The Horse Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.

Andalusian mares don't get trained?

6K views 43 replies 16 participants last post by  Tealeaf 
#1 ·
Ok so there is an Andalusian mare at the barn I work at, and she is 9 years old and only halter trained. Her owners said that in the Andalusian breed people only train the geldings and stallions, which confuses me. Anyone know why or how this is, or heard of why? It doesn't seem to make any sense to me why someone would own an Andalusian mare, or rather, any horse and just have them halter trained because of how the certain breed is looked after? I mean...I feel sorry for this poor horse...she's kept out to pasture all day, then brought into the barn every night, only halter trained, and her owners come out maybe once a week to groom her to pristine cleanliness only to turn her back out to the pasture because of the breed... It just doesn't make any sense to me. Can anyone understand this and explain why this would be done?
 
#2 ·
they do it at the high schools of riding in europe, but i didnt know that was because of tradition adn their breed. im sure there is andalusion mares out there that are trained, they breed the mares, thats probably why they like to own them.
haha i must admit, that sounds like a pretty good life for a horse (if some groomed and loved her everyday it would be a perfect life!)
 
#4 ·
Ok, maybe 'feel sorry for' is the wrong term. I don't know what I was getting at. But it just doesn't make sense for someone to want an Andalusian so much as to google 'win an Andalusian' end up winning her, and just have her sit in a barn all week and be a pasture pet that as far as I know isn't seen by her owners all that often. It just doesn't make sense to me to own a horse, almost never seen it, and have it not trained. :?
 
#5 ·
That's laziness and it is not breed specific! Many people have the dream to own horses but when the reality sets in they decide it's not as fun as it once was. Historically in many parts of the world male horses are not gelded and are the only horses ridden. The mares are left home to raise the babies. This would be more a cultural thing than a breed thing.
 
#6 ·
So what you are saying is it's more than likely what my first impression was, the owners either don't know enough about Nunci to train her, or they are just downright lazy and using the excuse of the said 'breed's history' or now as you said, cultural history to not do anything with her...I really hope this isn't the case, but it saddens me at the prospect of it.
 
#7 ·
At the end of the day, many horses are not trained to be under saddle/cart. I know many people who keep horses as a companion... people who used to ride but don't want to give up completely, etc. One of the people I graze/board with has only recently returned to riding. Before that she had two horses that she did nothing with but looked after them, mucked out their paddocks daily, groomed daily, rugged appropriately and cared for accordingly... in fact over winter she was down there twice a day - pretty big commitment for just an animal who is left to do as it pleases. Does this make her lazy because they were not used? No. In some cases the novelty of owning a horse wears off and cases like this happen a lot where the horse becomes a chore, than a friend. I think it's a little rude to be getting involved in someone else's business about how they look after their horse. As long as it's being cared for (if they're at a self sufficient boarding facility where the owners/staff care for it), I don't see why a weekly trip is deemed at them being lazy. Especially since you say they put in the work when they're there - "groom her to pristine cleanliness"
There are two sides to every story.
 
#8 ·
As far as the mares concerned she has the perfect owners. They take decent care of her and she can do as she pleases all but maybe an hour a week when they groom her and give her little horsey treats. Maybe they plan on breeding her or they can't get her in to the trainer they want.
 
#10 ·
A one word answer : tradition and custom.
In Andalucia in Southern Spain, horse riding is largely a male dominated sport - even a culture. The men do not like to be seen riding anything else other than a flashy - often beautiful, stallion. Spanish men love to parade their horses.
If you visit the country fairs you will see milling about in the town square lots of well groomed, impeccably behaved, stallions ridden by some very well dressed men. Often there is a very traditionally dressed senora or senorita sitting up behind - sidesaddle.
A feria (fair) is without a doubt a fantastic sight and well worth seeing.

However one mare in season can cause havoc amongst the stallions. And so as to avoid problems in a crowded environment the men say: "stallions only".

At the bigger studs, mares are very often kept in a big communial paddock along with the youngstock. The stallions, and there can be a hundred, each have their own large stables. The stable grooms are invariably men.

In Britain - it is exactly the opposite - here this female dominated society says that stallions represent a hazard at the horse shows where there will be lots of ridden mares (some in season) - so almost invariably all colts are gelded at a young age unless there are plans to keep them for breeding.

