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Laying Down while Tied up!

This is a discussion on Laying Down while Tied up! within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category
  • My horse is down and in tied up
  • TYING A HORSE SO IT CAN LAY DOWN

 
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    08-06-2009, 10:11 AM
  #41
Banned
It is NOT all about tying. It is about everything you do with your horse. From the responses to tying I get an impression of how other things are done elsewhere. To the guy who tied his horse down I get the impression that he puts up with no nonesense in everything else. To the ones that won't tie I get the impression that others things are done sloppily?? Too.
If you avoid a fight whenever possible your horse learns from this that to act up gets him someplace. I don't want to tie, act up, they ground tie me or hold me. If I don't want to pass that scary object you will go way wide around it if possible or pick another route? I don't want to slid down that steep slippery slope. Find a way around it so the horse doesn't have to slid down. Cross a scary ditch? Pick another way around.
It goes on and on in how we treat our horses. I baby mine in the field, in the stall, feeding, brushing, treats but come work time he pays up by dong exactly what I demand, each and every single thing. There is no debate in how things are done, what he will do. Scary does not cut it. Jump or walk through a ditch, I deside, not you.

So back to tying. I feel if this simple thing that horse decides, other things will also be decided by the horse.
How many of you hobble??? It is just another form of tying/rooting the horse to a spot?
I really liked the post about tying the horse down. Good for you.
     
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    08-06-2009, 10:55 AM
  #42
Green Broke
Quote:
Originally Posted by morganshow11    
Just make sure you don't tie her up anymore, that could break her neck when she is tied up and trys to lay down
You can't just not tie your horse up. They need to know how.
     
    08-06-2009, 11:29 AM
  #43
mls
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by morganshow11    
Just make sure you don't tie her up anymore, that could break her neck when she is tied up and trys to lay down
So a horse not tied with a lead rope dangling won't break it's neck - or leg?

I assisted in putting a horse down this past Sunday. The horse had gotten away from his handler (gee ground tied at an event).

Found the horse a mile away with a snapped foreleg. We had to put him down on the side of a road. It was an awful way to end what should of been a very fun day.

Even the best trained horse may startle for what ever reason and pull while tied.
     
    08-06-2009, 01:06 PM
  #44
Yearling
LOL! I'm not a guy, I'm a gal. Personally, I insist on certain things and everything else is negotiable. This horse was a challenge because he was unpredictable in when he decided to get loose. He was one of those who would fly back till he hit the end of the rope and pull with all he had. He was NOT a horse you tie with a neck rope or a girth rope through the halter ring. He would have broken his neck or peeled the skin back from his withers before he tested the line. Knowing the horse is key and should determine what you do.

IMHO, Socket is a horse who knows how to tie...so teaching her how to tie isn't the problem. She's not pulling out of fear, pain or any misunderstanding of what is being asked of her. She's pulling because she wants to. Chance are the first time she did it, she got a lot of positive attention from a concerned owner who was shocked and taken aback by the behavior. Can't say for sure as I wasn't there...but that'd be my guess.
     
    08-06-2009, 02:18 PM
  #45
Yearling
I don't much like the taste of liver and I venture to say that if I was tied to a pole,post tree,inner tube,cross tie,or any other contraption and forced to eat it,then I would be in a real bad mood.
No amount of shoving it down my throat would fix my hate of the taste to it.

A lot of training is just like that.

People just think that they can force it down the throat of the horse and sooner or later the horse will put up with it or even grow to like it.

Just isn't so.
Force is when people run out of ideas.
     
    08-06-2009, 02:38 PM
  #46
Yearling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Horse Poor    
Personally, I insist on certain things and everything else is negotiable.
nothing should be negotiable. If you 'negotiate' things with your horse, you're not in full command. The lead horse never asks politely "would you stop eating your food and kindly let me have some?" they demand it. If they want the food they make the other horse move. Even if the horse doesnt want to. And they usually don't want to. Tying is something that every horse should learn how to do. If a horse doesnt tie nicely, then you train them to, just as you would with anything else they have issues with. Don't think of them like people, you have to think of them like horses. Horses don't ever see another as an equal, only dominant or submisant and if you let the horse get away with what he wants, then he is in charge of you and will take advantage of you in other situations.
     
    08-06-2009, 07:27 PM
  #47
Trained
Quote:
It is NOT all about tying. It is about everything you do with your horse. From the responses to tying I get an impression of how other things are done elsewhere. To the guy who tied his horse down I get the impression that he puts up with no nonesense in everything else. To the ones that won't tie I get the impression that others things are done sloppily?? Too.
If you avoid a fight whenever possible your horse learns from this that to act up gets him someplace. I don't want to tie, act up, they ground tie me or hold me. If I don't want to pass that scary object you will go way wide around it if possible or pick another route? I don't want to slid down that steep slippery slope. Find a way around it so the horse doesn't have to slid down. Cross a scary ditch? Pick another way around.
It goes on and on in how we treat our horses. I baby mine in the field, in the stall, feeding, brushing, treats but come work time he pays up by dong exactly what I demand, each and every single thing. There is no debate in how things are done, what he will do. Scary does not cut it. Jump or walk through a ditch, I deside, not you.

