I dont know what to do (sorry long post) - Page 3

       The Horse Forum > Training Horses > Horse Training

I dont know what to do (sorry long post)

This is a discussion on I dont know what to do (sorry long post) within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category

Like Tree44Likes

LinkBack Thread Tools
    09-14-2012, 11:10 AM
Yup-agree. Any trainer worth their salt does a contract as far as what the payment will be, expectations, etc. I know that here in the Mid atlantic, where things are pretty expensive, I paid $800/mo for training last winter. That included board, riding 4-5 days a week BY A TRAINER, and they helped me for free when I wanted to go ride. And-this was a top ranked reining SHOW barn! It was all in writing, no doubt what the expectations were on either side.

I would also bring the horse home. I would suggest that if you decide to do this on your own you do lots of watching of good training videos, and I personally would start in an area like a round pen, which IMO, makes it less likely for you to lose control. I would start very gently, from the beginning and make your own assessment of what your horse knows and doesn't. Take nothing for granted-treat him like he knows nothing, and be pleasantly surprised if he does. But-don't waste another dime on this woman.
loosie and DRichmond like this.
Sponsored Links
    09-30-2012, 12:15 AM
Ok well after giving the trainer a full month with my horse I brought him home yesterday. If anything he was more difficult to load in the trailer coming home than he was going to her place. After a month at the trainers she tells me he is still not ready to be ridden. I am beyond frustrated. She suggests that I continue ground work and maybe pony him. I have never ponied a horse before and I think there is a potential to get my other horse hurt. Does anyone have any other suggestions I might try? I can't afford to ship him off to another trainer (at least not for a while) and there comes a point where I feel like I am just throwing good money after bad.
    09-30-2012, 12:24 AM
Hmmm I hear this term 'cow-boying' all the time.....what's the definition?

Because I had a REAL old cowboy get on one of the horses I was riding once and he got the piss and vinegar out of the horse in a firm but not rough way, and that guy saved my freakin neck and made my day......I actually find the term referring to a 'cow-boy' quite insulting to all those real cowboys who train on their own, don't come to forums for help and have the guts to ride a horse out while also having the brains to distinguish what's wrong with a horse......

In regards to your horse and his regression.....I wouldn't discount a knowledgeable cowboy....sometimes simple logic with a horse is better than complicated muddling.....
loosie and thenrie like this.
    09-30-2012, 12:35 AM
Well that really stinks, I just finished reading all the other posts. What an awful trainer. Sounds like she clearly undid any training you did.

Here's what I'd do.
First call the vet, get blood work done. Morgans are very easy keepers, they don't do well on hot feed. My mare is a Canadian (the ancestors of Morgans, essentially a draft Morgan) I just needed to completely eliminate grain from her diet and replace it with a Ration Balancer (Thanks DesertHorse for teaching me!). Personally, if your boy is an easy keeper and is on any sort of grain I'd switch him over to a ration balancer instead. Talk to your vet about feed options. They'll also probably take blood tests, you'll want to know particularly about deficiencies in Magnesium, Selenium and B1. I had to supplement my mare with additional Magnesium and B1. So figure out his diet and give it a couple months to really show the full change. I have seen radical changes in my mare in less than a month, I've alsostarted her on Omega 3's which has made her allergy to bugs less severe, I mention this because it's a common problem in Morgans too, if that's affecting your boy it may be causing him extreme discomfort. My mare knows bugs cause her to be miserable, she won't leave her run-in stall once the sun starts going down. If you work with him later in the day when the bugs are bad his nerves may be up. They tend to get anxious and flighty when their incredibly uncomfortable from the itchies.
In the meantime continue his ground work, work him again until he's yielding every inch of himself readily with just your focal cue. Meaning you move into his space and imply that you want him to move, meaning you don't even need to touch him anymore.
Then I'd work on lunging again, when he's responding again to your verbal and focal cues, reading your body language and being respectful, I'd begin line-driving. This means driving him around from the ground behind him, obviously without a cart or anything, and stand sort of to one side. You can use the saddle rings or stirrups to run two short lunge lines through, don't use one so big you'll get tangled up in. Start by lunging him at the walk with the two reins, then, using the outside rein, ask for short straight lines. Repeat this until you can ground drive him quite well all around, just as if you were riding him. Eventually you can practice this on trails too, if you're comfortable. But at that point it's time to start backing him again. He clearly knew how to be a good horse, he still knows, he's just hot. So, I'd check his feed and make sure there's no deficiencies, repeat his skills, it'll probably go much faster than the first time, then work on line-driving. Line-driving is great for letting little things show up that would only show up when riding, little things that could be big things if you were on his back.

I'd also, if you can afford it, look for a trainer who can come to your property and teach you how to work with your horse. No real trainer is completely dependent on an arena or round pen. If they say they need one they're not worth hiring. They're beneficial tools that may speed things up but they aren't needed. You should see if there's a trainer who will let you do the work, that way you can learn and build your own confidence, but with the assurance and guidance of a professional keeping you safe.

Good luck, I'd love to see pics, I love Morgans!

ETA: This may sound obvious, but I'd also check his tack. A horse's body can change a great deal in a year, especially a year out of work - he could just be rebelling against ill-fitted tack?
loosie likes this.
    09-30-2012, 12:37 AM
Muppet, I think the term refer's to old-style cowboys, who 'ride the buck out of them' - ride them until they give up sort of thing. If they don't break then tie them to a post no food or water for a day and try again. That sort of thing is what I think people are referring to when they say 'cowboy-ing'.