It is the same fundamental problem of maintaining control- ie over excitement- but the Spaniards don't believe in the castration of a good horse, they believe only an entire horse has "spirit".

When the British go and live in Spain, they buy the mares and they have them schooled to ride. Schooling represents no more a problem than with any other breed of mare. But folks I know say that it is always best to school an Andalucian horse the Spanish way - which can be a bit harsh by British standards. The results can be spectacular and a well schooled, fancily bred Andalucian horse is a delight to ride. I can vouch for that.

It is also a breed well conditioned to living in a hot dry climate.

I'd love to own one but perhaps the grass is too rich and green where I live. They are also very expensive to buy. The really good ones rarely leave Spain. There is a tangled web of paperwork to follow to get an export licence for a well bred stallion.

Put that mare to stud but only to an Andalucian stallion
or just maybe a Lusitano or perhaps a Lippizaner - dreams!!!!

My DiDi is the closest thing to a Lusitano which I could afford ( PS for "Lusitano" read "Portuguese Andalucian")

Barry G
 
#15 ·
Barry is right...Its spanish tradition that carries over on occasion... for example all of the horses in the famed cavalia (hope i spelled that right) show are all stallions or geldings...

BUT tradition is no reason for why she couldnt be trained...the likelyhood that she is a well bred traditional andy is low if they won her online...I personally would have her trained...

Its likely that kevin was right...dumb lazy owners using tradition as an excuse not to have her trained...
 
#18 ·
This is logical. Maybe they think it's reputable if they stick to tradition, making them feel aloof because they have a fancy horse and they're sticking to fancy traditions. Some people are materialistic like that.
It's like the rich people who own horses just to say they own horses, as a conversation starter, when in fact they've never even seen the horses they own!
Considering that this is the only horse in the barn with owners who almost refuse to talk to anyone unless practically forced...yeah. I'm sure starting to think that they know almost nothing and just have her because they can and have 'always wanted to own one'...yeah...they seem to know nothing about Nunci, even what is being fed to her. I was told this past week by one of her owners 'oh that's not the right feed for her' ...that went over REAL well...had to show them the stinking feed chart to get them to stop saying I was wrong. --_-- Clueless owners, I'm beginning to think so.
 
#19 ·
its kind of silly to me. ive herd of tons of mares being ridden. They can do what ever they want with the horse, as long as she is fed/ taken care of. There is nothing wrong with a pasture puff. (I have two of them lol.) I dont at all feel bad for my mare that shes not ridden, but she lives outside, so she gets lot of exercise.
 
#21 ·
are you sure they're clueless?? You said yourself this is a training barn, so if they really wanted to they could get her trained and take lessons there.

I might not look like what I'm doing sometimes. I've been riding my whole life, Ive jumped grand prix levels before, and I still put polos on backwards sometimes.
 
#22 · (Edited)
I'm just saying from all they've done and told us who work at the barn, it sure is starting to come across that way. Winning the horse online because 'they always wanted an andalusian,' not training her because of the breeds history, and not knowing what she's supposed to be fed?
Go read the post I made right before you commented the first time. :lol: They told me I was feeding her the wrong feed, which is near impossible to do. I had to show them the feed chart before they would get off my case.

I guess it more than anything, just perplexes me why a horse that is so costly, is insured, and has papers, that I would never be able to afford and wish I could afford, isn't having anything being done with her that's all. I'm just trying to figure out any possible reasoning.
 
#23 ·
It sounds very much to me like they're using it as an excuse - however, I am not quite sure why exactly they need one. If the horse is being taken care of, what is the issue? That's like asking people why on earth they own Miniature horses. You can't ride them, so what's the point? Not everyone is involved in horses for the riding. Some merely love their companionship, enjoy visiting them, and get just as much enjoyment as we do in the saddle. And to be quite frank, from an equine point of view, this mare is in her glory. I don't know how anyone can be convinced that a horse would rather be worked hard in an arena then grazing lush pasture. Oh sure, some enjoy it, but given the option, I have my doubt you'd find a horse who'd stick up a hoof and go "OH OH, ME, MEEEEE, I would rather sweat then eat!"

