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how to prepare a young horse to be ridden

10K views 111 replies 29 participants last post by  jmike 
#1 ·
i am trying to prep a young horse to be ridden
she is 2-1/2 years old now
i have been on her 2-3 times in the past 6 months for 5-10 minutes each time
i just started working her daily on Monday
She leads, backs up, and lunges at different gaits (walk/trot/lope) from previous work

she is a short and stout girl -- 14 hh (she will grow another 4 inches - string test)

i am looking for advice on cues she needs to learn for riding, how to teach those cues, and how to get more muscle on her so she is more stable for a heavy rider

i am expecting to spend the next 2 months working her 4-6 days a week on the ground -- followed by another month of riding her 4-6 days a week
 
#3 ·
I'd let her grow up before asking her to carry a heavy rider.

If you don't know the cues or how to teach them are you sure you're the right person to be training her?
that wasn't very helpful, but i appreciate you taking the time to respond.

she is a foundation bred quarter horse and will never be very tall.
most are started at 18-24 months
i've mostly left her alone up until now

advise on how to get her ready would be appreciated
 
#4 ·
Did you learn to drive a car by yourself?

Did you learn how to tie your shoes by yourself?

Would you go see a doctor who had completely taught himself?


There are some things in life that you just don't teach yourself without ANY hands-on help from another person. Training horses is one of those things.

Sure, we can give you lots of tips over the internet but the single most important thing we cannot help you with --> TIMING.

Timing is the most critical thing when you are training a young horse. Stop your cue too soon, and the horse doesn't make the connection between the cue and the response. Don't stop the cue soon enough and the horse has learned it can ignore you.

You need to at least take a lesson every now and then from someone who is experienced with starting a colt from the ground up. You don't have to ship them off to the trainer for 30 days, but you should get hands-on help.

This can be a potentially dangerous situation for you. It's the subtle signs that tell you a horse is about to do something. If you aren't experienced enough to know what those signs are, that's when we have people come on here and ask "why did my horse buck for no reason?". There's always a sign and a reason for every horse doing what it does. Some people just don't have the expertise to actually know what those signs are, and recognize them when they occur.
 
#5 ·
Is this your first colt? If so I would recommend getting help from someone in your area that can help you through the steps, younger ones can be very unpredictable and if you miss a step most likely you end up having to start all over or back up quite a few steps and re due them.

One thing that will help is driving her. Which requires you to be on the ground. You can either have her fully tacked up or you can just use a bridle and surcingle. You attache a lunge line to each side of the bridle, usually clipping on the bit, and go through the rings on a surcingle or through the stirrups if your using a saddle (make sure the stirrups are tied together by using bailing twine or something). The purpose of driving is to teach them the pressure of the bit, along with cues you would use in the saddle (like turning, backing, side passing). My boss absolutely swears by it and always has me start the young ones with it before getting on. There are too different positions you can be in, one is more advanced and the other is for those new to driving. The easiest way when you first start is to stand behind her, not right behind her of course, but enough that if she gets scared she wont hurt you. Being in this position is a lot easier for the person to control the horse and have them go where they want. The other position, when you've been doing it for a while and feel comfortable, is standing off to the side (for example like when you lunge her in a round pen you're in the middle of it, same concept here) You'll be in the middle as your horse moves around you. It's a lot more difficult but after I did driving for about month or so ,without realizing it ,I had started moving more towards the middle of the round pen while driving. Since it's easier to show someone how to drive then tell them I would look up some videos on driving horses so you know where to place your hands and how to ask for turns.

One thing that I like to do is to make sure that they know how to pivot from pressure. You can either use a crop/whip or just your finger. If I use my finger, I'll stand next to their barrel , a little behind their shoulder and apply pressure in the area where I would normally ask for when I want a horse to turn his hindquarters. So I just keep my finger (usually my thumb) and press in that area, I usually push into them sometimes if they just ignore me. When they do move I rub the area and ask again, this time with lighter pressure. I do that until they move of my hand from the slightest touch.
If you use a crop/whip it's basically the same process, instead you tap them with the crop/whip in a constant rhythm until they respond.

Another good thing to make sure your horse knows, is how to bend his head around. If you get in a bad situation (bucking, bolting , etc.) it's good to know that you can bend their head around in either direction to get them to stop. You just need them in a halter and you can work on it whenever, before you put her up or when she's just sitting around. All you do is stand near her shoulder and bring her head around as far as it will go. She probably wont want to go that far at first just from lack of flexibility. She'll want to most likely turn her hindquarters and start going in a circle, just follow her, keeping her head bent until she stops. When she stops look for some kind of release, usually they will bend a little more towards you and then bend back. When she does that release the pressure and praise her. And you just repeat the process on both sides till she's comfortable doing it whenever you ask. Also after she's comfortable bending you can start asking her to bend with a bridle on, and just put the pressure on the bit to get her to turn her head.

Most of the muscle they get is usually gained from under saddle work. You could lunge her as much as you want but it'll take longer for them to gain muscle on the ground then it will in the saddle. Not to mention she's too young to have that type of muscle now anyway, once you start doing more with her under saddle and when she's done growing she'll fill out more.

