Leaving a horse tied for hours? - Page 18
 
 

       The Horse Forum > Training Horses > Horse Training

Leaving a horse tied for hours?

This is a discussion on Leaving a horse tied for hours? within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category
  • Leaving horse tied in a park

 
LinkBack Thread Tools
    03-31-2011, 09:45 PM
  #171
Weanling
Well then you're lucky you don't see any of the bad things. I still don't understand what million dollar rider means since there are no events with that kind of purse. It must mean life time winnings - I would assume. They should also list the life time expenses so that people can really come to understand the financial aspect of this.
     
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
    03-31-2011, 10:00 PM
  #172
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLovedOne    
Well then you're lucky you don't see any of the bad things. I still don't understand what million dollar rider means since there are no events with that kind of purse. It must mean life time winnings - I would assume. They should also list the life time expenses so that people can really come to understand the financial aspect of this.
Million $$ riders is what the rider earns in NRHA Sanctioned shows.

What is the out lay for the trainer? $0. Typically how it works is that the owner pays the entry fees and all expenses. Then the purse is split 50% after all expenses are paid. When a you say a rider is a million or a $4 million $$ rider it is what was won not what was made.

NRHA futurity guarantees $125K to the winner. This class is a $100K added with 10% retained.. Most NRHA affiliate level classes are anywhere from $500 added to $2K added with 50% retained.

When you look at what a rider has earned you need to look at many things. Shawn has won over $4 Million. However most of that is from aged events (Cat 2 and 6) where the purse money is much much higher. Some trainers earnings are in Cat 1 where the purse money is much smaller. So a trainer who say has $70K in Cat 1 earnings can be just as good of a trainer as one who has $750K in Cat 2/6 earnings as the purse is much larger and the money is won faster.

Typically if you have a good horse you can go home with more money then you left with. This has been my experience most of the time.


Also I am not saying there are no bad trainers or riders. NRHA goes out of their way to stop it when it shows up. EVERY horse EVERY run MUST drop bridle to the judge. The judge will walk the entire horse and look at ever inch of the horse. If there is so much as a scratch on the horse the horse/rider is DQed. IF a trainer/rider is seen abusing a horse they are reported to NRHA and the incident WILL be investigated and the person can and will be suspended if warranted. I have seen it happen even with some top riders.
     
    04-01-2011, 06:00 AM
  #173
Banned
Nope, sorry, that's an incorrect generalization about English and Western riders, at least based on my area and my experience.

Training is training, basic submission is basic submission.

I expect my horses to stand quietly tied, or stand quietly on the trailer. I preferred not to get stalls at shows as it greatly adds to the expense.

From foxhunting and trailriding, I expect my horses to stand quietly when tied, for hours if need be. I once tied my horse to a tree during a foxhunt, while I administered first aid to a rider on the ground. After the ambulance left, I remounted and found hounds.

When a boarder's horse learned to lean back and break crossties, etc, I insisted that the horse be sent to a trainer and be retaught to tie. (Yes, I could have done it myself, but she was a nervous sort of pet owner, and I would have had a hard time doing it at my barn without a lot of drama.)

A horse that won't tie is a nuisance, period. Handwalking the horse all day or getting a stall that you wouldn't otherwise because the horse won't tie is allowing the horse to train you.

English and Western have nothing to do with it.
     
    04-01-2011, 06:54 AM
  #174
Banned
Quote:
Originally Posted by maura    
Nope, sorry, that's an incorrect generalization about English and Western riders, at least based on my area and my experience.

Training is training, basic submission is basic submission.

I expect my horses to stand quietly tied, or stand quietly on the trailer. I preferred not to get stalls at shows as it greatly adds to the expense.

From foxhunting and trailriding, I expect my horses to stand quietly when tied, for hours if need be.

<snip>

A horse that won't tie is a nuisance, period. Handwalking the horse all day or getting a stall that you wouldn't otherwise because the horse won't tie is allowing the horse to train you.

English and Western have nothing to do with it.
This!

Quote:
Originally Posted by nrhareiner    
Ex: One circuit I shoot and have for years. 99% of the horses (in both the H/J and the HUS) do not have a flying lead change. Even the ones I have been shooting for 5+ years still have not flying lead change. Among other problems I do not see at the shows that I show at. Although there are other shows I shoot that have both western and English classes and you will see some of the same things there too. However those are mostly kids.
This sounds like a very scary poor example of a hunter circuit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nrhareiner    
The shows I shoot are rated level state shows. I know that is not the top level but a lot of the horses/riders also show at A rated shows and still have no lead change.
I highly doubt they show at A rated hunter shows with out a good lead, if they do they are showing in the non-rated classes and still not placing well.
I love the jab about all the horses that have a lead were formerly western horses.
Sigh.

