Got kicked twice last night, trying to load my horse. - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
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post #21 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 01:54 PM
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Wow! If a horse kicked like that at me...I don't care what kind of pain he has, he would get the surprise of his life! Check out Clinton Anderson's tv show on getting a horse to get into the trailer, it works and you don't have to lunge him for hours and hours...

Is there anyway you could get your other horse in first to encourage Beau to follow in?
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post #22 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 02:01 PM
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I have hauled a LOT of horses to farriers. Right now, I haul 20 head (7 or 8 at a time) 30 miles to the horse shoeing school in Ardmore. They used to come her, but when diesel got so high, they quit coming.

I have always hauled any reiners to one of the reining barns at Marietta, more than 45 miles away. Unles you have a full day of work for them, you have to meet them at one of the barns.

30 years ago, I hauled horses 30 miles to a big blacksmith shop at one of the cutting horse barns (Terry Riddle and Freckles Playboy resided there). That farrier ONLY would shoe at his shop and you had to have an appointment at least a month out unless it was an emergency for one of his regular customers.

Part of the reason farriers have gone up so high is because of the ones that have to buy a $40,000.00 truck every few years and have to put $4.00+/ gallon diesel in it, not to mention that they could shoe 2 or 3 more horses while they are running up and down the roads. I sure do not blame any of them that quit driving to less than 6 or 8 horses.

It costs me $25.00 for the diesel to haul each set of horses I take to the horseshoeing school, but then, they only charge $25.00 per horse, even if the instructor has to shoe one with problems or special shoes.

Back to this horse -- I don't care if he has pain or has problems. Everyone has to learn the difference between a 'reason' and an 'excuse'.

ANY & EVERY horse should be trained to just jump into any trailer -- even one that is small or that they have never seen before. NO EXCUSES work for me. It is just part of what any horse should be taught.

Let me tell you a little story: I sold 4 horses to a lady in California several years ago. A wild fire was more than 5 miles from her house and going further away when she went to bed. In the middle of the night, a Deputy Sheriff knocked on her door and told her the wind had changed and she has 10 minutes to get whatever horses she could and get out. She hooked up her trailer and a Sheriffs' Posse member was there with his trailer. The horses she bought from us loaded in the middle of the night in a strange trailer. Two of her other horses would not load and were lost in the fire along with her barn, house and everything she owned.

This same story played out several time here in OK when wild fires burned thousands of acres. Any horse should load in any trailer at any time under any circumstances.

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post #23 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by beau159 View Post
I think my pride and my heart is hurt more than anything. My bruises and swollen body parts will heal but I think it's brought me to a realization.

Now Beau hasn't been on a slant load with rear tack for 4 years, and we had some trouble the last time he did. He's just been hauled in a very large stock trailer otherwise. He's a big horse (16.1 hands) and I have always had difficulty loading him onto the trailer his entire life. I think he's claustraphobic.
Your pride is worth more than your horse's life because you were embarassed at your farrier's place?

Why not try working with him and getting him to load a trailer before sending him off to a meat market? I don't see why this wasn't done before hand when you knew you had to take your horses to the farrier. And I don't mean lunging your horse so get him on the trailer, but actually teaching him that trailers are okay and nothing to be afraid of. This is just irresponsible ownership if you ask me.
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post #24 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 02:43 PM
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I totally get that you were pissed and hurt last night... ive had it happen..and it was my own stupid mistake...

i trained all my horses to load up..all i have to do is swing the rope over their back and point n say "load up" and in they go so i can follow them in.

one night i was lazy and i didnt hook the partition i told my mare "load up" and in she went...well as she went in the partition started swinging closed...and it got stuck in between her barrel and her hip.
needless to say she freaked out and started kicking around, and i ran in to try and get her free....i got kickedin both legs, then she nailed me in the ribs and i flew back into the tack dad had to drag me out, and then they had to open the emergency door in front and unscrew the partition to get her out.

that was the first time i had gotten seriously kicked before. i was 10.

but i didnt blame the was my fault...yeah i was pissed that she kept kicking and kicking when i was just trying to help her...(logic of a 10 yr olds stressed out mind haha).

but shes been my faithful friend for 10 yrs. im not going to condemn her for one action....shes kicked me multiple times since then...none of them out of pure hate, or anger , or just i want to kick was in stressful situations and in her mind it was a defense.