I would recommend not to work her 4-6 days a week. At least if you do, don't do the same thing everyday and keep the time short, like 20-30 min. Young colts have an attention span of ten-15 minutes and get a lot more frustrated then older horses. Plus since she's still a young too much work can sour them later on. Unless you're doing desensitizing, you can never do too much of that.

Hope that helps, can't think of anything else right now that would be beneficial to learn. If you need any other help just message me. Have fun.
 
#9 ·
Is this your first colt? If so I would recommend getting help from someone in your area that can help you through the steps, younger ones can be very unpredictable and if you miss a step most likely you end up having to start all over or back up quite a few steps and re due them.

One thing that will help is driving her. Which requires you to be on the ground. You can either have her fully tacked up or you can just use a bridle and surcingle. You attache a lunge line to each side of the bridle, usually clipping on the bit, and go through the rings on a surcingle or through the stirrups if your using a saddle (make sure the stirrups are tied together by using bailing twine or something). The purpose of driving is to teach them the pressure of the bit, along with cues you would use in the saddle (like turning, backing, side passing). My boss absolutely swears by it and always has me start the young ones with it before getting on. There are too different positions you can be in, one is more advanced and the other is for those new to driving. The easiest way when you first start is to stand behind her, not right behind her of course, but enough that if she gets scared she wont hurt you. Being in this position is a lot easier for the person to control the horse and have them go where they want. The other position, when you've been doing it for a while and feel comfortable, is standing off to the side (for example like when you lunge her in a round pen you're in the middle of it, same concept here) You'll be in the middle as your horse moves around you. It's a lot more difficult but after I did driving for about month or so ,without realizing it ,I had started moving more towards the middle of the round pen while driving. Since it's easier to show someone how to drive then tell them I would look up some videos on driving horses so you know where to place your hands and how to ask for turns.

One thing that I like to do is to make sure that they know how to pivot from pressure. You can either use a crop/whip or just your finger. If I use my finger, I'll stand next to their barrel , a little behind their shoulder and apply pressure in the area where I would normally ask for when I want a horse to turn his hindquarters. So I just keep my finger (usually my thumb) and press in that area, I usually push into them sometimes if they just ignore me. When they do move I rub the area and ask again, this time with lighter pressure. I do that until they move of my hand from the slightest touch.
If you use a crop/whip it's basically the same process, instead you tap them with the crop/whip in a constant rhythm until they respond.

Another good thing to make sure your horse knows, is how to bend his head around. If you get in a bad situation (bucking, bolting , etc.) it's good to know that you can bend their head around in either direction to get them to stop. You just need them in a halter and you can work on it whenever, before you put her up or when she's just sitting around. All you do is stand near her shoulder and bring her head around as far as it will go. She probably wont want to go that far at first just from lack of flexibility. She'll want to most likely turn her hindquarters and start going in a circle, just follow her, keeping her head bent until she stops. When she stops look for some kind of release, usually they will bend a little more towards you and then bend back. When she does that release the pressure and praise her. And you just repeat the process on both sides till she's comfortable doing it whenever you ask. Also after she's comfortable bending you can start asking her to bend with a bridle on, and just put the pressure on the bit to get her to turn her head.

Most of the muscle they get is usually gained from under saddle work. You could lunge her as much as you want but it'll take longer for them to gain muscle on the ground then it will in the saddle. Not to mention she's too young to have that type of muscle now anyway, once you start doing more with her under saddle and when she's done growing she'll fill out more.

I would recommend not to work her 4-6 days a week. At least if you do, don't do the same thing everyday and keep the time short, like 20-30 min. Young colts have an attention span of ten-15 minutes and get a lot more frustrated then older horses. Plus since she's still a young too much work can sour them later on. Unless you're doing desensitizing, you can never do too much of that.

Hope that helps, can't think of anything else right now that would be beneficial to learn. If you need any other help just message me. Have fun.
yes -- first filly (not sure why people say colt when colts are boys)

i like the idea of ground driving and planned on adding that for the 2nd month of ground work -- i have someone i can ask about how to set that up. Thank you for that.

Pivoting from pressure is something i also wanted to teach, but i was not even sure on where to begin. I know they are sensitive enough to feel a fly on a single muscle and twitch it to get it off -- so i wanted to make sure i did it as exact as possible from the ground. Thank you for the tip on this.

thanks for reminding me about flexability -- we have not started doing that yet, and i want to add it in next week as part of our warm up.

i understand it will be slow going to get her to muscle up without over taxing her, but i wanted to get her as far as i could without actually getting on her. I do have her lunge with the saddle on her, just once so far, but i plan to add it in more often to help with the muscling.


right now i am working her 45 minutes to an hour. we start with walking and whoa'ing for 5-10 minutes -- then i walk her to a different spot in the pasture and we work on walk/trot/whoa for 10-15 minutes -- we take a scratch and praise break -- then i back her up/lead her forward for 5-10 minutes --- then we trot/lope/whoa for a little while

although the work lasts for a while, i change it up often, and do not spend a long time with hard exercise.

thank you for the post -- that was very helpful
 
#6 ·
I personally wouldn't ask a horse that is 3 or just under 3 to carry a heavy rider at ALL let alone 4-6 days a week, not if you want the horse to remain sound over 8-10 years of age.. the harder they are worked as babies, the faster they wear out
 
#8 ·
I would wait until the horse is over three before starting to ride. Make sure he has good manners on the ground, do lots of groundwork. Then get him used to wearing the tack which you've probably already done. Then I would get on bareback to let him get used to having a rider, and this way you can quickly slide off instead of having to kick out of stirrups and whatnot.