My old man was originally trained as a western horse. They backed him to start showing as a 2yo in western classes.
When I bought him at 5 he had no lead change. They actually had him so unbalanced from trying to get him to be a peanut roller that loping/cantering was next to impossible.
It took a full year to undo what those amazing western trainers had done to him.
Now, as an English hunter horse he has a lovely lead change and will stand tied to wherever I want to tie him all day long*. (Note, he did not come to me with tieing thing either. Something else us horrible English people taught him.)

It is hard for me to believe that someone with as much true knowledge as you have (reiner) would be pushing such a short sighted stereotype.
     
    04-01-2011, 07:00 AM
  #175
Weanling
Why is there always a big conflict with english and western! English riders are not snobby and they do train their horses properly. One thing that annoys me is that western people say all english people do is ride around in circles...Sorry for bringing that up but it annoys the heck outta me..

And that is the only reason I get so defensive and attack western riding. Even though I would really like to try it some day =D
     
    04-01-2011, 07:07 AM
  #176
Banned
No horse places in a rated division at a USEF hunter show without clean lead changes. Very few pin in the unrated divisions of USEF without them either. Breed shows, I can't say, I have little to no experience with breed show hunters.

Local rated and unrated hunter shows, you can get away with a late change behind and still pin. Or a cranky change, with pinned ears and some tail wringing, if the rest of the class is weak and your trip was good.

Crossfiring? Only if the judge is blind.

Clean, whole *automatic* changes are pretty much a requirement to show USEF hunters. I was once told my otherwise lovely horse wasn't an ammy owner horse because I had to set him up and ask for the change (a clean, whole change); and I was probably told correctly - the expectation for an ammy horse is auto changes, no matter what.
     
    04-01-2011, 07:09 AM
  #177
Banned
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarahandlola    

And that is the only reason I get so defensive and attack western riding.
The sad part here is, no one was attacking western riding.
For some reason a few of the western riders here feel only western riders know anything and they are shoving it down our throats. But no one was attacking western riding.

I believe most of us here know that there are great english riders and great western riders and bad english riders and bad western riders and the vast majority of us people in between who are average riders.

Some english riders let their horses act like jerks. Some western riders let their horses act like jerks.


ETA:
Quote:
Originally Posted by maura    
No horse places in a rated division at a USEF hunter show without clean lead changes. Very few pin in the unrated divisions of USEF without them either. Breed shows, I can't say, I have little to no experience with breed show hunters.

Local rated and unrated hunter shows, you can get away with a late change behind and still pin. Or a cranky change, with pinned ears and some tail wringing, if the rest of the class is weak and your trip was good.

Crossfiring? Only if the judge is blind.

Clean, whole *automatic* changes are pretty much a requirement to show USEF hunters. I was once told my otherwise lovely horse wasn't an ammy owner horse because I had to set him up and ask for the change (a clean, whole change); and I was probably told correctly - the expectation for an ammy horse is auto changes, no matter what.
Love you Maura!

And you are so freaking right.

The busy local hunter show series in my neck of the woods if you have no lead change you get no ribbons, period.

And so right about an ammy horse lead change. They do them on their own. (Love my horse and his auto lead change.)


I think breed shows (or the ones that I have watched, mainly appy) a sloppy lead change can still get your ribbons. They seem to like scary things in those classes.
     
    04-01-2011, 07:25 AM
  #178
Weanling
Maybe because they are more into natural horsemanship and all of that...Wait that gets me thinking is there any natural horsemanship trainer who is an english rider. Like I know Monty Roberts and all of them are western...
     
    04-01-2011, 02:41 PM
  #179
Weanling
Natural Horsemanship has nothing to do with it. There are lots of english and western riders that are natural horseman.

I do agree I've never seen all these claimed lead problems at H/J or dressage shows.

I do not see H/J or dressage people tying there horses or ponying other horses. I think that the eventers are different and do tie etc but I've not gone to any XC events.
     
    04-01-2011, 02:43 PM
  #180
Weanling
Quote:
Originally Posted by nrhareiner    
IF a trainer/rider is seen abusing a horse they are reported to NRHA and the incident WILL be investigated and the person can and will be suspended if warranted. I have seen it happen even with some top riders.
This is good and I'm glad to hear it. The fact that you actually saw someone get disqualified tells me that bad stuff is still happening. People still talk about the torture pit at these events.

Honestly I'm still confused over the million dollar rider thing but that's OK we can just leave it at that.
     

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Horse dislikes being tied ShinaKonga Horse Training 7 01-05-2011 12:12 AM
teaching a horse to stand while tied hottotrot Horse Training 50 11-17-2010 10:04 PM
horse pulls A LOT while tied. . . payette Horse Training 36 07-29-2010 08:17 PM
horse tied to tree booner Horse Training 24 11-06-2008 02:51 PM



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:00 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0