it sounds to me like Beau was trying to tell you something. you knew he had problems with a slant load....16.1 is pretty big, he was probably squished and terrified of having to go back in...and in kicking out at you he was trying to say :hey i dont like this. i dont think this is a good idea. its pretty scary in there, and it hurts me."

im not saying that that is still needs to be corrected...but dont condemn him for kinda going into survival mode, and trying to avoid the pain he associates with the trailer.

work with him on it. feed him in the trailer. load him up in there, and groom him in it. let him calm down and realize that (if you make changes to fit him more comfortable) its not going to hurt to be in there.
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post #25 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 02:47 PM
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Great post, Cherie! May I ask how you train them to load (I've seen different methods, so curious here)?

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post #26 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 03:25 PM
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Great post Roperchick as well.
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post #27 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 03:28 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you to those who have posted curteous advice and helpful comments.

I'm still pretty upset about the whole ordeal, although better than last night. I think part of it is I never really grieved when I had to retire him. I had all these high expectations of things I would get to do with him when I finished school finally, and that didn't pan out obviously. I think thatís playing my emotional card right now too.

Everyone relax. I'm not actually going to run out this weekend and take him to a sale. Never actually said I was going to, just venting that I wouldn't have a problem with it with how I was feeling, especially when I was lying on the ground last night. I will not make a decision until things have settled down and I can look at all my options.

Let me just make one thing clear that was assumed: I would not lie and sell any horse dishonestly to anyone as a riding horse that wasn't. Or hide any problem of the horse. Never. When I said "take him to the sale barn" in my anger, he'd be going for dog food.

A few points as to where I am coming from. My mom sent her life-long horse to slaughter at the age of 22. Of course that was when she got $700 for him to put toward a new horse and he didn't have to travel to Mexico. So she and my dad are very pro-slaughter, even now. Earlier this year, my mom even suggested the fact that we'll probably have to send Beau and her horse (struggling with laminitis) to slaughter together. (And no one better dare call her heartless.) I grew up on a farm where we bottle fed calves into pets, and then butchered and ate them the next year. It's a cycle of life. It's an animal. That's how my family has operated. My dad would have a fit if we actually paid money to put a horse down, than go get $100 for it at the kill sale. My dad lives by the penny, and it's the only reason they are still farming and not backrupt after all these years like the rest of the neighbors.

I donít want to get into word and verbage technicalities, but since apparently I am a heartless disgusting person (which by the way, if you feel that strongly about me, donít waste your time reading my post), I want to point out that I did not say he was my best friend. I said the way I was feeling last night was as if a best friend had punched me. Call it aftershock or whatever you want to. But thatís the best way I could put it into words. Beau is independent and does his own thing and always has. Heís a horse. A teammate possibly, or a companion; but I donít consider horses to be friends to humans. That is just my opinion from my background. Either like it, or donít like it, but Iím entitled to my opinion just like you are entitled to yours.

Cherie --> I couldn't exactly punish him immediately the first time when I couldn't even stand up straight (doubled over) from the wind getting knocked out of me and the rope jerked out of my hand (I have a lovely hand burn today). Sure, I made him go round and round again after that when I regained my breath, but it wasn't immediate punishment that he should have gotten and I know he should have gotten it. But what am I supposed to do if I canít??? I certainly couldn't when I was lying on the ground after the second kick. He kicked me at least a couple feet, despite being pretty close to him. Would you be able to jump up after that and go at him? I couldn't. Iím sorry. I did the best I could and I know it wasnít good enough.

I agree 100% with the trailer loading because I've heard stories like that about the fires. But he is the only horse I've ever had that I couldn't train to load at a moment's notice. Like I said, he's always been like that, even when he was a colt. Most of the time he'll hop right into a stock trailer, but sometimes I still had to lunge him around a bit to get him on. Heís never been in a horse trailer incident. Iíve always praised him when he loaded and/or gave him a treat on the trailer and made it a pleasant place. He really doesnít have a reason not to go in, except for the fact that Iíve always struggled with that with him.