It sounds to me like they're somewhat novice, and they probably did a whole ton of research on Andalusions and realized that typically, it is breed standard to put the work into the stallions. However, as many have said, it's a cultural thing that has become a breed thing based on how completely the Andalusian actually defines Spanish culture. Regardless, it's their perogative and the mare is probably happy as a clam in a life most horses can only dream of!
 
#24 ·
You're right, I guess I shouldn't really need to find a reason or whatever for Nunci not being trained and whatnot. I'm just a logical person, who when things don't make sense, needs to find the logic. :lol: I'll just drop this topic now.
 
#25 ·
feed mix ups happen. maybe they wanted her on something, and accidently wrote something else? ALOT of horse owners arent really in the know when it comes to horse nutrition. they just follow the bos advice

i dont usually talk to anyone else at the barn, if i board, because I usually dont like them lol. or i dont have time for chit-chat with work, studying and riding.
 
#26 ·
I just brought up the non-socializing topic because FCF is in the middle of nowhere, and everyone is friends with everyone, so it's kinda strange. But like I said, I'll just drop it. I just like things to make sense that's all.
 
#27 ·
Haha, I DO understand where you're coming from. It seems insane to me that someone could own horses and not ride them when they're perfectly rideable. But I love horses so much, even if I ended up in a wheelchair for life and never able to ride again, I'd definately still own horses. So I can sort of understand the perspective of someone who just isn't fond of riding - they're amazing animals, regardless of where you're standing!
 
#29 ·
"Her owners said that in the Andalusian breed people only train the geldings and stallions"

There is a small select group of Andalusian breed people in the USA etc, who do that.

I don't think it's done that way in the majority of people who own Andalusians though.

Or even the majority of people who breed and sell them, including the breeding farms in Portugal, Spain, Brazil. I actually looked at mares for sale last year, and every single young mare in most place's catalogues, was broke and being ridden, or driven.
 
#31 ·
Truth

"Her owners said that in the Andalusian breed people only train the geldings and stallions"

There is a small select group of Andalusian breed people in the USA etc, who do that.

I don't think it's done that way in the majority of people who own Andalusians though.

Or even the majority of people who breed and sell them, including the breeding farms in Portugal, Spain, Brazil. I actually looked at mares for sale last year, and every single young mare in most place's catalogues, was broke and being ridden, or driven.
Her owners never said that in the Andalusian breed most people only train the geldings and stallions.
 
#30 ·
Please Stop

Imagine my surprise when I stumbled across a thread on a forum about me and my horse. Nunci came from a large breeding operation in Spain where she was just a broodmare and not trained to ride. She was seven when I got her and I did indeed start her under saddle. She is trained to ride, ridden, well cared for, and loved. The young woman who started this personal attack on me on a public forum took one statement I said out of context and made a lot of assumptions (and you know what they say about assumptions).
 
#38 · (Edited)
I'm sure as you very well know, someone felt in their heart of hearts, it was a profound public service to alert her to it. We call them 'pot stirrers'. Most likely the perpetrator is doing this on a number of bb's. People do strange things on the internet, for even stranger reasons.

Can't decide which one's belly is lower, the one who started this mess, or the one who felt like performing the public service.

All the Andalusian mares I went to look at were broke to ride, some also to drive. Now wouldn't THAT be a stupendous looking team - all Andalusians.

Tealeaf, hope you stick around or at least visit now and again. Sorry you got here by that particular road.
 
#39 ·
No, no one alerted me to it. My husband wasn't feeling well, so I was just killing time surfing the net while he napped. I was curious about the gender of the driving horses in Spain, so I Googled "Andalusian mares trained" and this thread popped up in the search results. I had never even heard of the Horse Forum. You can imagine my surprise when I started reading the thread and realized it was about me and my horse.
 
#42 · (Edited)
It is possible they just happened to find this thread by looking through the "new posts", that's how I found it...
The oldest new post is from Crazyabouthorses(I think that's how it was spelled) last night at 10:42pm. So it was bumped up.
I'm not saying somebody didn't tell her, but just that it's a possibility.
ETA wow five posts while I was typing! I need to learn to write faster...Posted via Mobile Device
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
You have insufficient privileges to reply here.
Top