Lunge him in the tack to make sure he knows how it feels and if he dislikes it, you won't be on him.

If this IS your first colt, ask someone with experience to come give you tips and help you out. Not entirely take over to where you get no experience. :)
 
#11 ·
I would wait until the horse is over three before starting to ride. Make sure he has good manners on the ground, do lots of groundwork. Then get him used to wearing the tack which you've probably already done. Then I would get on bareback to let him get used to having a rider, and this way you can quickly slide off instead of having to kick out of stirrups and whatnot.

Lunge him in the tack to make sure he knows how it feels and if he dislikes it, you won't be on him.

If this IS your first colt, ask someone with experience to come give you tips and help you out. Not entirely take over to where you get no experience. :)
i don't think bareback would be good for me since i do not have good balance and the saddle does a good job of distributing the weight. I have lunged her in tack recently -- saddle and bit - no reins
 
#17 ·
These are some things to remember when training a horse.
*apply pressure to the horse gradually when asking for something new never start asking with a lot of pressure always start with the slightest pressure than work your way up until the horse responds. You do not want to apply too much pressure so the horse ends up flipping their switch i.e. reacts out of either flight or fight

*Never reapply a cue if it results in bad behaviour instead redirect the horse's feet and then ask cue again

*Do not use excessive correction instead reward the horse for the slightest try even if the horse didn't do it correctly

*Always set the horse up for success, never ask a horse to do something that is too advanced. Remember horse prefer to take the road that leds to least resistance

Whenever I'm starting to work with a new horse I always assess the horses behaviour. So watch how the horse behaves in the paddock, while being led, being brushed, tied up. Does your horse get easily distracted, tense, relaxed, listening or does horse react with flight response or fight response. This can tell you how to train the horse.
 
#22 ·
These are some things to remember when training a horse.
*apply pressure to the horse gradually when asking for something new never start asking with a lot of pressure always start with the slightest pressure than work your way up until the horse responds. You do not want to apply too much pressure so the horse ends up flipping their switch i.e. reacts out of either flight or fight

*Never reapply a cue if it results in bad behaviour instead redirect the horse's feet and then ask cue again

*Do not use excessive correction instead reward the horse for the slightest try even if the horse didn't do it correctly

*Always set the horse up for success, never ask a horse to do something that is too advanced. Remember horse prefer to take the road that leds to least resistance

Whenever I'm starting to work with a new horse I always assess the horses behaviour. So watch how the horse behaves in the paddock, while being led, being brushed, tied up. Does your horse get easily distracted, tense, relaxed, listening or does horse react with flight response or fight response. This can tell you how to train the horse.
Thank you - that is good information.
i have had her for 14 months, so i am pretty familiar with her antics.
she is pushy and undisciplined.
fixing that is my primary goal.
i would like to get her to the point of being able to ride her as a long term goal
 
#18 ·
Here are some thoughts:
Can you back her one step at a time while she waits for the cue for the next step?
Can you back her in a circle, both clockwise, and counter clockwise?
Can you 'leg yield' from the ground both directions?
Can you move her shoulders over?
Can you move her hind end over?
Can you move her rib cage?

The first few rides are the most important, setting the foundation of her riding career for the rest of her life. I would recommend you have someone who knows how to ride put the first few rides on her.

If you do it yourself just remember you will make mistakes. Don't blame the horse. These mistakes are part of life, but be prepared to take the time to correct what your mistakes may cause her to do/become.

It may be 'cheaper' in the long run having a trainer put 30 or 60 days on her, vs. having to hire someone later to fix any and all problems.

Is your instructor teaching you cues now? How do you cue the horse you are taking lessons on?

Just some rambling thoughts for consideration.
 
#23 ·
Here are some thoughts:
Can you back her one step at a time while she waits for the cue for the next step?
Can you back her in a circle, both clockwise, and counter clockwise?
Can you 'leg yield' from the ground both directions?
Can you move her shoulders over?
Can you move her hind end over?
Can you move her rib cage?

The first few rides are the most important, setting the foundation of her riding career for the rest of her life. I would recommend you have someone who knows how to ride put the first few rides on her.

If you do it yourself just remember you will make mistakes. Don't blame the horse. These mistakes are part of life, but be prepared to take the time to correct what your mistakes may cause her to do/become.

It may be 'cheaper' in the long run having a trainer put 30 or 60 days on her, vs. having to hire someone later to fix any and all problems.

