Horse goes down after Saddling - Page 6 - The Horse Forum
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post #51 of 58 Old 07-11-2011, 01:37 PM
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saddled up my new hose sat. and she started to go down,never seen that b4 but i think daughter tighten up girth 2 tight, we lossened it and she was fine
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post #52 of 58 Old 07-11-2011, 01:50 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by chadrodeo05 View Post
saddled up my new hose sat. and she started to go down,never seen that b4 but i think daughter tighten up girth 2 tight, we lossened it and she was fine
I have seen a few horses that will go down if they are saddled too tightly quickly. My friend has a mare that does that if you just snag her with it. But none of the horse I have seen, have the lack of balance and the panic that my boy seems to have when he has an attack.

Also seen a few babies do it with their first few times they get saddled. They all seem to grow out of it though.
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post #53 of 58 Old 07-11-2011, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Horsesdontlie View Post
I've just been reading what Doe has been saying to Jwells84. So, I'm still here. lol.

Jake does have his balance issues, and his differences with his left and right sides. Which are constantly being worked on. With his age I wouldn't be surprised if he has the beginnings of arthritis. As time goes on, he gets longer and slower warm ups. As for other pain, it is possible but my vet has shown no concern, only advising me that he may need the longer warm-ups.

Doe, out of curiosity what side do you see the most stiffness and unbalance on? Jake is toed out on his left front, which may cause a difference in how he moves and muscle structure. It has very very slightly progressed as he has aged. I leave it shod true to how he is.

Also what exercises do you propose to build on his balance and symmetry?

Natasha - It looks similar, but the owners of that horse said the horse did that consistently, whether saddled or not. While Jake only does it after being cinched up. They could be related incidents though.
It's a bit like the chicken and the egg, which came first when neither exists without the other. His toeing out makes perfect sense and will be largely the result of his problems rather than the cause of them.

95% of lameness is related to the foot, but in turn the foot is a reflection of the body. Hence why one must trim to the internal hoof capsule balance and not to an external angle or picture.

His leverage line is very unusual and interesting. I must find a way to draw it. However it is thrown off to the left but actually naturally falls to his right, and the reason it is thrown is because it actually directs upwards not downwards. This cause a kind of twisting.

So stiffness - this translates to his left side along the ribcage, we here he will seem to flex more easily but in actual fact is usually more bent that way and so as a bend it's actually bending less which confuses people. It will also show a vertical stiffness in his right hind which translates to a difficulty in transitions, especially to canter. I would expect him to fall out on his left shoulder (right turns) and fall in on his right (left turns). I would also suspect he has been susceptible to undiagnosed stomach ulcers and may still have a propensity. (hence also colic in rich grass situations for example)

In terms of exercises, there are many. I am trying to pull some resources together at the moment as it would take pages of typing and needs illustration. However I would highly recommend Peggy Cummings for Jake if you fancy buying a book. That's the basic type of work he needs.

I am so happy he has an understanding owner. Incidentally shoeing to how he is I would agree with as per above. Trying to change it with shoeing would just add additional stresses.

Last edited by Doe; 07-11-2011 at 02:06 PM.
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post #54 of 58 Old 07-11-2011, 02:48 PM
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What is a leverage line? His topline?
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post #55 of 58 Old 07-11-2011, 05:46 PM
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There is the 'leverage point' as I call it. Think of it as the pivot point of the Centre of Gravity (C of G). Then there is the 'leverage line' which is the directional influence through the leverage point. This line moves as the horse moves or changes what he is doing, but it always runs through the leverage point. It simply changes it's direction. The leverage point can and will also move, but again the leverage point will always run through it.

I am mostly interested in seeing the leverage point on a horse when it is stationary at first. That tells me what controls the horse. It is just a starting point, like my summary above, it has many factors to consider that will lead me by elimination and trial to the true issues. However the problem is always connected to the leverage point.

As a demonstration I usually mark the point on a horse with chalk and ask people to test it for themselves. It will be a point of both weakness and strength depending on which angle it is approached from. When people press from one side they will feel resistance and solidity, the other side and the horse will almost fall over with a slight touch.

Its simply the affect of the horses natural posture, balance and musculature all combined, and is no different than understanding the biomechanical implications of say Aiki Jujitsu.

However seeing any horses point of balance and how movement affects it helps one to understand the many challenges a horse may face in doing things we seem to think are very simple, and not confuse physical weaknesses or underdevelopment with disobedience as is the common assumption.

Not sure if any of that helps.
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post #56 of 58 Old 07-11-2011, 07:10 PM
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Ok thanks I think I understand. I dug out my notes from some classes i took,and added a few things,the ones I had show how the center of Gravity changes and how that effect the horse,so I think I'm understanding, it has been along time since I dug out my class, apparently i need to review them more often!
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post #57 of 58 Old 07-11-2011, 08:35 PM
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I have not read the responses so far, but a former horse of mine went down when saddled, she had a back issue.
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post #58 of 58 Old 07-11-2011, 08:52 PM
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I haven't read all of the posts so if what I'm saying is a repeat then sorry :)

Have you checked his girth line for tense muscles? He might need a good massage on both sides all the way up his girth line and under his belly. You can tell if he is tense through there by running your fingers down his girth line from the top to bottom putting a little pressure. If his muscles twitch and jerk around then he needs a massage to loosen up his muscles.

Also, you want to start with the girth really loose. Basically just tight enough that when you walk your saddle won't slip off. Then walk the horse forward (not back or turning), let him loosen up then tighten the saddle a little more. Repeat that process until your saddle is as tight as you need it. Then walk him around again before stretching his legs.

I have found with a number of horses that if they are sore in the girth line at all and you tighten the saddle to much it can drop them to their knees very quickly. A horse that is considered "Girthy" generally just has tense muscles and is sore throughout that whole area.

Hope that helps.
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