And I take full blame that his training has laxed this year because heís just been the pasture buddy. Iíve had my hands full enough this year with getting married, graduating from school, starting a new job, my grandma being in and out of the hospital, and getting used to this new horse, that Beau wasnít exactly a priority. But with this particular loading problem, I am just going to try to get him on my farrierís trailer calmly tonight, and then heís not getting on a trailer again until I take him to the vet to get put down (if that is what I decide to do). I honestly thought it was about $1,000 to euthanize a horse from what Iíve been told. I just called an hour ago, and the tech quoted me only about $300 for everything, including disposal (which I am still going to double check that because that just seems too low to me). Yea, maybe itís heartless and cruel and whatever else people want to call me. But Iím not going to stick time and money (and pain) into a horse that canít be anything more than a pasture buddy. If you want to take care of him for the next 7 or 8 years, come and get him. Because the place I board at only has room for 2 horses for me, and they are a fantastic retired couple. I have no intentions of leaving there.

He is on Bute. He has been getting 1 gram of powdered bute every single day since May as prescribed by the vet.
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post #28 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 03:56 PM
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Shooting/selling/euthanizing a horse that you've had for 14 years because he made a mistake and is hard to put on the trailer? That's like a parent giving their kid up for adoption because they are afraid of the dark.

There are much better solutions like bute, getting a different farrier, or actually training the horse. It's good that you weren't hurt, but you horse was just telling you that he was in pain. My horse as an arthritic hind end and I can't lunge him with out him kicking. My vet told me it was a way for him to get the weight off his hind end for a second and relieve the pain. Try to get a ramped trailer because it will be so much easier for him to get on and off. Try to be understanding because your horse is in pain and you are making him do something that hurts. You wouldn't like it if you were in rehab for an injury and the doctor just gave up on you because you said it hurt.
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post #29 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 03:57 PM
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I suspect this horse is hard to load because he was either improperly trained OR riding on a trailer causes him pain in his bum leg. You can probably train him to be better.. but I wonder at the point in that.. he is a gelding and not sound.

You know.. I may get kicked for this myself.. but here goes.

Horses are livestock. While I have never sent a horse to an auction barn, I have certainly sold horses. I have also put horses down.. and would again.

It is nice to think of Old Dobbin out to pasture relaxing his life away.. and so it goes if you have pasture and money to do this for Old Dobbin. In reality, a horse is an expensive ornament and they are not dogs.. or cats.. they are livestock.

Fact is, as much as YOU love Dobbin it is pretty one sided.. if Dobbin finds another horse to hang with, he will, unlike a good dog or cat, want to hang with the other horse. I have come across horses I sold a few years later and one recognized me and responded. One.

If I had a 10 year old horse that was lame and a gelding.. and there was still a knacker around.. my FIRST choice would be to have the knacker come and put the horse down while I watched. Take him away for dog food.. it isn't enough money to sell him for slaughter. I watch because I want to know the knacker is putting that horse down (some say they will, take the horse and just drive it to a sale barn for slaughter and pocket the money).

In this day and age it is hard to find a knacker.. Usually this horse would have to go to the killers at an auction.. or be put down and buried (which is expensive). Hate the idea of the killers (mostly because it is a rough end.. and there is a good bit of hard time suffering before that end.. more than cattle from what I have researched).

But.. a horse is a lot of animal to bury.. unlikely a job you are going to do with a spade and your back. You need a good size back hoe to bury a horse.. and that service doesn't come cheap or free.

Just sayin'

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post #30 of 83 Old 08-30-2012, 03:57 PM
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Beau, you don't need to defend your decisions to anyone here, it's your horse and your decision. I am with your mom, I will send a horse to the auction and run 'em through by the pound, if that is what I determine is the appropriate action. But I determine that, not someone or someones on a forum.

I just wanted to encourage you to think about things once you cool down. I would not spend a whole lot of money or training or put myself in Harm's way for a pasture puff. I might for my absolute favorite horse but that's debatable too.

I'm very pragmatic, as are your parents, and you're right; being very aware of the value of a penny is what will keep your folks farm viable long after the neighbors have all filed bankruptcy or sold out. People who do not live on farms but only live in a house, board their Pookey out and have only 1 horse or 2 horses and no other obligations can afford to be sentimental, people who are trying to make a living on a farm cannot. I know people who think I'm horrible because I process my hens when they quit laying. Oh well, I'm not here to live up to their expectations, neither are you.

Good Luck!
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