So back to tying. I feel if this simple thing that horse decides, other things will also be decided by the horse.
How many of you hobble??? It is just another form of tying/rooting the horse to a spot?
I really liked the post about tying the horse down. Good for you.
Do you see me choosing not to tie my arab who had a bad experience as reflecting that I do other things sloppily? Just curious.

I just want to say, I see ground tying as just as/if not more important than being able to tie normally. What if you need to do something with your horse out on a plain where there is nowhere to tie? Get off and check on injured stock in a creek leaving your horse standing ground tied? I ride my arab yesterday for the first time in a while. It re-enforced how much I value having a horse with such solid ground tying. After we got back, I took his saddle a bridle off and left him there halterless while I put away his tack, made up feeds, put his rug on... It is a skill I want ALL my horses to have.

*Just to add on our ride yesterday the same arab I don't tie was asked to go over/through a few muddy puddles which he REALLY hates and did so without argument.

I see myself as part of the 'take no nonsense' camp of horse ownership. I just don't see tying a horse with a terrible fear and known ability to injure himself while tied as 'taking no nonsense', when it isn't something I need to have a good working relationship with that horse.

The other horse who was ridden yesterday? Is a stubborn lttle so-and-so and often tries to get out of being tied, but never does.
     
    08-06-2009, 09:08 PM
  #48
Banned
Ground tying is very important and every time I ride my horse is ground tied. I get off at the end of the lane way, loosen the girth, put my gloves and sun glasses back in the saddle bag, check all 4 feet for stones and then walk in. He is ground tied while this is going on.
I then lead him to the back of the truck, slip a neck rope around his neck and slip the bridle. Again he is ground tied by the neck rope. I strip the saddle, take my spurs off and half chaps while he stands patiently ground tied.
I then lead him to the barn.
On trail to clear trail I ground tie. If a new horse is at the barn yard I ride through the lady always asks me to have a look. I ground tie.
The longest ground tie on my old guy was about 1 hour 20 minutes while I was in the barn and he waited for me. I was out of site for this whole time and he never moved.
Hobble. I hobble most of the time instead of tying for grooming just for hte practice. He hobbles on the front, he hobbles on the back and he hobble on all 4 tie together. He tethers from the left hind for grazing.
He ties solid to the trail, to the hitching rail and cross ties solid.
Yes I would say he does it all.

I don't know your horse so if you say he can't be tied I guess he can't be tied. I have just never had a horse that couldn't be tied nor any of the horses I shod over the 23 year period. I did know a horse that couldn't be cross tied but tied fine by a single rope to a post.
That's the limit of my experience with non tying horses.

We often went for breakfast with the horses. My old girl ground tied and we tied one to each side of her saddle and we had a breakfast. Did this alot. A 12 mile ride in and a 12 mile ride home. Ice cream was Tuesday and Thursday. 6 miles in, 6 miles out.
     
    08-06-2009, 10:51 PM
  #49
Green Broke
The issue is, this horse throws a fit when the SADDLE is done up. I'd call you a pretty irresponsible horse owner if you didn't first look for a reason why before DEMANDING the horse "obey you". Horses aren't machines, they have minds of their own, and it's up to us as owners to pay attention to what they're telling us. If a horse is being obnoxious, I'm the first to get demanding. But not before I rule out a reason why.

I'd rather my horse do as I ask because they don't mind it, not because I'm forcing them to. I can tie my Arab mare anywhere, to anything. I can leave her behind a strand of binder twine and she'll stay. When I ride, I don't even bother with a halter half the time, I just lead her in by her mane, and she stands quietly in the tack up area without any restraint whatsoever. She gets to free graze on the front yard with no barriers because she'll never roam, and she always walks over when she sees me. She does these things because I make them enjoyable for her. She enjoys my company enough to run from the herd when she sees me.

I never had to use force or demands to accomplish any of these things. I never had to tie her down to a post and let her "fight it out".

"Work" doesn't have to mean force, and in my opinion, horses come around a lot nicer when you work WITH them, not against them as an overlord. Find the way that works for them. I don't see anything "sloppy" in respecting a horse as a LIVING creature and understanding they have idiocracies just like we do. It gets sloppy when the method doesn't WORK and creates a spoiled animal. Everyone has a different way, and just because it's different then yours doesn't make it ANY less effective.
     
    08-06-2009, 11:01 PM
  #50
Trained
Quote:
I don't know your horse so if you say he can't be tied I guess he can't be tied. I have just never had a horse that couldn't be tied nor any of the horses I shod over the 23 year period. I did know a horse that couldn't be cross tied but tied fine by a single rope to a post.
That's the limit of my experience with non tying horses.
It's not that he can't be tied. I mentioned that I do tie him on occasion, but only while I am in sight... I wouldn't be comfortable leaving him tied and walking away.
     

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