Is your instructor teaching you cues now? How do you cue the horse you are taking lessons on?

Just some rambling thoughts for consideration.
good thoughts and good considerations -- thank you

i am familiar with the cues from the saddle -- i am just not exactly sure how to translate those cues to the ground.

i would love to send her off for 30-60 days training -- i just can't afford it at the moment -- that might change in the next 3-6 months, it might not ...
 
#19 ·
I agree with the other posters that you are not anywhere near ready to be starting horses under saddle yet, but saying anything further on the subject is just beating a dead horse. I also disagree with young horses carrying a heavier rider that early on in their life, but again saying more would be pointless.

Don't give yourself a timeline, timelines are for people not horses. If she's doing well, end on a good note, if she isn't ready for something don't push it because it's on the timeline.

Many people spend too long on groundwork without getting much of anything done. I personally spend anywhere from a few days to a few weeks on the ground before I am riding. The horses that take the least amount of time are the ones that don't have much handling. It's the retraining projects that buck, bolt, rear etc that take longer. A young horses doesn't need to know a whole lot about a lot in order to make a safe riding horse. As long as that horse knows a whole lot about a little, and those little things are important building blocks, you're set.

You do NOT need to drill things. Go through your groundwork and if something is good, move on.

I start with roundpenning. Can my horse move off a suggestion at a w/t/l? Can my horse change directions by turning into me? Can my horse draw in toward me? Can my horse disengage their hindquarters off my body language? If all of those things are working, I may only round pen for literally a couple of minutes. If something isn't working, work on it and don't worry about the time frame of your session. As long as you are keeping your horses attention, it's all good.

Then, is my horse polite about being haltered? Will my horse stand still and be relaxed for desensitizing to noise, movement and sensation? Again, you don't need to use a whole lot of things to desensitize to. A lunge whip, plastic bag, a lead rope and a saddle blanket are about all I use. You are teaching your horse to relax to stimulus that isn't asking them to move. If everything is good, move on. Again, if something isn't working, fix it.

Then, can my horse disengage their hindquarters off of pressure? Can my horse lunge at a w/t/l without putting any pressure on the halter? Can they disengage their hindquarters, move their shoulders over and go the opposite direction? Can they do a rollback on the lunge line? Can my horse flex laterally correctly? Will my horse back out of my space? Remain light when i'm leading and trot off in hand, not lag at a walk, etc.

Then of course the normal handling things; can my horse tie, can I pick up my horses feet, etc?

When the groundwork is good, repeat it saddled. I honestly don't get my groundwork that great before I do it saddled. As soon as the horse is safe to be around, everything is done with a saddle on. If I was less experienced, i would do more. Many horses get their panties in a bunch the first few times they are saddled and seemingly 'forget' how to do things they know how to do. Because of this, I do most of my groundwork saddled. Lots of people will turn their horse loose while saddled to get them used to it. I do not, I want it to be crystal clear what is allowed and not while saddled. While under my supervision I can correct a horse is they buck while saddled, if they're loose I can't. I also don't have spare saddles laying around that I'm ok with a horse rolling in.

When you get ready for those first rides, I highly recommend letting your instructor do it. A young horses movement is unbalanced and they need an extremely balanced rider to stay out of their way while they figure things out. I w/t/l my horses on their very first ride if they are relaxed enough for it. Forward is the most important thing, without forward motion you can't train a horse.

For more in depth information on how to cue for things, I have dozens of posts regarding this information.
 
#24 ·
I agree with the other posters that you are not anywhere near ready to be starting horses under saddle yet, but saying anything further on the subject is just beating a dead horse. I also disagree with young horses carrying a heavier rider that early on in their life, but again saying more would be pointless.

Don't give yourself a timeline, timelines are for people not horses. If she's doing well, end on a good note, if she isn't ready for something don't push it because it's on the timeline.

Many people spend too long on groundwork without getting much of anything done. I personally spend anywhere from a few days to a few weeks on the ground before I am riding. The horses that take the least amount of time are the ones that don't have much handling. It's the retraining projects that buck, bolt, rear etc that take longer. A young horses doesn't need to know a whole lot about a lot in order to make a safe riding horse. As long as that horse knows a whole lot about a little, and those little things are important building blocks, you're set.

You do NOT need to drill things. Go through your groundwork and if something is good, move on.

I start with roundpenning. Can my horse move off a suggestion at a w/t/l? Can my horse change directions by turning into me? Can my horse draw in toward me? Can my horse disengage their hindquarters off my body language? If all of those things are working, I may only round pen for literally a couple of minutes. If something isn't working, work on it and don't worry about the time frame of your session. As long as you are keeping your horses attention, it's all good.

Then, is my horse polite about being haltered? Will my horse stand still and be relaxed for desensitizing to noise, movement and sensation? Again, you don't need to use a whole lot of things to desensitize to. A lunge whip, plastic bag, a lead rope and a saddle blanket are about all I use. You are teaching your horse to relax to stimulus that isn't asking them to move. If everything is good, move on. Again, if something isn't working, fix it.

