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My gelding wont listen to me!

This is a discussion on My gelding wont listen to me! within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category
  • Wide eyed gelding

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    02-16-2013, 07:52 PM
  #21
Super Moderator
Sorry, reading about horse psychology means close to nothing. You learn it by observing herds and by communicating with horses on a frequent basis - and yes, they don't roam in packs... A leader does not put another member in place by dominance, a leader is being respected by their precision and timing. You can spin him and use a crop all day long, but if you won't to in the very exact second it is really needed - it will mean nothing! Dominance just provokes dominance, especially, in young males, and you are, as I believe, doing just that. Sorry, I won't be giving actual instructions - you really need to get a trainer and have eye-to-eye training
     
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    02-16-2013, 07:57 PM
  #22
Showing
A group of horses is called a "herd," not a pack. ;)
     
    02-16-2013, 08:09 PM
  #23
Weanling
"So I get off and lead him into the woods, where I wanted him to go.. And I take him back afterwards and roundpen him!"

It sounds like the horse might be to much for you at this point. Get a trainer get lessons. Saranda has given you some great advice.

I have to be honest I never ever get off a horse that is acting up. When there is a fight that is not the time to get off. That is what the horse wants no matter what you do after that you have lost its to late. If this is the only horse for you, you have your work cut out for you. Your horse has your number, get help.

Also everyone talking saddle fit is also go advice, that could fix some of the problem.
mvinotime, nvr2many, Elana and 4 others like this.
     
    02-16-2013, 08:24 PM
  #24
Weanling
Barring health issues, you are not the boss of this horse. You need to establish yourself as 'the captain', and that goes back to groundwork, feeding, and basically EVERYTHING you do, and that WILL transfer into the saddle. Every moment with your horse, even in happy loving moments, you need to be establishing yourself as the boss. I never let my horses crowd me when I go to feed them - they stand patiently and wait for me to retreat when I am ready, I do groundwork randomly (just move their feet) if I feel even the slightest challenge, and if I have a new horse I am working with, I spend a good period of time letting the horse know that I am boss through ground, saddle, and basic interactions. I am kind, but firm - they move when I ask and come in when invited, and under saddle I spend a lot of time yielding the hindquarters if I am not getting respect (if he isn't going forward, make him yield his hindquarters a few times and then forward will be easier - not just turning the head, but YIELDING the hind end) - don't get off, but start PLANNING for 2 hour rides and just work on going forward even if it takes a long time (getting off is a release of pressure and, in the horse's mind, a 'win' - release of pressure = reward/horse establishing dominance). What do you do in the round pen? Are you establishing direction and speed? Once you do ground work in the round pen, do you get on and ride, establishing direction and speed under saddle? It helps to immediately reinforce the ground lesson with saddle work.

I bet you just need to really think about your interactions when not under saddle. A lot of times the way you relate to a horse at times like feeding and grooming sets the tone for the horse. Do you let him push past you for his food? Grab the hay out of your hands when you are carrying it in his stall? Does he turn his butt to you when you go to get him? Look at how he stands in the stall the next time you go to get him. If he isn't turning to face you with two eyes, you need to do some work. If he is, watch all your other interactions and make sure you are setting the tone.
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    02-16-2013, 08:46 PM
  #25
Weanling
Sorry that you're having a tough time! Trainers can be huge assets for problems like these. I would, however, give the comments about saddle-fitting a serious thought-- you never know!

Just a note about the round pen... :)

I see a lot of people "punish" their horses by tossing them into a round pen and running them like crazy, then thinking "that'll show him!" as they lead away a sweaty, wide-eyed horse. Even when my gelding misbehaves or has a ton of energy, making him only physically "work" is never the answer. Makes sure that his responses are always to commands that *you* have given. When I ask for a trot, I expect a trot... when I ask for a ho & turn, I expect the horse to stop and face me, then turn with his butt facing then fence-- not my face. Little things like that. You want him to be mentally and physically enegaged. And, you always want to be the one in control of the situation and not just have him galloping and getting himself further riled up.

When on the trail or in the arena, my gelding responds--even when nervous--if I ask him to think. If he refuses or acts antsy, I will stop him and do a combination of yielding the fore, yielding the hind, sidepassing and backing. By the time we've made it through that, he is listening to me and moving on is no problem. Just a thought! Best of luck!
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    02-16-2013, 09:04 PM
  #26
Weanling
"Afraid to fall off" This is holding you back and will hold you back until you can get past it. Being afraid to fall off will stop you when you should push every time and your horse know it. Git lesson learn. From what I have read here and in another thred you have the wrong horse sell him. I know you like him but he is to much for you and its not good for him or you. Your barn should understand if not I know its hard to find a good barn, but at this point they are not looking out for whats best for you and the horse.
     
    02-16-2013, 09:21 PM
  #27
Started
I think there is a difference between being afraid to fall and knowing when its a good idea to get off before you fall off. I have had a horse or two where they did something I did not like and I got them settled and got off. I needed time to think of how I was going to address an issue before I implemented a strategy. I think there are times when its better to get a horse settled after an event ie rearing or bucking, ask the horse to do a good thing like walk or stop and get off. Then you can plan what you are going to do next time that offer that undesirable behavior. That can be more productive then reacting out of anger or worse fear. There is value in stopping, reassessing and coming back in a better frame of mind. Its difficult to fix a problem behavior and its harder to fix a problem behavior that you have made worse by getting mad and taking it out of the horse.

I think the OP needs hands, eyes and hearts on the ground along with someone honest to give them advice. We can advise till we are blue in the face but if you don't have the courage or the wisdom to put into place advice that is given its not helpful. I think this may not be the right horse for the OP and if they want to make it the right horse for them than its time to find a good trainer and being willing.

Not enough fear can get you killed just as easily as too much fear.
     
    02-16-2013, 09:28 PM
  #28
Weanling
"I have had a horse or two where they did something I did not like and I got them settled and got off." Good point, thanks for clarifing. Sorry for that. You make an excellent point, There are times to take a time out. But knowing when to get off is important. But then I have never been good at taking those momments, I tend to push forward when getting off or changing has always been a stroggle for me. I am trying to learn, getting older has help alot.

Thanks Rookie
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    02-16-2013, 09:31 PM
  #29
Showing
I have an HONEST question for the OP.

The horses that you've gotten and then gotten rid of, have they been "pretty"? Because honestly, it sounds like you're picking the "pretty ponies" and not trying to find something that will fit your skill level, regardless of looks. If your trainer is encouraging you in this or even facilitating this mind set, you need to find a different trainer who cares less about what you want and more about what you need (which it seems like from the fact that he/she picked out a 17hh green TB for you that you immediately described as "dappled grey"...we don't need to know the horse's color to help you deal with its issues...not saying this is the case, but from past experience here and elsewhere, people who have issues with a horse that isn't appropriate for them got the horse in the first place because it was a pretty color).

Not bashing you. Just saying it seems like it from what you've said.
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    02-16-2013, 10:02 PM
  #30
Yearling
Quote:
Originally Posted by CowboyBob    
"I have had a horse or two where they did something I did not like and I got them settled and got off." Good point, thanks for clarifing. Sorry for that. You make an excellent point, There are times to take a time out. But knowing when to get off is important. But then I have never been good at taking those momments, I tend to push forward when getting off or changing has always been a stroggle for me. I am trying to learn, getting older has help alot.

Thanks Rookie

I know exactly what you mean; I was the same, never knew when enough was enough and would push through when it would have been better to take some time off. I found getting older helped, the more mellow I got, the better my horses went.
Critter sitter and CowboyBob like this.
     

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