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Help! Horse is Stubborn

This is a discussion on Help! Horse is Stubborn within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category

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        10-02-2013, 07:50 PM
      #11
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Thunderspark    
    I didn't say the principal was at fault, I said it didn't work for them..... I feel PNH is more for someone who wants to play with their horse on the ground and it doesn't follow in the saddle.
    You didn't say that or I wouldn't have objected - you said 'IT does not gain your horses respect at all.' after agreeing that it was a load of rubbish. That's all. Each to his own I say, but no 'method' will work for all or 'make a horse respect you' - that's down to the knowledge & approach of the handler in question.
         
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        10-02-2013, 07:55 PM
      #12
    Trained
    I don't know much about Parelli or Anderson's training instructionals, but many of us do much better when we have hands on help to show us what we are doing wrong when all along we thought we were doing the right thing! Nothing beats a good instructor right there beside you as DVD's and written material is limited.
    loosie likes this.
         
        10-02-2013, 09:20 PM
      #13
    Showing
    If you have a dvd you are working from, replay it and look carefully at Pat's body positions. By that I mean look at the position of his shoulders, his hips and his feet as he asks a horse to move. That is what can make a big difference. When asking a horse to circle, always step forward with the leg farthest from the horse's head. This movement turns your body just a little in the direction you want the horse to go. It's things like this that go unnoticed.
         
        10-03-2013, 01:47 AM
      #14
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by loosie    
    You didn't say that or I wouldn't have objected - you said 'IT does not gain your horses respect at all.' after agreeing that it was a load of rubbish. That's all. Each to his own I say, but no 'method' will work for all or 'make a horse respect you' - that's down to the knowledge & approach of the handler in question.
    Well I definetly agree that it comes down to the knowledge and approach of the handler......
         
        10-04-2013, 09:14 AM
      #15
    Weanling
    "Stubborn" horses nearly always have timid handlers/riders. You need to become the leader, not his friend. Therefore YOU need to be more assertive. When you ask for something softly and do not IMMEDIATELY get a response it is important to IMMEDIATELY (within less than ONE second), ask more firmly.And then again if THAT doesn't work you need to immediately(again within less than one second) get to the point of harsh. It may mean escalating your "ask" to an actual hard smack with the end of your rope, carrot stick or whatever. There is NOTHING WRONG with making swift hard contact with a horse every once in a while to get a point across. If you do it right once, then the next time you offer a soft ask the horse will respond .This is nothing more than what a lead mare in the herd would do to make another horse move when asked.
    If you feel you can not do this, then you need professional training help to learn how.
    loosie and Palomine like this.
         
        10-05-2013, 07:04 PM
      #16
    Green Broke
    I agree with Patty and will add that the most problem horses to me? Are the ones that want to be their horse's best friend and baby them and instead of telling them to do something, either on ground or under saddle...they baby talk to them.

    All of which makes a monster.

    All horses will, with a few exceptions behave exactly as this one does for you. You have to be the leader. If not? You will be the follower and that is not good.
    loosie likes this.
         
        10-13-2013, 11:55 AM
      #17
    Foal
    Ok One thing I will NOT get rid of PNH it is Awesome and I have improved a lot with it!
    It comes down to 2 things-You don't use PNH and your horse will listen but wont give there all-Or use Parelli and have a horse that loves you and give more-
    We were just having a bad day and I have trouble being patient so I was getting mad. I was hoping for advice from some PNH Fans not other people Who hate PNH.

    Anyways I appreciate your advice but I love Parelli and I will not give it up.
         
        10-13-2013, 11:57 AM
      #18
    Foal
    Thumbs up

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Saddlebag    
    If you have a dvd you are working from, replay it and look carefully at Pat's body positions. By that I mean look at the position of his shoulders, his hips and his feet as he asks a horse to move. That is what can make a big difference. When asking a horse to circle, always step forward with the leg farthest from the horse's head. This movement turns your body just a little in the direction you want the horse to go. It's things like this that go unnoticed.
    Thanks for your advice I will certainly try that
         
        10-13-2013, 12:02 PM
      #19
    Foal
    Post

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Patty Stiller    
    "Stubborn" horses nearly always have timid handlers/riders. You need to become the leader, not his friend. Therefore YOU need to be more assertive. When you ask for something softly and do not IMMEDIATELY get a response it is important to IMMEDIATELY (within less than ONE second), ask more firmly.And then again if THAT doesn't work you need to immediately(again within less than one second) get to the point of harsh. It may mean escalating your "ask" to an actual hard smack with the end of your rope, carrot stick or whatever. There is NOTHING WRONG with making swift hard contact with a horse every once in a while to get a point across. If you do it right once, then the next time you offer a soft ask the horse will respond .This is nothing more than what a lead mare in the herd would do to make another horse move when asked.
    If you feel you can not do this, then you need professional training help to learn how.
    I agree in Being the leader and yes if they don't do what you ask use phases a little harder and harder till she goes. But I think you should be their friend too. I need to work on being more of a confident leader.
         
        10-13-2013, 12:08 PM
      #20
    Started
    You need to be more stubborn than the horse. My horse used to be very stubborn - and in some ways he still is.
    Groundwork him more before you place the saddle on, then groundwork him more after the saddle is on.
    You need to teach more ground manners and get big when you need to.

    My horse doesn't like the bit being put in because he knows it means he will have to work. Some days he will actually put it in there for me if he had a good ride before today, but if he wasn't too happy or just doesn't want to work today then he will shoot his nose into the air. So I grab hold of his halter and hold one side of the bit in one hand, to keep him head down. And with my other hand I put it right in front of his mouth and stick my finger in and make him uncomfortable. It usually works pretty well.... after a little fuss.

    But overall in my year of working and riding with brisco, he has gone from pushy, mean, grumpy, bossy, tough, and stubborn horse to a happy, still a bit stubborn, following, companion. He does what I ask of him whether he wants to do it or not, and he no longer does his little mini rears and spins.
    Brisco and I have gone and accomplished so much in a year that if I was told that today I would be barrel racing, parade riding, trail riding, and transforming brisco into a completely new horse and having changed myself in the process, I would have pushed them off a bridge for thinking of such an impossible thing. I would have not believed them one bit.

    Bit one thing that did help me get here, was be more stubborn than the horse, get big right as he comes to nip you, and if he did something wrong or bad, correct him and teach him that wasn't any good.
    In the process I built up my confidence so much - I am not even shy around people now I just jump right in and say hello. Yes, horses DO help you when you aren't even with them.
         

    Tags
    horse, natural, parelli, stubborn, training

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