Then, can my horse disengage their hindquarters off of pressure? Can my horse lunge at a w/t/l without putting any pressure on the halter? Can they disengage their hindquarters, move their shoulders over and go the opposite direction? Can they do a rollback on the lunge line? Can my horse flex laterally correctly? Will my horse back out of my space? Remain light when i'm leading and trot off in hand, not lag at a walk, etc.

Then of course the normal handling things; can my horse tie, can I pick up my horses feet, etc?

When the groundwork is good, repeat it saddled. I honestly don't get my groundwork that great before I do it saddled. As soon as the horse is safe to be around, everything is done with a saddle on. If I was less experienced, i would do more. Many horses get their panties in a bunch the first few times they are saddled and seemingly 'forget' how to do things they know how to do. Because of this, I do most of my groundwork saddled. Lots of people will turn their horse loose while saddled to get them used to it. I do not, I want it to be crystal clear what is allowed and not while saddled. While under my supervision I can correct a horse is they buck while saddled, if they're loose I can't. I also don't have spare saddles laying around that I'm ok with a horse rolling in.

When you get ready for those first rides, I highly recommend letting your instructor do it. A young horses movement is unbalanced and they need an extremely balanced rider to stay out of their way while they figure things out. I w/t/l my horses on their very first ride if they are relaxed enough for it. Forward is the most important thing, without forward motion you can't train a horse.

For more in depth information on how to cue for things, I have dozens of posts regarding this information.
thanks for the information and not beating a dead horse :p

the timeline i have in my head is subject to change and depends on circumstances and progress

I agree with what you say on groundwork and some spending too much time on it -- for me -- my first goal is gaining respect and leadership -- my second goal is to get her in shape physically --- so i do not mind spending more time on the ground and being more patient with her progress
 
#25 ·
You said you still take lessons, are they at the barn your horses is at, and if not would it be possible to take your horse there every so often to ride in your lesson? (If your trainer is ok with that)

Even though I have experience training horses, know what I need to teach, how to do it and when, I will still ride the green filly I'm working for my trainer in a lesson every so often especially if there is something I have a question about or isn't progressing nearly as fast as it should. He trusts me to train on my own, but that doesn't mean I know single every way to deal with every single problem.

I agree with those saying you are not ready, so if there is any way at all you can work with a professional even if it is only on occasion the that is the way to go. Every horse has different needs, and you will get better advice from a trainer who can see how your horse behaves and reacts to different methods than the internet. There's no set timeline, and a trainer can help you see when it is time to progress to the next step, when to change methods, and help you figure out what is best to do next.
 
#29 ·
You said you still take lessons, are they at the barn your horses is at, and if not would it be possible to take your horse there every so often to ride in your lesson? (If your trainer is ok with that)

Even though I have experience training horses, know what I need to teach, how to do it and when, I will still ride the green filly I'm working for my trainer in a lesson every so often especially if there is something I have a question about or isn't progressing nearly as fast as it should. He trusts me to train on my own, but that doesn't mean I know single every way to deal with every single problem.

I agree with those saying you are not ready, so if there is any way at all you can work with a professional even if it is only on occasion the that is the way to go. Every horse has different needs, and you will get better advice from a trainer who can see how your horse behaves and reacts to different methods than the internet. There's no set timeline, and a trainer can help you see when it is time to progress to the next step, when to change methods, and help you figure out what is best to do next.
i don't have a horse trailer so my horses stay at my house
 
#27 ·
Please note - your horse is not pushy and undisciplined. She hasn't made a choice to behave this way or another. She is just a young, untrained horse that does only what you allow her and is being what she is - a horse. Don't put labels on her, put training, patience and TIME in her, and she will turn out just fine. However, I do agree with the others here that you are in no way ready to start a youngster without professional help.
 
#28 ·
"Here are some thoughts:
Can you back her one step at a time while she waits for the cue for the next step?
Can you back her in a circle, both clockwise, and counter clockwise?
Can you 'leg yield' from the ground both directions?
Can you move her shoulders over?
Can you move her hind end over?
Can you move her rib cage?

The first few rides are the most important, setting the foundation of her riding career for the rest of her life. I would recommend you have someone who knows how to ride put the first few rides on her."

My question is can you effectively, efficiently and correctly ask and receive these of a well trained horse? ( I ask this not for an answer for me but for you to answer for yourself) There are others that can be added to the list. These are all basic cues that you need as a rider and they need to be automatic. I think you have the patience and discipline to see it through but you need someone holding your hand through it the first time. Does that always happen - no but if you can accomplish the above repeatedly on a well trained mount consistently then your chances of success are higher. Everyone of us that has started a young horse had to start somewhere. Read, watch, ride. The more you do those things the better you will be prepared to work with a youngster.
 
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#32 ·
"Here are some thoughts:
Can you back her one step at a time while she waits for the cue for the next step?
Can you back her in a circle, both clockwise, and counter clockwise?
Can you 'leg yield' from the ground both directions?
Can you move her shoulders over?
Can you move her hind end over?
Can you move her rib cage?

