Frustrated - Page 2 - The Horse Forum

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post #11 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 10:04 AM
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I'd like to hear about your progress, if you're willing to update
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post #12 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 01:41 PM
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Superb post Cherie!

I don't have a horse that needs this now (two are pretty responsive and one is a greenie) but I could definitely have used this on a horse or two in the past.

I'm saving your post for future reference.
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post #13 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 02:32 PM
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post #14 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 03:03 PM Thread Starter
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Will let all know how things go. Shadow
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post #15 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 03:14 PM
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this is the first I have ever heard of going to "10" but not allowing the hrose to go forward when it reacts to the spanking. If you are not working with a "finished horse", but say one that has some training, and certainly knows what leg on means, do you go to "10" but allow the hrose to leap forward?
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post #16 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 05:19 PM
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No! A horse in training does not need that much of a tune-up. But, you can sure get one to start responding much better and get one much lighter if you 'over-cue' him and then bring the horse back to 'start', trap his head with more contact and ask again but much more lightly. This is what most serious trainers do all along after that first 90 days or so.
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post #17 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 07:20 PM
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I don't disagree with Cherie on how you might fix the problem, though I wonder why "most serious trainers" have to do this? Ray Hunt would say don't ruin that horse's desire to help you, you take away his interest in doing what you want him to do by drilling him, training on him. He said you kill that horse's try by not accepting and rewarding the smallest change, and the slightest try. Now you need to beat some effort back into that horse, and if you don't change your approach that caused this in the first place, pretty soon that horse will be totally soured and it'll be tossing it's head, pinning it's ears, and swishing it's tail every time you ask it to do something.
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post #18 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherie View Post
No! A horse in training does not need that much of a tune-up. But, you can sure get one to start responding much better and get one much lighter if you 'over-cue' him and then bring the horse back to 'start', trap his head with more contact and ask again but much more lightly. This is what most serious trainers do all along after that first 90 days or so.

It seems like a punishment. Maybe that is what it is , a punishment, and the idea is to create a big impression in his mind. I mean, spanking him but disallowing him to move forward, then asking very quietly the next time. Seems like a spanking, a punishment. Not that that isn't called for.
I just never heard of that before. I have always been told to get big, yes, and be ready for a horse that may leap forward, but if the hrose jumps forward, not to punish their mouth for doing that.

Under what circumstances WOULD you do as I thought was correct?
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post #19 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Zimmerman View Post
I don't disagree with Cherie on how you might fix the problem, though I wonder why "most serious trainers" have to do this? Ray Hunt would say don't ruin that horse's desire to help you, you take away his interest in doing what you want him to do by drilling him, training on him. He said you kill that horse's try by not accepting and rewarding the smallest change, and the slightest try. Now you need to beat some effort back into that horse, and if you don't change your approach that caused this in the first place, pretty soon that horse will be totally soured and it'll be tossing it's head, pinning it's ears, and swishing it's tail every time you ask it to do something.
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Mike, I find this very interesting. What would YOU advice, specifically, for this young rider and this horse?
I am ingrigued by Cherie's comment, and now your's.
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post #20 of 214 Old 08-24-2013, 08:26 PM
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I don't think what Cherie described kills the try, and to emphasize, it's about getting try out of a more broke horse that has realized that you aren't going to ask a whole lot out of him and has become stagnant. It doesn't mean that you have hammer on them hard constantly to the point of fying his brain.
If done right it should liven up the try and if rewarded right it should keep the horse trying.

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