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Bolting

This is a discussion on Bolting within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category

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        12-15-2011, 02:46 PM
      #21
    Yearling
    @Lakota; I think she tries that but she mentioned the horse bites the bit and braces against her, not allowing her to use the one rein stop.
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        12-15-2011, 04:38 PM
      #22
    Yearling
    Well, it is a teaching thing, after all. The one rein stop cannot be performed until the horse learns to bend to pressure. It is useless unless the horse has been taught how to respond.

    The one rein stop is just like any other training technique, it takes training. I was suggesting that the one rein stop be part of the training program, starting on the ground with bending and yielding, and then moving on to the saddle.

    If it is taught correctly, bracing and biting the bit should never happen. But it takes time and training, as I mentioned.

    If the horse does brace and is not responsive, I would definitely only walk at this time. Work on bending, turning, light responses, and leg pressure. When the horse is fully responsive at a walk, move to a trot, and so on.
         
        12-15-2011, 05:25 PM
      #23
    Trained
    I know you may think you have ruled out saddle fit.. but from those pictures your saddle does not fit, I'm sorry.

    First of all, its a Wintec, and a cheap old one at that. Second of all his posture in the pictures would indicate discomfort in the back, because you appear to have a nice solid position and are not yanking or slouching or doing anything glaringly wrong I would say it is not the rider. And finally it looks like it's sitting way to far down infront.... So, saddle fit. Put the Wintec where it belongs (I find they fill garbage bags nicely) and get a competent saddle fitter out and look at some used saddles. Stubben, County, Passier, Courbette, etc... make great saddles and you can find some older used ones in great condition for very reasonable prices. Said competent saddle fitter will most likely have used saddles (if they are associated with a tack shop) available to look at and try to find what will actually fit.

    You know from your experience in the field that the horse bolts to sort out his issues, so any kind of discomfort will result in a bolt.

    Other explanations are things like blindness, rider error (which again, judging from the pictures I doubt) or loss of hearing... maybe some other weird ones like abuse by staff or something (again, very doubtful) or some weird phobia...

    If you are riding him the same way, fairly competently then it should not be a training issue that he is bolting.

    Good luck!
         
        12-15-2011, 11:10 PM
      #24
    Trained
    You say this horse came from a "mixed bag". I wonder if he's just convinced the other shoe is going to drop whenever he's being ridden and reacting because he figures he might as well get it out of the way. Even though you're riding him in a very mild bit, maybe he was jerked in the mouth a lot and spurred frequently in his former job.

    While you can't make a horse forget, you can be extremely consistent in his training to the point where he will eventually learn that your are not going to do anything to hurt him. You appear to have a quiet seat and hands which will work in your favor. I would say, be as quiet and consistent as you can be with him. I'm not saying never put a leg on him or ask for anything, but make sure every cue is always the same, X means X, not Y or Z if you know what I mean.

    It sounds like he does start to tense up before he gets ready to blow. When that starts to happen, try frequent changes of direction. I'm talking never going straight until he's calm. Something about changes of direction seems to regain a horse's focus on it's rider. If you do trot or canter him in fields, again keep him on a large circle and change the gait frequently. Pay attention to his ears. If they are both forward, he doesn't know you're up there and might feel he's on his own for this safety. Once he's got an ear back on you, you're in business. Use it to ask for little things. Keep him guessing. He'll have to keep his attention on you rather than on acting up.

    If he's a TB, check his tongue. He's probably got a big fat sausage tongue. If there are any marks on it, there's your answer on whether he ever had a rider with bad hands. Maybe try a bit with a low port for more tongue relief and switch to an egg butt cheek piece. Loose rings are great, but they don't provide much in the line of brakes in situations like yours since they'll just slide through his mouth when trying to do one rein stops.

    If he does try to bolt, one rein stop. Then go back to walking serpentines, changes of direction until he's calm again. When he is calm, lots of pats and praise. When he's being aloof, ignore him. Ride him like all is right with the world and manage the situation. Good luck.
         
        12-15-2011, 11:48 PM
      #25
    Yearling
    I would just to like to add that your seat is LOVELY and I would kill to be able to keep my heels and leg as beautifully as you do. Can you ride him in a small area for now, like a roundpen or fenced small paddock so he can build confidence without getting up enough speed to get you both into trouble? And I second and third the desensitizing - can't do that enough with the spooky guys ... gaining trust takes time...
         
        12-16-2011, 12:21 AM
      #26
    Yearling
    I like what Myboypuck has to say. It sounds like your little guy was ridden like a race car. If I was you ( and I have been!) I would not even think of trotting and cantering for some time. Stick to a walk and get that lovely little horse bending. As myboypuck said serpentine's, diagonals, figure eights. Once you have your one rein stop sorted, every time he tries to get away from you bring him to a complete stop turn him to face the direction opposite and do some side passing, turning on the forehand, yielding his hind quarters and backing. I am not talking about doing these for an hour I mean have a little routine that takes a couple of minutes - just to get his mind focused on you and what your legs are asking of him. Once he has performed each exercise to your satisfaction turn him around and set off at a walk once more. If he tries to take off again - rinse and repeat.

    You are going to have to be very consistent with this method, for the first few rides you may not ride very far at all, you may have to stop and go through the whole routine every 10 meters. I know this doesn't sound like much fun but believe me, if you are willing to just work consistently and quietly for a month or two I promise you can look forward to a calmer horse in the near future. How well your horse turns out is going to be directly related to how patient you are.

    I want to reiterate don't even think of cantering and trotting for a while - do some fundamentals and the dividends will be huge.
         
        12-16-2011, 01:21 AM
      #27
    Foal
    Have you tried getting on him while somebody holds him on a lead? Maybe have another rider pony him with you aboard. Make sure you are in an arena or roundpen. Somewhere safe. Just curious what he'd do.
         
        12-16-2011, 01:28 AM
      #28
    Foal
    Thank you everyoen for your opinions! :)

    My Wintec, is a 2010 model, it was fitted by fitters associated with Horseland.. Maybe the stuffed me round or something I don't know, I just listened to them because they where "Accredited" and trusted them with my boy..

    Haha thank you for the compliments on my position, I try to be as quite as I can be and not interfere with a horse. When I am riding him he feels as if, it feels liek he is against my hand (always pressure) and that he is leaning forward into it? If that makes sense, very heavy on the contact?

    He was ridden exactly like that, yanked in the mouth to stop or turn and booted as well, not just a little boot, a full leg boot and yank from a 6 foot muscular man :/ I try my best not to trot or canter and he blows up.

    Thank you everyone for the advice! I'm going to take a little bit out of everyone's books and try to desensitise him again, get a different saddle/plus fit.. Get his back checked once again. Then if everything is working to plan, start riding him in a small penned area if I can lock one off and only at a walk until he is relaxed.. And work on the one rein stop, I will start from the ground and put it into my already huge routine with him haha :)
         
        12-16-2011, 01:31 AM
      #29
    Foal
    No oen else I know rides, my mum can walk him on a lead or lunge, he is very anxious and nervous, a bit rushy, he did attempt to bolt when my mum was leading him, another horse was galloping up and down the fence line and slammed on his breaks, I understand that would have been nerv and exciting for him, he only got to do a semi circle, because he wasn't concentrating truly and I got to spin him before he could take off
         
        12-16-2011, 03:25 AM
      #30
    Foal
    Also *if* this helps anybody, he does the same thing when I lunge him, he'll start with a nice walk ,then he'll start throwing his head up, break into a trot then try galloping, it's easier to control on the ground but he used to drag e of or spin away, I've gotten it under control on the lunge, but not so much under saddle.
         

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