The first few rides are the most important, setting the foundation of her riding career for the rest of her life. I would recommend you have someone who knows how to ride put the first few rides on her."

My question is can you effectively, efficiently and correctly ask and receive these of a well trained horse? ( I ask this not for an answer for me but for you to answer for yourself) There are others that can be added to the list. These are all basic cues that you need as a rider and they need to be automatic. I think you have the patience and discipline to see it through but you need someone holding your hand through it the first time. Does that always happen - no but if you can accomplish the above repeatedly on a well trained mount consistently then your chances of success are higher. Everyone of us that has started a young horse had to start somewhere. Read, watch, ride. The more you do those things the better you will be prepared to work with a youngster.
i am only familiar with the basics
 
#33 ·
Definitely do not attempt bareback on a very green/unbroke horse. I'm not sure where that advice came from xD

Ground driving is a great suggestion, as it can prepare a horse for pressure and can even promote collection/suppleness.

Minimal round-penning can help too--you can teach verbal cues at any age. :) Just be careful, because that hard circle can be hard on joints that haven't closed yet. (Well, any joints, really... but those in particular)

I'm curious what your vet says about her joints? Just something to consider as you move forward.

One of the best ways to learn to break a horse is to get hands on help. Are there any mobile trainers in your area? I think you and her would both benefit greatly from some hands-on help.
 
#34 ·
Definitely do not attempt bareback on a very green/unbroke horse. I'm not sure where that advice came from xD

Ground driving is a great suggestion, as it can prepare a horse for pressure and can even promote collection/suppleness.

Minimal round-penning can help too--you can teach verbal cues at any age. :) Just be careful, because that hard circle can be hard on joints that haven't closed yet. (Well, any joints, really... but those in particular)

I'm curious what your vet says about her joints? Just something to consider as you move forward.

One of the best ways to learn to break a horse is to get hands on help. Are there any mobile trainers in your area? I think you and her would both benefit greatly from some hands-on help.
Thank you for the ground driving advice, this is something i will definitely look into.
I am still working on getting her to recognize my cues, and she has them mostly down.
She still gets distracted looking towards her buddies instead of paying attention to me.
I don't have a round-pen - so i am using a 35 foot lunge line.
We spend most of our lunging at a walk/trot
I am not a fan of working a horse just to work her, although i do want to get her in shape.

I tried to give her away to my farrier at some point, but he just never got around to picking her up.
I would like some hands on help, but i just don't have anyone available and i can't afford to send her away.
I am basically just doing what i can, and i am taking my time doing it.
 
#37 ·
I've been watching this thread but haven't commented yet.

You have to remember that with young horses, their attention span is short. You have to work on building that. It is normal for her to look away for her buddies.

As for where to cue for moving her front or rear, I don't worry so much on the ground until I can put a saddle on. When you saddle her, use your stirrups to find where to put pressure on her. No sense in teaching her on the ground with pressure on a spot that your foot won't reach.
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#39 ·
I've been watching this thread but haven't commented yet.

You have to remember that with young horses, their attention span is short. You have to work on building that. It is normal for her to look away for her buddies.

As for where to cue for moving her front or rear, I don't worry so much on the ground until I can put a saddle on. When you saddle her, use your stirrups to find where to put pressure on her. No sense in teaching her on the ground with pressure on a spot that your foot won't reach.
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thanks, you usually give me good advice
seems to me that some are advocating that i get that sort of control from the ground
or maybe i am misunderstanding
i do work her with a saddle and a bit, but not all the time


What I see most often with youngsters that are trained by firsttimers that have time and patience and a willingness to learn but no hands on help is a horse that responds to one riders cues - the rider that trained them. Not necessarily a bad thing if the horse stays with you and you are the one that continues to ride. It only becomes a problem if she is sold and they new rider does not ride exactly the same as chances are your cues will not match perfectly what is standard. It can mean problems for the new pair and retraining on the horses part. She seems to be a forgiving horse and if handled correctly even if sold could transition fine. Just keep this in mind as you move forward. Ground driving incorrectly can also create issues and it is a good idea to learn from someone hands on, on a trained horse. Not always possible and you do the best you can with what you have. Watch and try to pick up the basics best you can. I have found trying to train a person on an untrained horse an issue.
also very good advice, and another one of the reasons i am asking on the forums
i would like to keep it as standard as i can
i can't teach something i don't know
so i am sticking to the extreme basics
I understand the concepts of teaching (pressure, release, timing, purpose)
i just don't know the steps and details
 
#38 ·
What I see most often with youngsters that are trained by firsttimers that have time and patience and a willingness to learn but no hands on help is a horse that responds to one riders cues - the rider that trained them. Not necessarily a bad thing if the horse stays with you and you are the one that continues to ride. It only becomes a problem if she is sold and they new rider does not ride exactly the same as chances are your cues will not match perfectly what is standard. It can mean problems for the new pair and retraining on the horses part. She seems to be a forgiving horse and if handled correctly even if sold could transition fine. Just keep this in mind as you move forward. Ground driving incorrectly can also create issues and it is a good idea to learn from someone hands on, on a trained horse. Not always possible and you do the best you can with what you have. Watch and try to pick up the basics best you can. I have found trying to train a person on an untrained horse an issue.
 
