Crop or not? - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
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post #21 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 01:25 PM
Weanling
 
Join Date: May 2009
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I couldn't understand that last sentence at all. Why are you asking the question if you only want one answer? A crop is to be used as an aide, not a weapon. When I'm on multiple horses per day, spurs are used to clarify my request, to keep communication clear.

You asked everyone's opinion. If I was in your situation and the trainer asked me to carry a crop, I would respect their request whether I would have to use it or not. In the large scheme of things, it really doesn't matter. I wish the biggest thing I had to worry about on any given day was whether or not I should carry a crop.

Also, not to sound full of myself, but I (or any respectable trainer that I know) can read a horse well. If I (or again other trainers) were working with a student 3 days per week for a month, I would be pretty comfortable in how well I know your horse. I usually do a one hour consultation with people and already know their horse better than they do. Other professionals that I know (trainers, farriers, dentists, vets, etc) can read horses just as well or better.

No one is saying beat the horse with a crop, they are just saying to respect the opinion of the person that you are paying or find someone whose opinion you agree with. Yes, it is often the riders fault that the horse refuses, just because you are carrying a crop doesn't mean that you have to beat her over the jump if you are messing up. To be honest, if you are that worried about responding like that, then the little kid jumps is where you should be until you are more secure in yourself and in your horse. If you don't want opinions, don't ask the question.
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post #22 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 02:36 PM
Yearling
 
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I have been riding for a lot of years, strictly trail riding for fun. I never had the opportunity or extra money to take lessons. I hope someday I will have the chance.
You are very lucky that your parents are in a position to be able to afford this opportunity for you.
Carry the crop, learn to use it as an aide and with finesse. If that is how you view it, as an aid and not just a whacking stick, then it should not be an issue. Just as you should be able to wear spurs but not use them unless necessary.
If as you say there is no other trainer available, then you may find yourself without one.
You already know she means business by making you ride in the 'kids' area when you did not comply last time.
Like you said, she is not asking you to use, just to carry it. Save your battles for something more important.
Good luck! :)
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post #23 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 02:55 PM
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If you know your horse and he/she does not need it don't bring it. I have a very forward Morgan and If he even sees a crop he would freak. I have a very laid back AQHA who needs to see it. Stay true to your beliefs and trust your gut you are the expert of your horse not a "trainer". I commend you for knowing who you are and trying to stick to your beliefs! I well trained horse does not need a crop. or a bit. or a rein. Ask a Native American.
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post #24 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chella View Post
If you know your horse and he/she does not need it don't bring it. I have a very forward Morgan and If he even sees a crop he would freak. I have a very laid back AQHA who needs to see it. Stay true to your beliefs and trust your gut you are the expert of your horse not a "trainer". I commend you for knowing who you are and trying to stick to your beliefs! I well trained horse does not need a crop. or a bit. or a rein. Ask a Native American.
Well, I hope she enjoys her time on the bunny slope following your sage advice.
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post #25 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themacpack View Post
Well, I hope she enjoys her time on the bunny slope following your sage advice.
Mac, you beat me to it!
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post #26 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 02:59 PM
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If you have an issue with how your instructor motivates and disciplines your horse, discuss it with them. But in this case she wasn't even asking you to use a particular aid on your horse. She was asking you to carry a crop as a precaution. Assuming the crop doesn't severely inconvenience you, a precaution isn't worth arguing over.

I know some horses are affected by their rider carrying a whip, even if they never use it. If for some reason you have concerns about that, then you should discuss them respectfully on the ground with your instructor. On the ground. Not when you're about to ride, not when tensions are high. Because it's going to be a long discussion about your training ethos, your long-term goals for your horse and your riding, and how you and your instructor can work together to reach those goals.

Wanting your horse to be responsive to leg and not to need additional aids is an admirable goal, but I doubt it's your life's mission. You don't have to use a whip if you carry it. If you're concerned you wouldn't be able to avoid using it, express that to your instructor. Not 'I won't carry a crop' but 'I'd rather not use the crop, how can I make sure I don't unthinkingly react with it when I ride?'.

