Positive and Negative - Punishment and Reinforcement - The Horse Forum
Old 05-12-2014, 05:39 PM Thread Starter
Yearling

Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Canada eh?
Posts: 870
• Horses: 0
Positive and Negative - Punishment and Reinforcement

So there is all this craziness about punishment and reinforcement and negative and positive and ahhhh!

Let's break it down:
Reinforcement - this is to increase the frequency of a behavior. You are reinforcing the behavior.
Punishment - this is to decrease the frequency of a behavior. You are punishing the behavior.
Negative - removal of something.
Positive - addition of something.

Now we put them together:
All four examples will follow this model:
The (addition/removal) of something (desired/unwanted) in order to (increase/decrease) a behavior.

We know about addition/removal and about increase/decrease. The tricky part here is knowing when you are talking about something desired and when you are talking about something unwanted.

Positive Reinforcement
The addition of something desired in order to increase a behavior.

Negative Reinforcement
The removal of something unwanted in order to increase a behavior.

Positive Punishment
The addition of something unwanted in order to decrease a behavior.

Negative Punishment
The removal of something desired in order to decrease a behavior.

A Bit More Information
If you are still confused about where desired / unwanted goes think of it like multiplication in math. (I know, ew!). Think of negative and punishment as negatives. Think of positive and reinforcement as positives.
With desired being positive and unwanted being negative you can solve what goes in what definition.

Two positives make a positive.
One of each is negative because it "overrides" the positive.
Two negative make a positive.

Example: let's use negative punishment. You know negative is removal and punishment is decrease already, so you have 2/3 words. Now, negative and punishment are both negatives in our math equation. And what do two negatives make? A positive! Therefore you know that negative punishment is the removal of something desired in order to decrease the frequency of a behavior.

If you look back at the above examples you will see that it works. Finally some use for math!

I hope this made some sense to you wonderful people!

Hold On To What You Love. When It Tries To Buck You Off Hold On Even Tighter!
WildAtHeart is offline
Sponsored Links
Advertisement

Old 05-12-2014, 07:27 PM
Foal

Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 192
• Horses: 1
It's so sad that this is such a foreign concept in the horse world right now. Hopefully in time PR based training methods will be employed more routinely. And not because it is a 'nice' or 'soft' approach, but because it simply is the most effective form of learning when people commit to it and understand it properly.
I have been looking for discussion groups specifically for PR horse trainers for so long and only now am I starting to see the odd mention of it ever so often.
Fingers crossed for the future :) Thanks for the post!
AceyGrace is offline
Old 05-14-2014, 10:20 AM Thread Starter
Yearling

Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Canada eh?
Posts: 870
• Horses: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by AceyGrace View Post
It's so sad that this is such a foreign concept in the horse world right now. Hopefully in time PR based training methods will be employed more routinely. And not because it is a 'nice' or 'soft' approach, but because it simply is the most effective form of learning when people commit to it and understand it properly.
I have been looking for discussion groups specifically for PR horse trainers for so long and only now am I starting to see the odd mention of it ever so often.
Fingers crossed for the future :) Thanks for the post!
I agree! PR is rarely talked about. I plan to do more research so I can use it more effectively when working with horses. And no problem =)

Hold On To What You Love. When It Tries To Buck You Off Hold On Even Tighter!
WildAtHeart is offline
Old 05-14-2014, 11:30 AM
Super Moderator

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: SW UK
Posts: 10,431
• Horses: 0
The talk of two negatives make a positive takes me back to school days with an awful teacher having the whole class on the stairs to learn positives and negatives.
I endeared myself to her forever when I refused to try and balance on a stair with 30+ classmates.
Foxhunter is online now
Old 05-14-2014, 07:33 PM Thread Starter
Yearling

Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Canada eh?
Posts: 870
• Horses: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxhunter View Post
The talk of two negatives make a positive takes me back to school days with an awful teacher having the whole class on the stairs to learn positives and negatives.
I endeared myself to her forever when I refused to try and balance on a stair with 30+ classmates.
Hahah that's great =D Sorry for the painful reminiscing =P

Hold On To What You Love. When It Tries To Buck You Off Hold On Even Tighter!
WildAtHeart is offline

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

## Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the The Horse Forum forums, you must first register.

Already have a Horse Forum account?
Members are allowed only one account per person at the Horse Forum, so if you've made an account here in the past you'll need to continue using that account. Please do not create a new account or you may lose access to the Horse Forum. If you need help recovering your existing account, please Contact Us. We'll be glad to help!

New to the Horse Forum?
Please choose a username you will be satisfied with using for the duration of your membership at the Horse Forum. We do not change members' usernames upon request because that would make it difficult for everyone to keep track of who is who on the forum. For that reason, please do not incorporate your horse's name into your username so that you are not stuck with a username related to a horse you may no longer have some day, or use any other username you may no longer identify with or care for in the future.

User Name:
Password
 Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive. Password: Confirm Password:
Email Address
 Please enter a valid email address for yourself. Email Address:
OR

## Log-in

 User Name Password Remember Me?
Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.

Old Thread Warning
This thread is more than 90 days old. When a thread is this old, it is often better to start a new thread rather than post to it. However, If you feel you have something of value to add to this particular thread, you can do so by checking the box below before submitting your post.

 Thread Tools Show Printable Version Show Printable Version Email this Page Email this Page

 Similar Threads Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post DanielDauphin Natural Horsemanship 38 06-02-2014 01:35 AM DanielDauphin Natural Horsemanship 0 04-17-2014 11:22 PM blkgryphon Natural Horsemanship 0 08-28-2013 05:52 PM Pegasus1 Natural Horsemanship 22 01-10-2013 03:47 PM

 Posting Rules You may post new threads You may post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts BB code is On Smilies are On [IMG] code is On HTML code is OffTrackbacks are On Pingbacks are On Refbacks are On Forum Rules

For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
 Terms of Use