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#45 ·
I will disagree with this to a point. The basics are the basics, stopping, turning, forward and backing up, no matter western or English, barrel racing or endurance, dressage or trail riding. When the training goes more advanced, there can be problems.

Where I do agree is that even different professional trainers will use different cues. Even in the same discipline. I'm not a professional myself but I have worked with some so called "finished" horses that didn't know how to sidepass or even flex at all.
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#41 ·
We can't really convey the proper training technique as it applies to an individual pair over the internet. We can give general guidelines and some have but we can't judge pressure, release, timing and purpose without being there to see both of you and the response you generate. Ask your trainer if you are competent in his/her opinion of the very basics with a trained mount. Ask if he/she thinks they are automatic for you at this point. If they are then you should be fine with those basics. Does she (the filly) respond immediately or does she have to think about it? Does she give an indication she is confused, concerned or getting aggravated? If she responds to your cues in a positive manner quickly and obediently you are getting your point across. If she is confused time to stop and go to your lessons with this in mind. If she is concerned then ask ask why. Is it lack of attention, more focus on what is going on around her and less on you then time to stop (on a good note) and ask if she is ready mentally for this. If she is aggravated then time to have someone evaluate you both separately. The confusion can be part of the process but should not last.
 
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#42 ·
i will ask. she is generally straightforward with my progress
instead of asking how i did, i always ask what i can improve on (that helps)

we were just talking about that in our last lesson
she said she can tell some of the things we are working on are becoming more automatic and i have too think less about them. other things i still have to think about, and even some other things i need to really think about but don't always work (legs at a trot *was* one of those issues).

depends on what i am asking. if i am asking to move her hip, she does it without hesitation - if i am asking her to move her shoulder to the left or the right before getting her moving - she has to think about it -- if i am asking her to back up, she has to think longer

backing up, sometimes she acts confused -- 3 months ago, i could back her up for 20-30 yards without issues -- on Saturday, i had trouble backing her up 4-5 steps

Once in a while she will get aggravated, and then she will get flashy -- that has not happened in a while though -- of course, i haven't touched her in 3 months
 
#44 ·
Personally I don't tap the hip to move the hindend. My heel is no where near the hip. When you have the saddle on her take the stirrup and move it back a bit and use pressure from the stirrup. Release when she complies.

If you use the whip at the hip, use a stick or crop while riding and cue with the leg first followed by the tap on the hip from the stick or crop. She'll get it eventually.

When training your filly, remember when you control her feet, you control her mind. Hence moving her body where and when you want and she complies, before throwing a leg over.

Once in the saddle you should know the feeling of each hoof moving/ landing.

I'm not advocating you don't try. I'm advocation educating yourself first. And keeping the lessons short for her and you. She is in kindergarten, therefore has the attention span of six year old.

One other thought: It sounds as if you have thought of selling her. I would rather buy an unbroken horse versus one that is trained poorly. She may be easier to sell as untrained versus questionably trained.
 
#47 ·
Personally I don't tap the hip to move the hindend. My heel is no where near the hip. When you have the saddle on her take the stirrup and move it back a bit and use pressure from the stirrup. Release when she complies.

If you use the whip at the hip, use a stick or crop while riding and cue with the leg first followed by the tap on the hip from the stick or crop. She'll get it eventually.

When training your filly, remember when you control her feet, you control her mind. Hence moving her body where and when you want and she complies, before throwing a leg over.

Once in the saddle you should know the feeling of each hoof moving/ landing.

I'm not advocating you don't try. I'm advocation educating yourself first. And keeping the lessons short for her and you. She is in kindergarten, therefore has the attention span of six year old.

One other thought: It sounds as if you have thought of selling her. I would rather buy an unbroken horse versus one that is trained poorly. She may be easier to sell as untrained versus questionably trained.
not looking to sell her, but i am ok with giving her away to a good home
i am not in it for money, and would flat out refuse to send her to a crappy home

if i take the time and get her rideable, she stays
 
#49 ·
Usandpets I should have been more clear. Yes the basics are the basics but as a new trainer and new rider does he have the basics down in a manner that is consistent with the rest of us. This is just a made up example of an extreme nature but say I teach my horse to go forward by tapping her on the head between the ears because I didn't realize there was another way and I once saw someone get a horse to move that way. If you bought my horse and tried to get her to move forward by any other means and she exploded where does the fault lie? In my experience riding horses that have been trained by self taught riders that become trainers the obvious isn't always so obvious and I have had to ask to watch them ride or drive and see what their cues are sometimes. They aren't what you would think more times than not. He is taking lessons so if his application is consistent and automatic he shouldn't have a problem but when you are new and unsure and you haven't gotten that much ride time under your belt with no one to watch I would ask, are his cues correct (standard), correctly applied, as well as consistently applied. Since I am not there and I know from his posts he is new to riding as well as training I pointed that out as something for him to consider if he is looking to eventually sell her. I prefer an unhandled horse of any age than one that has been handled by someone that may not know what they are doing. I also said this was my experience. Yours sounds like it has been different.
 
