Disrespectful Horse
   

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Disrespectful Horse

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  • Horses that buck out of disrespect

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    08-02-2013, 11:14 PM
  #1
Foal
Disrespectful Horse

Ok, so I have a problem with my gelding, Newt. When I lunge him, if I ask him to trot/lope, he will shake his head, kick out at me, crowhop, buck, etc. It takes a lot to get him to move his butt while I'm lunging him, but I know he's not lazy, because while I'm riding he will really move out at a lope. The round pen is big enough and he doesn't have any health issues. He just has a "No, I don't want to do it and you can't make me" attitude. There was another issue that we had the other day. While I was riding him, I tried to push him into a trot and he tried to buck with me. He's a very complicated horse. I've tried everything, and we just don't get along very well. Oh, and he's also a cold-back horse, meaning that you have to lunge him before you hop on or else he will buck with you.
When my other horse would disrespect me, it would usually just take a firm spat on the shoulder/butt and he would remember his manners. But Newt is so much different. I've tried so many things and it's like no matter what I do, I just can't win or get through to him.
We've been doing a lot of round pen work recently, going back to the basics and trying to work out the kinks. We just don't get along. My trainer has moved to Nebraska, and there's not any others around here that are willing to help me. Any advise would be greatly appreciated, thank you.
     
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    08-02-2013, 11:29 PM
  #2
Foal
Do you own Newt?
Do you like him?
     
    08-02-2013, 11:49 PM
  #3
Showing
To me it sounds like you need an experienced rider to ride through his bucks. Cold backed? My horse was the same until I learned how to work with him.

To me it sounds like he doesn't respect you because of the shaking head. Probably thinks of himself in charge and so he knows bucking gets to you.

Working with a trainer would be what I would do in your situation.
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    08-03-2013, 01:54 AM
  #4
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyseternalangel    
To me it sounds like you need an experienced rider to ride through his bucks. Cold backed? My horse was the same until I learned how to work with him.

To me it sounds like he doesn't respect you because of the shaking head. Probably thinks of himself in charge and so he knows bucking gets to you.

Working with a trainer would be what I would do in your situation.
I would love to find a trainer, but after mine moved to Nebraska, there's not any others around here. I know that a lot of people use that excuse to get out of hiring a trainer..But I genuinely would love to have one. There's just no trainers out here. I had to drive Lakota (my other horse) over 2 hours just to get him broke to ride and even that didn't work out. Anyway, I agree that he is very disrespectful and thinks of himself as boss. I've tried so many things to convince him otherwise, it's not even funny. I need new ideas.
     
    08-03-2013, 01:57 AM
  #5
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenBackJack    
Do you own Newt?
Do you like him?
Yes, I do own him. I'm somewhat fond of him and I'm grateful to have a horse to ride..But it's just aggravating to fight with your horse every single time you go for a ride. For once, I would like to go on a nice, calm ride. But with Newt, that's just not going to happen.
     
    08-03-2013, 02:03 AM
  #6
Started
Kiss, no reaction= whip. Clucking, no reaction =whip. And when I say whip, I don't mean threaten. It needs to count, lace that rump.

Not for everyone, that's why people buy broke horses or pay trainers.

Fact is, horse listens and now would be nice, not now? Will be now!
Posted via Mobile Device
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    08-03-2013, 02:12 AM
  #7
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennakaaate    
Ok, so I have a problem with my gelding, Newt. When I lunge him, if I ask him to trot/lope, he will shake his head, kick out at me, crowhop, buck, etc. It takes a lot to get him to move his butt while I'm lunging him, but I know he's not lazy, because while I'm riding he will really move out at a lope. The round pen is big enough and he doesn't have any health issues. He just has a "No, I don't want to do it and you can't make me" attitude. There was another issue that we had the other day. While I was riding him, I tried to push him into a trot and he tried to buck with me. He's a very complicated horse. I've tried everything, and we just don't get along very well. Oh, and he's also a cold-back horse, meaning that you have to lunge him before you hop on or else he will buck with you.
When my other horse would disrespect me, it would usually just take a firm spat on the shoulder/butt and he would remember his manners. But Newt is so much different. I've tried so many things and it's like no matter what I do, I just can't win or get through to him.
We've been doing a lot of round pen work recently, going back to the basics and trying to work out the kinks. We just don't get along. My trainer has moved to Nebraska, and there's not any others around here that are willing to help me. Any advise would be greatly appreciated, thank you.
Ok a few thing I saw as I was reading your post.
1. "he will shake his head, kick out at me" the head shaking can be a challenge or showing an unhappiness with what you are asking, but when you say he kick out "at me" do you mean he kick out or is her truly kicking "at" you? I ask because the method I would use to fix this is a little different. The head shaking is easy work harder push more turns and make the turns away from you into the fence. The kicking if its only kicking out I would do pretty much the same thing, push harder. If he is truly kicking "at" you then good hard round pinning could do the trick, you COULD lay him down, Now I am not a big fan of laying horses down, I have done it wrong and right. I will not go into laying down horses here. I only bring it up as something to talk to a trainer about. It hard to know just from what you have said, I would "assume" you are not pushing him enough in the round pin. But that is only an assumption.

2. "It takes a lot to get him to move his butt while I'm lunging him, but I know he's not lazy,.... "No, I don't want to do it and you can't make me" attitude."
It sounds like he could be, being lazy. It could be he doesn't feel you are the one to "make" him do what you are asking from him. And that is why you get head shacking, kicking and bucking. If this is the case you need to assert you self more when round pinning, I work horses in the round pin at a trot, (I might make them run, but only to make a big point "what I say goes if not you can run") I only slow them down to a walk once I know that have their attention.

