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Bucking problem! Running out of options!

This is a discussion on Bucking problem! Running out of options! within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category

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        06-01-2013, 02:10 PM
      #11
    Showing
    1) YES it can be your saddle. Horses muscling changes, which means that a saddle that kind of fit a year ago could be pinching badly now if her shape has changed (and unless you know EXACTLY what you're looking for, you cannot say "no, she hasn't changed.) I.e. My gelding has gone through 3 major shape changes in the last 6 months.
    2) Even if you tried ONE other saddle, it could still be a saddle problem!
    If your saddle doesn't fit, it can have caused muscle bruising down deep in the tissue, so even a "correctly" fitting saddle may evoke the same response because of the bruising. My friend had to give her filly 2 weeks off due to a deep tissue bruise caused by a too-tight saddle.
    Often the canter will be "the" gait that a horse will give you the thumbs up or down on a saddle - because it's the only odd-beated gait, and it rocks everything forwards and back on the horse's back. I had a friend who must have tried dozens of saddles to find "the one" - and her mare would let her know in the canter. She'd be fine at the walk and trot then blow up in the canter if her withers were being bothered.

    A sudden-onset bucking issue always makes me think "pain" - and that is most often the case.
    Do you have video of her moving? Another issue can stem from the stifles. Does she cross-fire?
    CatrinaB87, themacpack and wausuaw like this.
         
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        06-01-2013, 03:17 PM
      #12
    Weanling
    I have a horse that does the same, all four feet off the ground and he runs you into things. I crank his head to the side (almost by my foot) and kick the snot out of him. He usually tries me a couple times before he figures out he can't win. You never see a horse bucking with their head facing the other way. We can't hurt them as much as they can hurt us. I recommend TONS of groundwork before you get on. This is what I do and he usually runs out of energy by the time I get on. And if he acts good, he gets rewarded, if not the pressure is applied even more. There could be tons of different things that are causing your horse to buck. Without seeing her I can't help you to much. If it is an attitude problem I suggest doing what I mentioned before. I hope this helped a little. :)
    CatrinaB87 likes this.
         
        06-01-2013, 04:06 PM
      #13
    Weanling
    Quote:
    1) YES it can be your saddle. Horses muscling changes, which means that a saddle that kind of fit a year ago could be pinching badly now
    YES... My mare, who's saddle fit perfectly last summer does not fit her now. I started noticing issues with being able to catch her (she had NO issue with being caught the last 6 years of her life, and after I started working her again after an illness she developed this problem)- when I did and put saddle on her, I realized its now too narrow for her and pinches her withers. SO... She started resenting work (which she usually loves, oddly enough- luckily she's not a bucker, she's just a €~>%# you kinda gal). I changed saddles, and she walks up to me again when I call her in.

    Horses bodies change. I would definitely check this out even if she's had no problems in the lat 2 years with it.
         
        06-01-2013, 05:34 PM
      #14
    Showing
    Next time you get on, move the crop so she sees it. She knows it hurts and sometimes that's all it takes to inspire the horse to behave.
         
        06-01-2013, 05:38 PM
      #15
    Weanling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MAG1723    
    I have a horse that does the same, all four feet off the ground and he runs you into things. I crank his head to the side (almost by my foot) and kick the snot out of him. He usually tries me a couple times before he figures out he can't win. You never see a horse bucking with their head facing the other way. We can't hurt them as much as they can hurt us.
    If, after you get her checked out (good for you, by the way! ), she is still bucking, I would do this. A horse can't buck when they're already moving their butt! Not to mention it's a lot more work than just loping.

    My gelding had a bucking issue when I was first training him. He would have to crow-hop into the lope because he hadn't yet learned how to balance the gait with a rider. I had it confirmed that it wasn't a pain issue at all, and after reinforcing that he can't just do things the "easy way" he eventually learned. Since he's had more riding experience he's become more balanced, and no longer feels the need. Now he only bucks when I piss him off by asking for something wrong!
    CatrinaB87 likes this.
         
        06-01-2013, 06:04 PM
      #16
    Green Broke
    The movements of the body at a canter are different, for rider and horse, and many times that is where bucking issues will come out. Saddle that is "okay" at lower gaits, will not be find at canter.

    Could be there is a deep seated abscess in muscle tissue, could be thorn has worked its way into area where girth will lie, could be she fell and broke something too, cracked ribs, spinous process, withers?