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#50 ·
Maybe I am missing something? Is it that there are different ways to accomplish the basics and get the same result? Or that there are standard cues. Perhaps I should have said basic cues that are similar enough that the meaning is not mistaken in the translation to the horse? I should have also added primarily self taught riders transitioning to trainers.
 
#51 ·
You are right QtrBel. There should be basic or standard cues for the basics. For me, right rein to turn right, left rein to turn left, both reins to stop or backup, and squeeze both legs for forward. After that, anything else is what I start considering advanced.

I had one person that wanted me to start his horse but he wanted me to train to turn by using the inside leg. Left turn was left rein and left leg. Right was the right rein and right leg. I told him that I would get the horse ride able with the basics and he could train the horse that way if he wanted. I assumed that he was told that gets the horse to bend for the turn.

One of the horses we got from a friend had different cues for walk, trot and lope. One bump for walk, two for trot, and three for lope. I had to go back and get the horse the way I wanted. Squeeze to increase speed. Granted that those may be the cues for a show horse or not, I don't know because we don't show. I wanted the horse to respond to my cues while trail riding.
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#52 ·
You are right QtrBel. There should be basic or standard cues for the basics. For me, right rein to turn right, left rein to turn left, both reins to stop or backup, and squeeze both legs for forward. After that, anything else is what I start considering advanced.
i started laying the outside rein across the neck before engaging the inside rein for turns

for me a left turn =
right rein (outside) across the neck + squeeze right leg (outside)
then pull left rein (inside)

unless i want some bend in the turn (only happens when the trainer tells me to get some bend) -- then i squeeze left leg (inside)


I had one person that wanted me to start his horse but he wanted me to train to turn by using the inside leg. Left turn was left rein and left leg. Right was the right rein and right leg. I told him that I would get the horse ride able with the basics and he could train the horse that way if he wanted. I assumed that he was told that gets the horse to bend for the turn.

One of the horses we got from a friend had different cues for walk, trot and lope. One bump for walk, two for trot, and three for lope. I had to go back and get the horse the way I wanted. Squeeze to increase speed. Granted that those may be the cues for a show horse or not, I don't know because we don't show. I wanted the horse to respond to my cues while trail riding.
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see - i have been doing the exact opposite of that
i would squeeze and suck myself into the saddle to slow down
 
#53 ·
Everyone has to start somewhere! Just pick the cue you want her to have a specific response to, and repeat until she does it, and immediately quit and reward. If you are asking for forward motion, do whatever it takes to get that, then be still and let it happen. I usually carry a crop with the young ones, for encouragement.

Always LOOK where you want to go, and they will follow your body eventually. If you feel frustration coming on, find a good response, and quit. If they even ACT like they are going to buck, I get off and lunge, then try again. I have never had a horse "take advantage" of this. I am old and do not like pain.
 
#54 ·
Since you are going ahead, you might try "Modern Horseman's Countdown to Broke":

The Modern Horseman's Countdown to Broke: Real Do-It-Yourself Horse Training in 33 Comprehensive Steps: Sean Patrick, Dr. Robert M. Miller: 9781570764196: Amazon.com: Books

250+ pages with good advice and a sequential approach, including pictures - a lot more info that the Internet will provide.

You might also try "Horse Control: The Young Horse" by Tom Roberts:

http://www.amazon.com/Horse-control...sr=8-1&keywords=horse+control+the+young+horse
 
#55 ·
Since you are going ahead, you might try "Modern Horseman's Countdown to Broke":

The Modern Horseman's Countdown to Broke: Real Do-It-Yourself Horse Training in 33 Comprehensive Steps: Sean Patrick, Dr. Robert M. Miller: 9781570764196: Amazon.com: Books

250+ pages with good advice and a sequential approach, including pictures - a lot more info that the Internet will provide.

You might also try "Horse Control: The Young Horse" by Tom Roberts:

Horse control-the young horse: The handling, breaking-in and early schooling of your own young horse: Thomas Alexander Roberts: 9780959941319: Amazon.com: Books
thanks bsms -- that first one looks like exactly what i need.
 
#64 ·
Your safety may be your own concern, but you are a family man. Do not be so selfish.

Do this right the first time. Get instruction. Either that, or wait till she is so screwed up under saddle and pay MORE for instruction to fix it. Your choice, but I know that even with years experience, and the opportunity to work with all kinds of horses I needed help when I had a very easy and forward thinking youngster.

You have had her for 14 months, and she is still undisciplined. That is COMPLETELY unacceptable. You also cannot expect a young horse to learn something, sit in a field for months and then be able to do the same thing. You either didn't teach her correctly, or you are asking far too much.

There is no shame in asking for help, and no one on the internet can teach you. Get a trainer who will help you. Youngsters are not like riding a balanced, educated horse. It is SO easy to get wrong and so hard to fix it. Once you've learnt the skills, you will have them for life. But don't endanger your life because you're being bull headed, or ruin a young horse's education because you think you can read everything online.
 
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