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Establishing Trust and a better bond with your horse

This is a discussion on Establishing Trust and a better bond with your horse within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category

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        06-27-2013, 05:14 PM
      #41
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsms    
    This explains a lot. Nevzorov is a nutjob. Last I heard, he was trying to speak to horses in Latin. He rejected the cruelty of riding horses in 2009. (The difference of Nevzorov Haute Ecole from other schools and ways of horsemanship)

    And no, conventional training does not cause a horse to lose its spirit.
    Look, I pick and choose things I like from different trainers. You can't keep basing your information on claims. Even with natural horsemanship trainers like parelli there are plently of people that are against his work. That's a personal choice. I know a woman that sent her horse to clinton anderson for training. He ended up having a heart attack and dying mid week. Because she had a bad experience she now tells people that he's a horrible trainer. On the other end some people swear by his method and I have seen many great horses come out of it. No one is perfect . There is no right or wrong way to raise a horse. Im trying to end this on a good note but you keep in making claims that I apparently have something against conventional training. I do jumpers and dressage, I don't solely rely on these methods when it comes to that.. I'm not going to go bareback and bridle less into the jumper ring. I still use a bridle(hackamore) and saddle. When I'm not spending time in the show ring this is what I do. I'm not a horrible person for wanting to find a different way to bond with my horses.
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        06-27-2013, 05:22 PM
      #42
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by trackstar    
    Sorry for any misunderstandings but there is a lot more to it and I think everyone is just viewing it as negative because it is so different. The things I mentioned aren't even half of the program. I only put this out there for people that were looking for something different. If you are not interested just ignore it. Not once did I tell anyone that their way of training was wrong and I'm not saying I'm against the way other people train their horses or anything. If I was happy with traditional training methods I would do it. I found something that worked for me and I'm just sharing it.


    It really isn't that different than any other nutjob "trainer" trying to tell you to become friends with your horse and they'll listen to you and become your BFF.

    With an equestrian relationship someone will inevitably be the boss, and with these methods it will most likely end up being the horse.


    My horse and I are partners, yes. But they quite clearly know who runs the show. I love them and give/buy the best things for them(**** smartpaks and expensive tack)....but in the end I do this for myself so I'll have a healthy, sound, and happy riding partner.
         
        06-27-2013, 05:38 PM
      #43
    Showing
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by trackstar    
    Sorry for any misunderstandings but there is a lot more to it and I think everyone is just viewing it as negative because it is so different. The things I mentioned aren't even half of the program. I only put this out there for people that were looking for something different. If you are not interested just ignore it. Not once did I tell anyone that their way of training was wrong and I'm not saying I'm against the way other people train their horses or anything. If I was happy with traditional training methods I would do it. I found something that worked for me and I'm just sharing it.
    It's not that I'm looking at it negatively it's just I'm trying to understand it, but your contradictory statements made that a bit difficult.

    I've heard about Friendship training.. would that be the same thing? Jaydee was right in saying some people employ methods from those types of training without even realizing it.

    I tried round-penning once, join up once.. and to me it just doesn't work with my horse and I. I rather he come to me because he wants to, not because I push him around.

    I spend time with him in the pasture just for kicks, not taking him out to "work" or sometimes I take him out to hand graze him in some nice grass. Maybe that's why he holds respect for me, not because I'm belligerant with him.

    I'm always open to new training ideas so long as they are logical to me. If they aren't logical (like talking to my horse in latin) I don't use them.
         
        06-27-2013, 05:47 PM
      #44
    Foal
    We aren't saying YOU are wrong, you didn't create the methods so don't take it so personally.

    But, she sounds like a quack and it's not something I would want to try. Me and my horse will never be buddies. Half the time my horses may not *want* to do something, but do they do it? Dang right they do. I'm not going to walk into the pen with my mustang and if he doesn't *feel like* working that day, leave.

    I don't want a horse to look at me as his equal or spiritual best friend. I'm his boss.
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        06-27-2013, 05:53 PM
      #45
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Skyseternalangel    
    It's not that I'm looking at it negatively it's just I'm trying to understand it, but your contradictory statements made that a bit difficult.

    I've heard about Friendship training.. would that be the same thing? Jaydee was right in saying some people employ methods from those types of training without even realizing it.

    I tried round-penning once, join up once.. and to me it just doesn't work with my horse and I. I rather he come to me because he wants to, not because I push him around.

