weeks now) but we wont be long in getting back to where we were.
     
    01-26-2013, 06:29 PM
  #19
Yearling
Quote:
Originally Posted by faye    
I would question your eyesight then. In the last video, his back is hollow, his head is up, he is panicing, not balanced and running through, yes lots of choppy movement.

In the 2nd video in perticular (40132) he is soft, round, stretching down into the contact and is thinking clearly. Deffinatly not panicing by any stretch of the imagination. The movement is not choppy at all.
You don't have to question my eyesight...I see just fine. Yes, I see a behavior from him in the second vid....of course, who would not see him spook and scoot forward. BUT HIS MOVEMENT still remains the same in both vids! That can be seen plain as day. Choppy and quicky legged in BOTH vids....no sense of relaxation, restriction in the shoulder, no true engagement, lot of activity but no substance behind it.
     
    01-26-2013, 06:37 PM
  #20
Green Broke
GotaDun, you are obviously watching something completly different from the rest of us. He is very obviously relaxed in the 2nd video, restriction in the shoulder? Where? No engagement? He has a very good level of engagement for a horse who is only just being broken there is no engagement in the 3rd video at all. I look at the 2nd video from a dressage point of view and see a vast improvement.

Sorry but if you think the quater horse shuffle is appropriate movement then you will be sadly disappointed by a nice warmblood moving properly for his type
     

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