Getting a collected trot/jog...sort long...

Well I need some tips...My gelding will do an absolutely beautiful collected lope and I can get him to collect at a jog...(he is a western horse)...getting him to collect his lope is easy but when trotting he tends to flick his feet? idk but thats the best way i can describe it...anyway its not collected and very rough...It takes a min to get him to collect himself and jog properly but when he does it is wonderful...he just Breaks out of his collection when trotting! He will be perfectly collected for ten min then all of a sudden he breaks it an it an it takes a bit to collect him again...

I have only been working on getting him to collect properly for around five months and he has progressed nicely...so will he get better about this over time if I keep working him? Or is there just another underlying problem? he isnt in pain so that is not preventing his collection...i think he just needs more work...

Also i sometimes ride with a TWH and in order to keep pace my boy has to preform a long trot...not extended but long...he will collect perfect for a long trot but cant seem to get it at a slower trot...could it be that he is just more use to the longer strides and thus has an issue with mentally grasping a smaller trot?

I will admit he has improved greatly...I rode buy my self a few weeks ago and he preformed the most amazing collected jog an lope the entire ten miles... I was jumping for joy...but he just doesnt get it all the time...

So I guess my question is...Does he just need more work? Or is something else?

Sounds to me like it's just an issue of needing more work.
I worked with gelding for the longest time - Well, to be fair it was only about 45 days lol - but he just wouldn't stay honest about his collection, but for him it was either gait. I'd ask him, he'd collect, we'd go a few paces, he's stretch. Drove me bonkers. lol

Unless they are one of those horses where a nice, slow western pleasure jog is natural (I had the most amazing Impressive gelding who could do this. Wow. Too bad he lost his head.) a lot of them have difficulties learning to shorten their stride and slow right down because it's not a gait that's really natural too them.

Takes lots of work and lots of patience in order for them to be able to keep their back rounded out and their strides stunted.
Sounds like you guys are on the right track, you just need more practice work.

If he's uncomfortable with it, you can always ease him into it. Get him to jog two or three circles in a nice and collected manner then let him stop and relax for a minute, then do it again. Once he can pick up those circles in a jog without ever losing his collection, you can up the number of circles.
It uses a whole different set of muscles on him and it could be he just getting used to having them broken in. :)

Yes I agree with last post. I have just recently been learning and teaching my horse to get it together to a shorter strided trot because he was used to the longer strides and what helped 100% was to trot, then walk four paces, then immediately up to trot five paces, then down to walk 4 paces, then quickly back up to trot 5 paces, each time shortening reins more each time while using leg to keep him moving forward til my horse was properly collected and this shortened his trot pattern considerably. It also made his trot way more comfortable to ride and I am using this to learn to sit his trot because it has to be an almost walking trot in order to sit it and he would either trot too fast or stop with no in between. It also made him way more responsive to me...I dropped my crop altogether after a once around in this manner. Also, he this helps when you want your horse to check in to you. Made him a whole new horse for me and I actually look forward to riding him now.