    I spend time with him in the pasture just for kicks, not taking him out to "work" or sometimes I take him out to hand graze him in some nice grass. Maybe that's why he holds respect for me, not because I'm belligerant with him.

    I'm always open to new training ideas so long as they are logical to me. If they aren't logical (like talking to my horse in latin) I don't use them.
    It would be similar to friendship training. All it is, is spending quality time with your horse. Something as simple as sitting out in the pasture can really change a relationship. Then when you go to do more advanced things, certain boundaries have to be set just to gain respect from your horse and for safety. I obviously wouldn't do the whole 'talking to my horse in latin' thing cause it just doesn't seem logical lol. I just pick up on the things that make sense and are easy to translate into my own regimen
         
        06-27-2013, 06:00 PM
      #46
    Showing
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by trackstar    
    It would be similar to friendship training. All it is, is spending quality time with your horse. Something as simple as sitting out in the pasture can really change a relationship. Then when you go to do more advanced things, certain boundaries have to be set just to gain respect from your horse and for safety. I obviously wouldn't do the whole 'talking to my horse in latin' thing cause it just doesn't seem logical lol. I just pick up on the things that make sense and are easy to translate into my own regimen
    You and are I similar in that regard then :)

    Half the things I do aren't what other people do but I find that it just works for us.

    I agree though that hanging out with them can definitely change the relationship. I used to be able to walk away from my horse and he'd just stand there.. huge open grass lot infront of him, his buddies around the corner. He was happy being around me.

    Sometimes I get the feeling he asks permission to do things, like go graze or go roll or something when he's just standing around with me and we aren't doing anything. His spirit/soul/whatever ya want to call it is still very much there. I don't want a robot.
         
        06-27-2013, 06:09 PM
      #47
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MustangGirl    
    We aren't saying YOU are wrong, you didn't create the methods so don't take it so personally.

    But, she sounds like a quack and it's not something I would want to try. Me and my horse will never be buddies. Half the time my horses may not *want* to do something, but do they do it? Dang right they do. I'm not going to walk into the pen with my mustang and if he doesn't *feel like* working that day, leave.

    I don't want a horse to look at me as his equal or spiritual best friend. I'm his boss.
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    I think theres been a slight misunderstanding. She doesn't just leave if the horse doesn't want to work. If you ever took a psychology class you may have learned about the whole positive/negative reinforcement method, this is what she does. Like with the parelli method you first ask nicely, if that doesn't work then you make a suggestion, then tell. Its just without force. If the horse wants to go fast, then you go faster. You try to do the opposite of what the horse wants to do while matching the energy. The goal is to have the horse look to you as a leader not his equal, so he knows you are the boss. I hope that makes sense.
         
        06-27-2013, 06:24 PM
      #48
    Super Moderator
    While most of us don't want robots you have to remember that to a certain extent conventional training has to produce a robotic horse of sorts because they are the most in demand for riding schools and trail riding centres/trekking centres where they are getting high numbers of novice riders and beginners who don't want to be challenged - they just want to be safe and enjoy the ride.
         
        06-27-2013, 07:09 PM
      #49
    Foal
    Some may consider my cutting horse a "robot." But, she is a highly trained, driven and money winning robot. I have no doubt that I could claim a first place on her with a good partner and workable set of calves anyday. She has finess, collection, talent and athleticism... Probably one of the most amazing athletes I've ever met.

    But, that same mare is in no way a robot. That mare has a personality all her own, and is oftentimes the one "helping" the ranch hands mend fences and loading herself in an open trailer when no one is looking. She loves jumping, swimming and getting sprayed by the water hose and knows how to open the tack room door and I have no idea to this day how she does it. She's an individual, far from robotic, but conventionally trained with terrible, harsh bits and heavy, ill-fitting tack (according to Cynthia)
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        06-27-2013, 07:18 PM
      #50
    Trained
    I'm glad that you found a method that works for you. Personally, I have seen TOO MANY horses that were NOT brought up like "Black Beauty", in his first few years, and bring a LOT of baggage with them. I have owned/trained horses for 28 years.
    Personally, I like Dennis Reis bc he is clear to the horse what he wants, but he doesn't settle for any nonsense, yet he retrains and gives confidence to many frightened horses. He also stresses weight as a cue for gaits and whoa, and this intrigues me.
    You description of this method, which may not be accurate, just an observation, would get many newbies here severely injured by most of the horses for sale now.
    I think that if we could all just pay board for 3 years and give these problem horses time to settle in, we could ALL shake hands and be friends this year.
         

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