    Could be she has cracked a tooth, or has something wrong in mouth.

    Your saddle could also have internal damage, nails, screws, slivers of wood? Could be also tree is broken and causing pain.

    Might be that you are not a steady rider, and have bad hands and she is finally fed up with it? Your curb/bit/bridle may not be fitting right.

    You can discipline her all you want to, but if the issue is pain related, that is neither productive nor is it fair.

    Something has changed, and only by getting horse to equine vet is going to tell you if it is pain or not.

    A video of you riding her would help.
    themacpack likes this.
         
        06-01-2013, 06:36 PM
      #17
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by EquestrianCowgirl4    
    She will only lope when she wants too.
    This.

    She needs to get good at it without you on her first. Good means that to transition from a trot to a lope takes no visible effort. Horses may buck for lots of reasons, but getting stuck in upward transitions is one big one. Particularly in the lope, because of how the hindquarters come up and under. If her back end comes up while she's simultaneously doubting forward motion it can literally trap her whole body between the hindquarters and the forehand which will almost -guarantee- that the horse will buck.

    You can do this from the saddle, but the safer place to start might be on foot.
         
        06-01-2013, 06:38 PM
      #18
    Weanling
    1) I would have a saddle maker and another person to look at your saddle to get 2 opinions. I got a custom saddle maker to come out for free to my place. Some vet clinics offer saddle fitting also.

    2) This is something they did to evaluate my horse at the vet. Take a pen cap and run it from the poll to the tail on the side of the spine pressing down. Now my horse had major saddle fitting issues and when they got to her back she jumped and squirmed really bad and the vet looked at me and said "Your horse has extremely bad back pain and needs chiro work". He showed me where to press with the pen cap and I did it at home to my other horse and she still moved slightly when I ran it along her back but it wasn't as nearly as bad as the one. I would deffo recommend chiro work. I had a chiropractor to come out to my house for $65, and then I took her into a chiropractor at a vet and they charged $115 but they did an amazing job and worked from head to tail to shoulder to legs.

    3) After you have cleared these out then lets work on bucking from disrespect. I do different things depending on the horse I might (not in usual preference):

    - Yank their head up, it is really hard for a horse to buck with its head up. Don't just bring it up a little, get your hands up! But I don't usually do this because then your horse could rear or start crow-hopping. On one horse this is what I had to do to get her to stop.

    - Push them through it, once they start bucking and if you can sit through it just keep kicking them and give them some rein. When I mean kick just keep kicking to edge them on. But if you are unsure if you can sit the bucks don't try it because if you fall off once it will only get worse. Do you ride english or western? If you ride english I would suggest doing this in a western saddle so you can hold on good. And after their bucking fit make them canter circles, spin them around, etc...

    - Once they start bucking turn them, start spinning them like they are a tornado left and right a few times around and switch, back them up 20 or so steps, sidepass them on the tail, do quick short transitions- do a quick canter for maybe 5 strides, stop, and back them or do something to keep their feet moving. But most importantly keep their mind going.

    4) You said she didn't do it when she got to do what she got to do... I would NOT practice that at all until she stops bucking on what you want to do. Go set up barrels in the arena but don't run them at all! Work her in the middle of the barrels but don't work on barrels. She will eventually learn that she misses doing what she loves. If you set up barrels but don't run them and she doesn't buck then maybe let her trot them once and be done.

    5) Always end on a good note :)
         
        06-01-2013, 09:56 PM
      #19
    Trained
    If this horse has never bucked before and now is bucking when asked for a faster gait, it's pain and probably your saddle and probably the bars of the saddle are hitting her shoulder blades. Try her bareback.
    themacpack likes this.
         
        06-16-2013, 11:57 PM
      #20
    Foal
    Unhappy

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by EquestrianCowgirl4    
    She only bucks when you put her into a lope.
    I am having the exact issues that you seem to having... I have done everything thus far that people have recommended... Vet check, Saddle Check, Ground work...

    My horse is a 15 year old APHA who I have owned for the last 3 years! I have been having the same issue the last few months... he never ever use to buck! But now all of a sudden he has been bucking and cow hopping when I ask him to go into the canter! I am not the most experienced rider so this effects my confidence!

    What have you been trying and has it helped at all???
         

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