But I agree, the cowboys I know are gentler than most kittens. I think it's referring more to an 'old style' than the actual cowboy himself. Which is why I say 'old style' not 'cowboy-ing' :P
loosie likes this.
    09-30-2012, 12:42 AM
I would love to see pictures of your boy! I am sorry you have had the experiences you have. You paid for him to get training it doesn't sound like he got- I would be expecting 3-6 sessions of work with him done per week if I sent my boy to a trainer, especially one so pricey, not the bare handful it sounds like your boy got (and was written off during).

I am not sure what you want to do, as it sounds like you need a confidence builder rather than a retraining project, but selling him and getting a kids type horse may be a reasonable idea. Keeping him and reintroducing him and you both to riding taking baby steps may also be a very good option as well, especially if you can get an instructor or trainer who will work with you both! It does sound like, from your description, there probably are big holes in his training, but if he was so good with your hubby last year, I don't think that that should hold you back if you're willing to train and fill those holes in yourself when you find them.

Good luck!
    09-30-2012, 12:55 AM
Weren't the Dorrance brothers cowboys??

OP, yes, sounds like a rotten deal all round. I would recommend you find a good trainer, hopefully one that will teach you along with your horse. If you don't want to/can't find a *good* trainer, to fix the mess it sounds like that woman(wouldn't call her a trainer after your story) made of your horse, the only other option is to do it yourself. So start educating yourself Sounds like you've made a good start.

While I'm not a Parelli follower & have some probs with some of his newer stuff, I think his book & basic principles/lessons - eg. '7 Games' are a great help in teaching people how to teach/deal with/listen to horses. Clinton Anderson & some others seem very similar to Parelli, so it comes down to which style/personality you like the best I reckon. Also re understanding your horse's bodylanguage & behaviour better, I think Parelli's 'horseanality' stuff is worth reading - just don't let it encourage you to pigeonhole your horse though!

Another thing that I reckon is invaluable to learn, no matter what style of training/riding you want to do is learn the principles of behavioural/learning psychology/training. Sounds heavy but not really & I think learning the principles behind 'clicker training' is probably a good place to learn the gist.

**You can spend any amount of money on Parelli stuff if you so desire, but you'll find all the basics online for free.
PunksTank likes this.
    09-30-2012, 01:00 AM
Thanks PuunksTank for the advice I will get a vet out to do some bloodwork. No he isnt on any grain except for a handfulof Nutrena safe choice but I have been looking into ratioon balancers to feed him instead. When the trainer was talking about "cowboying" him she meant someone who was a good enough rider to just get on him and ride it out so to speak. She thinks this was probably how he was trained in the first place and that's why he never really accepted it.
Sharpie I do have another horse and I have gained a lot of confidence back but my other horse is getting older and I want a 2nd riding horse. I can't afford 3 horses so I have to do something.
PunksTank likes this.
    09-30-2012, 01:09 AM
Loosie I think you are right I am going to have to start dealing with it myself. He has awesome ground manners and is very light and responsive. He is still nervous about bags waving around him (and other sacking out items) no matter how much we do it . I am not sure it is in his nature to ever become really laid back and comfortable with it. He doesn't jump around or anything he is just tense and has a worried look. It takes forever to get him to drop his head and lick or chew a little.
Do you folks think getting a helper to lunge him while I am on him or to lead him for the first few times I back him would be a good idea? Or would it cause more problems?
    09-30-2012, 01:12 AM
Originally Posted by ARTEMISBLOSSOM    
When the trainer was talking about "cowboying" him she meant someone who was a good enough rider to just get on him and ride it out so to speak.
Well you should be able to do enough preparatory work to avoid having too many issues once aboard, but it's definitely advisable to ensure the rider(at least for the first few handfuls of rides) is good enough to stay put if/when the horse reacts. It will be vital to find a rider like that if the horse already has some 'hiccups' instilled under saddle. Sounds like this woman wasn't a confident, competent rider either. At least if she hardly got on him, she didn't reinforce those lessons much!
PunksTank likes this.

Quick Reply
Please help keep the Horse Forum enjoyable by reporting rude posts.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the The Horse Forum forums, you must first register.

Already have a Horse Forum account?
Members are allowed only one account per person at the Horse Forum, so if you've made an account here in the past you'll need to continue using that account. Please do not create a new account or you may lose access to the Horse Forum. If you need help recovering your existing account, please Contact Us. We'll be glad to help!

New to the Horse Forum?
Please choose a username you will be satisfied with using for the duration of your membership at the Horse Forum. We do not change members' usernames upon request because that would make it difficult for everyone to keep track of who is who on the forum. For that reason, please do not incorporate your horse's name into your username so that you are not stuck with a username related to a horse you may no longer have some day, or use any other username you may no longer identify with or care for in the future.

User Name:
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:


Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.

Old Thread Warning
This thread is more than 90 days old. When a thread is this old, it is often better to start a new thread rather than post to it. However, If you feel you have something of value to add to this particular thread, you can do so by checking the box below before submitting your post.

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Please post pics you dont mind me drawing :D back again Horse Artwork 12 06-05-2011 11:10 PM
My holiday!!! Sorry dont know where else to post this LoveStory10 Horse Pictures 2 04-07-2010 07:01 PM

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:24 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0