Kicking weanling

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Kicking weanling

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    10-16-2013, 12:02 PM
Kicking weanling

I have a 6 month old filly that has been handled since birth, in fact she has been shown ( and won ) at halter. She has always been a bit of a handful when she wasn't getting her way however we have worked thru it, never giving in to her. She has been on pasture for a month and it was now time to bring her in for the winter. She is in beautiful condition but winters can be rough here and I plan to show her again in the spring. She seems to have a real temper, when I lead her where she doesn't feel like going, she rears and recently has started kicking out at me. No doubt she is aiming at me! My natural response is to really get after her but not sure what the most effective way would be, looking for suggestions. She is a registered Appaloosa out of a very gentle Thoroughbred race mare.
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    10-16-2013, 12:21 PM
Carry a dressage whip or a crop. The second she starts to rear, whack her across the front legs, then make her back up until she submits. Rearing on the lead and striking are seriously dangerous issues that need to be addressed immediately with a serious "Come to Jesus" meeting.

It sounds to me like she's been allowed to get away with being a snot on the lead, so it's just escalated.

My gelding half reared and struck at me ONCE. I was trying to desensitize him to clippers (keep in mind that he was a 15.2-15.3hh 1300lbs 2.5yo at the time who had minimal handling before I got him as a 2yo). His front hoof caught me in the upper thigh as he struck out. I had a crop dangling from my wrist and within a second of him going up and striking, I grabbed that crop and went after him like the world was ending. My best friend was holding his lead rope and immediately dropped it when she saw what I was going to do. I laid into him, smacking him across the chest and chasing him backwards. He ran backwards a good 90ft before he finally submitted and we had a small stand-off before I finally took the pressure off him and let him come to me. He has never even thought about rearing or even pawing since.
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    10-16-2013, 12:31 PM
^^ this.
Palomine likes this.
    10-16-2013, 12:42 PM
Green Broke
I agree, carry a long whip. When she goes up I'd pull her to the side and whack her across the hiney and make her MOVE like her tail is ON FIRE!
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    10-16-2013, 11:08 PM
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My natural response is to really get after her but not sure what the most effective way would be,
Your first natural response was the right one. Eat her alive. What would the lead mare do if some insolent little brat tried to kick her out in a herd?

Where I differ from most people here is that I seldom use a whip. I would not want or need one here. I would start jerking the lead-rope and would not quit until she had backed up about 50 feet. Then, I would lead her forward about 10 steps, give a good jerk and say "Whoa!", face her make her stand for little bit and then make her back up about another 50 feet.

Then, every time you interact with her, make sure you have a stiff rope halter on her and push her around in a complete 360 to the right, lead her forward, make her stand and then back her up or make another 360 to the right.

Every single time you handle her, make her back up and make her move her shoulder away from you. These a powerful statements in horse language and she understands them.

I hope she has been run out with some older horses, at least yearling mares. Horses handle and train much better when they have been 'worked over' by older horses. They have been taught to 'submit'. It is the reason orphans and foals raised alone and weaned without older horses picking on them are often times a lot more difficult to train. A horse that has not learned proper herd behavior must learn it from human / horse interaction and that is a lot tougher on both.
franknbeans, Palomine and Elana like this.
    10-16-2013, 11:11 PM
I had a 2 day old colt bare his gums at me and turned around and kick me in the ribs. He just grazed me and I was laughing so hard but I still kicked him right back. He ran to his mom and sucked her teat and never kicked at me again.
    10-16-2013, 11:39 PM
Originally Posted by Cherie    
Where I differ from most people here is that I seldom use a whip. I would not want or need one here. I would start jerking the lead-rope and would not quit until she had backed up about 50 feet. Then, I would lead her forward about 10 steps, give a good jerk and say "Whoa!", face her make her stand for little bit and then make her back up about another 50 feet.
Shanking is all well and good...if the horse responds to it.

With my old gelding (8yo Arab/NSH cross who was allowed to get away with literally EVERYTHING by his owners), shanking was the perfect way to communicate "I don't like what you just did, so you need to stop it or your world is going to end right now!" You shanked him once or twice and he'd straighten up and fly right.

I thought shanking was the harshest and easiest correction...until I got my current gelding. You shank him and he just stands there looking at you like "Well, you're a special one, aren't you?" He's been that way since the day I bought him as a basically unhandled 2yo stud colt who had no idea how to lead. You blow yourself up, come at him, and shank him, and he'll just stand there looking at you like "Riiiiiight." The crop or dressage whip, on the other hand...all it takes is a tap (usually) and he fixes whatever he's doing wrong. The example I gave of me making him back 90ft as I took after him was an extreme example, however with as big as he was/is and how dead-headed he can be, it was the only reaction that would have worked.
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    10-17-2013, 08:54 AM
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I seldom use a whip.
I did not say I NEVER use a whip. I would be curious to know if this 'unhandled 2 year old stud colt' had ever been turned out with older geldings to teach him proper herd behavior. Most horses I have run into like this had been weaned and separated and then grew up without pear or older horse 'pressure'.

Once in a while you run into a horse that ignores shanking. When I trained for the public I ran into a lot more horses that would attack an owner that did not have a whip in their hand as they had learned to respect (or worse 'fear') a whip and hate the person that used it. So when the whip was not there they attacked. We saw them so often that we had a name for them. We called them 'whip spoiled horses'.

One of these horses was so bad (an older stud that had been shown at one time), that he whirled around and kicked his owner and fractured every bone in her face, kicked one eye completely out and almost killed her. She had numerous bone fragments embedded in her brain. She was so maimed that her husband had to bring photos of her to the plastic surgeons that tried to put her back together.

I had helped her twice with him and had warned her to 'lose the whip' when she handled him. Her husband called me the day after this happened and asked me to pick him up, make him get back to being handled safely again. He also wanted me to pick up the visiting mare that she was trying to get bred when she got kicked. He had someone that wanted to take him but he did not want to send him without having him schooled 'again'. So, I re-mannered the stud, got the mare bred and sent both on their merry way.
Palomine and Elana like this.
    10-23-2013, 03:40 PM
Well, I have never actually had a horse who had major problems with leading but when they do things like that with other things, I was told to watch the weight on the leg they like to kick you with and as soon as they start to shift the weight to kick you, whip the kicking leg before it comes off the ground.
    10-23-2013, 03:49 PM
So, Ebony, not to be rude, but I just read a thread you started to help you deal with a kicking horse yourself, didn't I?

OP-Cherie is the best one you could listen to. You have some really good advice.

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