If you believe everything you read, better not read.
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post #27 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 03:01 PM
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Have you stopped to think that it may not have even been about carrying a crop but more about how you take (or, in this case, don't take) instruction?
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post #28 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 03:07 PM
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If a horse freaks when he sees a crop, he has obviously been abused with one.
A horse should never be afraid of a whip or crop if they have been used correctly.
I love making my lunge whip CRACK! But then I can immediately rub it over Spike's face. He has never been beaten, he is not afraid.
Naive Americans DID use reins. Look up what a war bridle is. Pretty harsh.
Yes, you should absolutely stay true to your beliefs, but look at the situation.
This is a young person taking lessons under an instructor. If she trusts the instructor, she should do as she is told. She can absolutely ask questions, but no foot stomping and saying 'no, my horsey doesn't need that'.
If she has serious doubts about the instructor, she should stop lessons and find a new one.
She was not asked to beat the horse. She was asked to carry the crop.
Huge difference.
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post #29 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 03:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skipsfirstspike View Post
If a horse freaks when he sees a crop, he has obviously been abused with one.
A horse should never be afraid of a whip or crop if they have been used correctly.
I love making my lunge whip CRACK! But then I can immediately rub it over Spike's face. He has never been beaten, he is not afraid.
Naive Americans DID use reins. Look up what a war bridle is. Pretty harsh.
Yes, you should absolutely stay true to your beliefs, but look at the situation.
This is a young person taking lessons under an instructor. If she trusts the instructor, she should do as she is told. She can absolutely ask questions, but no foot stomping and saying 'no, my horsey doesn't need that'.
If she has serious doubts about the instructor, she should stop lessons and find a new one.
She was not asked to beat the horse. She was asked to carry the crop.
Huge difference.
To add - the best thing to do if that were the case would be to do the horse a favor by working with them to overcome that.
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post #30 of 117 Old 05-18-2010, 03:14 PM Thread Starter
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I'll tell y'all what the point of this is; this child thinks she knows more than anyone else.
1-I dont think i know more then anyone I know my horse more then anyone DIFFERENCE

Youth is curable though, and about the time someone turns 25-30, they've usually had enough knock downs and immersion in real life to realize they're not the fountain of all wisdom, and just maybe someone else has something to teach them.
2- Im not a child so please dont assume i am. I have spent my childhood working in yards showjumping, breeding, riding schools. I listen to all instruction i get so please dont assume different. When a reasoning isn't explained that means the person stating is not quite sure why they are requesting if a valid reason had been given ok fine but it wasn't

Until then though, of course she knows all there is to know about riding and training.
3-When did i ever say iv learnt all there is Im not quite sure what your getting at here I dont think we ever finish learning

If I were the instructor, I'd tell her parents I wouldn't be back. She's not worth dealing with, with her know-it-all, entitled attitude.
4-my lessons are nothing to do wiht my parent i model and pay for them myself. Im not a child so she cannot by pass me and go straight to my parents, and with my horses no matter what age i was ruling comes down to me there all bought by me so any decisions are made by me.I do not have a know it all attitude please ask anyone of the successful yards i have worked at and you will find i have an eager to learn attitude but of course with three posts you have figured out all about me. I dont feel im entitled to anything and i dont see your point in trying to make assumptions about me and my personality over a forum. I come from a large family and entitled to anything wouldnt be a word in my house. I am a full time vetinary student in colllege i also model full time to pay for my horses so how im entitled i dont know.

I blame her parents. Sounds like they've forgotten to tell Sweetums that she's not the center of the universe.
This is possibly the most OBNOXIOUS thing iv ever seen posted and why you even felt the need to criticise my parents is beyond me you have NO odea about me, my life, my family and to make such propsterous assumptions is 100% out of order. My parents have raised 5children each of us is successful in our own right. They have raised us brilliantly and to think you make such disparging remarks about my family is the reason im considering terminating my membership to this forum


Everyone on this forum is from different countries and back rounds so i dont see why you get away with telling me that my theory in how i want to ride my horse is wrong. I found out that in this forum its the AMerican way of doing things despite the fact were not all from America and have different teaching styles and learning environments are methids are instantly wrong.

Flitterbug- I was selected to represent my country at the eventing championships so i think my riding is up to scratch.

To give a horse your heart guarantees a love that will last forever undamageable
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