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Horse will not Whoa

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        08-21-2013, 06:01 PM
      #11
    Weanling
    The root of the problem is that she is bolting and she is barn sour, a recipe for disaster if you continue to take her out. It doesn't matter if she is only walking back to the barn. That is faster than you asked and is thus a bolt.

    First, I would recommend you to go back to a plain old snaffle bit if you aren't in one already. Teach her how to flex on the ground, put a little bit of tension on one side of the bit and wait until she is giving and is not moving her feet. She will most likely walk in little circles for a while before coming to a stop, just stay with her and keep light pressure. As soon as she gives, give back. Work on this on both sides.

    This will teach her to be lighter in the mouth, it will get rid of that fight and shaking of her head. It is also an emergency brake so to speak. It's much easier for a horse to brace on both reins instead of just one.

    Another thing she needs to know is how to disengage her hind quarters. Start with her in a flexed position. Put your hand ( with the leadrope) in a fist and lightly press where your leg would go with only a couple ounces of pressure. Then take a crop and lightly tap her on her hindquarters, building intensity slowly until she moves her butt around. You are only using a couple ounces with your one hand because you want her to be light off your leg. The whip is just an aid to reinforce your 'leg'. Get this consistent on both sides. You want to make sure tht the leg that is moving away is crossing over the front of the other back leg. If if doesn't keep pressure on until it does.

    All of this sounds very basic I know, but you need a solution to your problem before you go diving in.

    Then you can incorporate these things under saddle in a controlled area like the round pen or an arena. At this point i'd carry a dressage whip just to ensure she'll be getting off your leg.

    Mount with her flexed. Then flex the other way making sure that is good. Next is to disengage her both directions. Then ask her to walk off. At this point you aren't steering. Just let her wander around on a loose rein and bend her to a stop every so often, making sure she disengages as well. If at any point you feel her tense up or want to go faster just bend her to a stop.

    All of this is reinforcing that she goes when you ask and stops when you ask in a safe way.

    When that is good ask for her to gait (if she has multiple gaits, whichever one is slowest) and repeat.

    You will find that she will be drawn to one area of the arena which is fine. Next is working on getting her to NOT want to be there. Let her wander to wherever she wants, then bend her around and disengage her. Use your crop to tap her on the butt and keep her going around for a few circles. Annoy her, make that area uncomfortable. Then when her head is pointed away from that area let her back out into whatever speed you were at. Every time she drifts over to the same area a lot, do this. Make the wrong thing hard and the right thing easy. In this case the area in the arena closest to the barn is hard and away is easy.

    When she wanders away from that area bend her to a stop and let her rest for a couple minutes. Be consistent in that away if easier work and closer to the barn is harder.

    Up to this point, if you work with her every day and have decent timing this should be over the course of 3-4 days. You might be thinking that this is longer than you'd want it to take but look at the bigger picture. You've already been riding an out of control horse for how long, so what is a few days to get her safe? Keep in mind some horses need longer, some need less. The important thing is not to rush.

    ONLY when she has that concept grasped do you actually steer and this is for your own safety. Barn sour horses can be very difficult. Some bolt, other rear, other buck. This is because they want to be in an area they want to be in that you don't. So you need to get that part worked on first.

    The first steering you do with only be corrections. Again you'll be on a loose rein and this works best at a trot when teaching it ( or in your case whatever gait she does). Let her wander around, if she veers off to the right, steer her off to the left. Don't just get her back on the line you were on, over correct and go way the other direction. If you veers off to the left, go right.

    You need to make sure you CAN steer before you go picking exactly where you want to go. If she still picks to be in one particular area go back and annoy her by disengaging and tap tap tapping with the crop. When she is pointing away let her out. Then when she chooses to be away, bend her around just till she walks. Make it work where she wants to be and rest away.

    BIG NOTE: If at any point she blows you off and doesn't give to the bit, hold the pressure. Do not get more firm as her first reaction will be do pull harder against you. Wait for a slight give. Whatever step you were at, then go back and work on your flexing for a couple minutes to get her soft again.


    When she is consistent good in the arena then you can go back out on the trail b/c by that point you will have a solid foundation on her. Keep in mind what you did in the arena however. I would work her a bit in the arena first then go out on a short relaxing ride down the trails. When you get back, work her in the arena some more.

    If she tries to race back, bend her to a stop, disengage her then ask her to just stand again. Rinse and repeat every singe time she gets anxious and or tries to speed up. Staying patient is very important.

    Good luck :)
    towboater likes this.
         
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        08-22-2013, 05:33 PM
      #12
    Foal
    Thanks BreakableRider. Lots of good information that I will start working with her tonight on.
         
        08-23-2013, 08:36 AM
      #13
    Foal
    Update

    So I wanted to let everyone know all of the information you guys provided was extremely helpful. Had a small victory last night! Here is what I did and I have come to realize Juba is barn sour & buddy sour:

    First walked her out 30 feet from the barn and set up cones for her to do patterns with. Worked on flexing with didn't go so well. Right side she was close but left I got dizzy so many times and got a small amount out of her and she stood still - baby steps with this one. I was able to mount from there will no issues and she actually stood still for a few seconds then of course went towards the barn and I took her around the cones again while on. Got a whoa out of her after that and was able to dismount 30 feet from the barn! Took the cones into the paddock and worked her around them for 15mins or so. Took her half way back across the paddock area and asked her to whoa and was able to dismount! Stopped there for the night since she did so well. Once we got back into the barn all she did was stomp her feet and whine for her buddies for a bit.