3. "He's a very complicated horse." Now, I am not saying that all horses can't be or aren't complicated, but in my experience horses aren't as complicated as we make the out to be.

4. "I've tried everything, and we just don't get along very well."
I wouldn't be to quick to talk like this, I think some people don't for whatever reason get along with a horse, but I also think it's easy for us to blame something outside our control to explain what the problem "might" be. Examine, you training have you really tried everything, you sound like a better horseman then that.

5. Lastly the "cold backness" I once rode this Appy that bucked the first ride of the day every day for I think it was three years, morning, afternoon, evening and everything in between. I could let him stand, round pin him before riding, it didn't make a difference. Once that first ride of the day was over he was a great trail horse won't buck would go anywhere I pointed he.... until the next day and then it all started over. After about threeish years he began to buck less then one day he didn't buck and after that I never saw him buck again. Why? I have know idea, he finally gave up or got it or what. I kept him around because after that first ride of the day was over he was a great horse.

I think you sound like someone that really wants to learn and improve and become better so you can help your horse be better. So keep working, round pinning is a great tool. Make that horse work, lots of turns. Show him you are the boss, don't except laziness or resistance teach him that both will only get him more work and harder work. Good Luck.
     
    08-03-2013, 02:21 AM
  #8
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phly    
Kiss, no reaction= whip. Clucking, no reaction =whip. And when I say whip, I don't mean threaten. It needs to count, lace that rump.

Not for everyone, that's why people buy broke horses or pay trainers.

Fact is, horse listens and now would be nice, not now? Will be now!
Posted via Mobile Device
I've been trying this for months...Still no improvement. Whippings don't seem to faze him much. I've used my hand, lead ropes, riding crops, lunge whips. He just doesn't learn and I'm starting to think about selling him (maybe to a cowboy, since Newt used to be a roping horse).
     
    08-03-2013, 02:46 AM
  #9
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by CowboyBob    
Ok a few thing I saw as I was reading your post.
1. The head shaking can be a challenge or showing an unhappiness with what you are asking, but when you say he kick out "at me" do you mean he kick out or is her truly kicking "at" you? I ask because the method I would use to fix this is a little different. The head shaking is easy work harder push more turns and make the turns away from you into the fence. The kicking if its only kicking out I would do pretty much the same thing, push harder. If he is truly kicking "at" you then good hard round pinning could do the trick, you COULD lay him down, Now I am not a big fan of laying horses down, I have done it wrong and right. I will not go into laying down horses here. I only bring it up as something to talk to a trainer about. It hard to know just from what you have said, I would "assume" you are not pushing him enough in the round pin. But that is only an assumption.
Yes, he is actually kicking out at me. I push him as hard as I can in the round pen. To the point where I'm out of breath, dripping in sweat. The only way that I can think of to push him harder is to get another horse to push him around in the round pen, but unfortunately I don't have another riding horse.

2.It sounds like he could be, being lazy. It could be he doesn't feel you are the one to "make" him do what you are asking from him. And that is why you get head shacking, kicking and bucking. If this is the case you need to assert you self more when round pinning, I work horses in the round pin at a trot, (I might make them run, but only to make a big point "what I say goes if not you can run") I only slow them down to a walk once I know that have their attention.
Trust me, he's not lazy. He will haul some buns in the round pen and outside of it. It's just his stubborn "You can't make me" attitude. I don't know how to assert myself more...I've done everything but beat the life out of him.

3. Now, I am not saying that all horses can't be or aren't complicated, but in my experience horses aren't as complicated as we make the out to be.
In my opinion, he is complicated. I just can't seem to wrap my head around him, and I've had him for over a year now.

4. I wouldn't be to quick to talk like this, I think some people don't for whatever reason get along with a horse, but I also think it's easy for us to blame something outside our control to explain what the problem "might" be. Examine, you training have you really tried everything, you sound like a better horseman then that.
I've changed tack countless times, gotten him checked out by vets, and had his teeth/feet looked at. I've tried several different training methods and hired a trainer. Thank you for the compliment, though. I really appreciate it!

5. Lastly the "cold backness" I once rode this Appy that bucked the first ride of the day every day for I think it was three years, morning, afternoon, evening and everything in between. I could let him stand, round pin him before riding, it didn't make a difference. Once that first ride of the day was over he was a great trail horse won't buck would go anywhere I pointed he.... until the next day and then it all started over. After about threeish years he began to buck less then one day he didn't buck and after that I never saw him buck again. Why? I have know idea, he finally gave up or got it or what. I kept him around because after that first ride of the day was over he was a great horse.
My dad told me a similar story about a cow horse that he had. However, even after I ride out the bucks, Newt is still a stubborn, disrespectful horse.

I think you sound like someone that really wants to learn and improve and become better so you can help your horse be better. So keep working, round pinning is a great tool. Make that horse work, lots of turns. Show him you are the boss, don't except laziness or resistance teach him that both will only get him more work and harder work. Good Luck.
Thank you for your advice. I'm really out of ideas and I'm more than willing to listen to anybody's advice or opinions.
CowboyBob likes this.
     
    08-03-2013, 05:24 AM
  #10
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennakaaate    
We've been doing a lot of round pen work recently, going back to the basics and trying to work out the kinks. We just don't get along.
You mentioned "don't get along" twice. Try to lose this feeling as it will only bias the way you work with him and make your job harder. It's not just you, it's human nature.

How are his basic handling ground skills? Will he lead at your side, move over, back, stand tied, etc? If he resists you for any of those, you need to go back to square one before worrying about lunging.
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