    So every day I get to ride i'm going to keep working on the flexing and working her a little each time away from the barn and work her hard to get her attention off the barn and keep her busy. Seems to be helping so far! Thanks!
    EquineBovine likes this.
         
        08-23-2013, 02:26 PM
      #14
    Green Broke
    Sounds like you're on your way to fixing the problem

    I just wanted to ask if her teeth have been checked in the last couple of months?

    Sometimes if there are points on the teeth, the bit can be uncomfortable enough the horse will run right thru the bit
         
        08-23-2013, 03:06 PM
      #15
    Foal
    That I am not sure since I lease the horse. Is there any way for me to check?
         
        08-23-2013, 03:59 PM
      #16
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mugsy44875    
    So I wanted to let everyone know all of the information you guys provided was extremely helpful. Had a small victory last night! Here is what I did and I have come to realize Juba is barn sour & buddy sour:

    First walked her out 30 feet from the barn and set up cones for her to do patterns with. Worked on flexing with didn't go so well. Right side she was close but left I got dizzy so many times and got a small amount out of her and she stood still - baby steps with this one. I was able to mount from there will no issues and she actually stood still for a few seconds then of course went towards the barn and I took her around the cones again while on. Got a whoa out of her after that and was able to dismount 30 feet from the barn! Took the cones into the paddock and worked her around them for 15mins or so. Took her half way back across the paddock area and asked her to whoa and was able to dismount! Stopped there for the night since she did so well. Once we got back into the barn all she did was stomp her feet and whine for her buddies for a bit.

    So every day I get to ride i'm going to keep working on the flexing and working her a little each time away from the barn and work her hard to get her attention off the barn and keep her busy. Seems to be helping so far! Thanks!


    Hi. Good for you, sounds like you're making progress. I think it has a lot to do with either she's listening to you, or hanging up on you. Like selective hearing. I think it's a matter of keeping her attention on you, and I think those exercises are great.

    My first horse had no brakes. Scary at times. I put him on the lunge line, and when I said "whoa", as long as it took, when he whoad, he got a treat. But not by walking up to you (bad habit). They get the message real quick. They get to the point where they anticipate your signal. I would set him up as "aaaaannnnndddd, whoa"..So he knew it was coming. When he's stopping on a dime with the treat, ride him a bit and say aaaand whoa where you know you'll get it. Intersperse then with times you didn't get it before. Don't get mad, be patient. You can wait longer than a horse can. When he does finally hears your cue and stops, he gets a treat. Now you are the one he focuses on. Continue with the exercises you do, bending and such is super listening.

    I can't tell you how many problems I've solved with treats. Eventually, they listen even better when you don't give it each time. Or every third or fourth or fifth time. They are still listening.

    Be patient. My current horse would not let me get on. She would constantly jump away from me. One night, when it happened, I took her to the round pen and she had to work, trotting or cantering. I would stop her and try to get on. Nope. Back to work. I was ready to be there till 5 the next morning, LOL. After 1 1/2 hours of this, she did finally let me get on. A few days later, she did it again. It took me 5 minutes to get on. The next time, I got on. And gave her a treat for the first time. Now she stands like an absolute statue. People at the barn ask me how she stands so still while I get on. I explain it to them, but they blow me off and their horses continue to walk off with their one foot in the stirrup. To me, it's not a reward. It's training them to pay attention to me.
         
        08-23-2013, 08:28 PM
      #17
    Green Broke
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mugsy44875    
    That I am not sure since I lease the horse. Is there any way for me to check?
    Ask the owners when the last time was she had her teeth looked at. If they can't remember and can't find the vet receipt, it might be good to have her checked
         
        08-31-2013, 12:36 PM
      #18
    Foal
    Can you just have bad training days? Things were going well until now. Weds and today I spent an hour with the horse and she would not listen at all. I spent so much time going in circles and doing exercises around cones and keeping her attention away from the barn and the other horses but nothing seemed to work. She did fine in the paddock but as soon as I asked her to go towards the trails in the woods she would not. I did everything from circles to figure eights and she kept fighting me the whole time. I ended up getting off and walking with her to the woods and back a few times but no way was she letting me ride her towards the woods. What should I do?
         
        08-31-2013, 01:11 PM
      #19
    Weanling
    Just make it harder work around the barn. You don't even need to work her hard. My go to thing is to bend the horse's head like i'm flexing and disengage the hindquarters, getting pretty nagging about it. I keep bumping, pop on the hindquarters with a whip or the reins and keep going in circles for a few circles. After a couple circles a horse will start to drift a bit, when their head is pointing away from the barn I let them walk off.

    It's easy enough work that even the most out of shape horse isn't going to get out of breath or sweaty and simple enough for any horse to do.

    If the horse want to go back to the barn, trot back over there and work a little more. Make the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard.

    For a couple days don't even really ride down the trails. Just get closer and let her rest each time you get there. After a few days when she is mentally balanced you shouldn't have a problem going down the trails at all.

    For preventative reasons I do like to always work a bit in the arena before and after I trail ride, just to prevent the horse from thinking, I want to go home to get unsaddled.
    towboater likes this.
         

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