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Putting An End To Rearing

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  • My green broke horse rears alot on ounge line

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    03-04-2013, 11:33 AM
  #21
Yearling
Taking a horse from a buddy doesn't fix the problem, only bandaids it while the circumstances allow it. If, for some reason you have to move your horse back with another horse, they will become buddy sour again. A buddy sour horse will always be a buddy sour horse. You just must train them not to act like one, not just remove them from the situation..
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    03-04-2013, 01:50 PM
  #22
Started
The egg thing I have heard of I think it has mixed success. I have seen horses that will rear up and crack their own head open and then keep rearing. For those horses, the egg means nothing.

What has helped with my STB who came back from a 90 + days of training "able to do level two dressage" but reared when I asked him to stand and as per the trainer "had to be lunged for 20 minutes so he did not bolt when you first get on", was to go back to square one. I think lunging a horse before riding is sort of silly. I want to ride I don't want to spend 1/2 lunging so that then I can ride.

My boy would pop up because he was excited. He loves to chase/follow cars and thus gets really excited about cars. He did not like going out on the trail alone at firsts. I noticed that as soon as I put the saddle on him he was in "go mode". It was like he had not learned that he could relax and not run around like a fool under saddle. I spent the first three weeks with him, just saddling him, and then unsaddling him. I then got on him and go right off and put him away. I was able to get him to understand that we are really not doing anything exciting.

He did get upset about going past one big tree. A tree that's the "barrier" between going out and being by himself on the trail and then being with the "herd". I took him out on a 100 degree hot day and we marched past that tree 15 times. Once he did it three times in a row without spooking or rushing I put him away. That's sort of how we progressed to going down the trail solo. I would take him down to the arena one day and then the next day we went half way to the arena (at my choice) then one day we went 1000 feet past the arena. I always made sure to end on my point and before he had a chance to do something silly. The second time we were on the trail, I let him run and kept him running. It was a great time and I think it mellowed him out. Again, it was on my terms. He is not my ideal trail horse yet. I have put him in a situation where he was uncomfortable and had him still listen to me. If you told me two years ago (with winters off) that he would go from a horse that reared and spooked at everything to a horse that I (wimp of the world) would feel safe taking out on a solo trail ride, I would have told you to go boil your head.

My advice, would be what are the triggers for the behavior? Is there one area where you can set your watch by his poor behavior? What are you riding him in? I noticed a change when I went from a snaffle to a three piece bit. Its possible you are cuing your horse to back while asking/shifting forward, resulting in upward. Working with a trainer is great but make sure the trainer is worth working with. For being herd bound, one step at a time. I think someone, either Buck B or Clinton A has a thing where the only place the horse gets to rest is far away from the group. Thus the uncomfortable becomes comfortable. Which I think is a good place to start. I also agree with Winstrom that is not a matter so much of "curing" herd bound ness (horses are herd animals its their nature to want a buddy) but to give the horse the skills or confidence to tolerate going out alone safely.
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    03-04-2013, 04:02 PM
  #23
Green Broke
I HATE to get on "my horse rears" threads because of all the bad advice.

Rearing is dangerous. It can get you killed. Find someone who knows what they are doing to train this horse or sell this horse. Your life is worth more than the horse.

Now I will say a little bit on rearing. Rearing is a form of RESISTANCE. It usually happens because the horse has an incomplete education at some point in its training. Most horses people ride out on trails are pretty uneducated and a lot of the people riding those horses are not terribly educated about training either. I give horses a lot of credit for all the ones who do this day in and day out and no one dies. I mean that.

As to bad advice in this thread I have the following quotes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wanstrom Horses    
When she rears, break an egg or a water balloon between her ears. A bit unconventional, but it's always worked for me, or pop her between the ears with a bridle rein or a quirt.
While the horse is rearing you should be thinking about leaning forward and not pulling the horse over backward. Seriously.. you are going to CARRY and EGG with you and NOT break it when the horse starts to rear somewhere out on the trail. Really? REALLY???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe4d    
I know a trail trainer that uses a kids whiffle bat with some beads inside it. Wacks em between the ears.
Nice. Now along with the egg you are carrying a whiffle bat with beads in it. So you ride along and the beads rattle in the whiffle bat and the horse spooks and the bat rattles and the horse spooks and the bat rattles.. finally about 100 miles from home the horse no longer rears, no longer spooks, and can't take another step. You have to get off and lead the horse home.. and carry the stupid whiffle bat. If you haven't dropped it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by toto    
Ive always used the egg trick.. works like a charm.
I wouldn't hit her with something, because it will put her in a panic. An egg makes them think theyve cracked their head opened, and they calm down when they feel the yolk etcetera dripping down their face.. big attitude change and quickly Too!!
Posted via Mobile Device
I can tell you that a horse does not make that connection. Fact is for every horse that whacks its head when it rears and stops rearing there are 6 more that EXPECT to whack their heads when they rear and will rear higher.

Then there are the horses that rear, whack their heads and then always rear at that location because in their pea size brains they associated the whack with something in the environment at that spot and always rear when they get to it (had a filly like this).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe4d    
in that case, just let her turn and go back to the barn, then as soon as she gets their get off, put her on a lunge line and run her till her tounge is hanging out.
Get back on and ride away from the barn, she fights you much go ahead turn around, go to barn and repeat. Eventually she will figure out it is much easier to walk away from the barn than it is to run laps around it.
Oh boy.. No.. this expects the horse to make an association between rearing and work. You have to put the horse to work the instant the feet come to ground. And even then it may not work. Remember.. 1200 pound animal with a brain the size of a walnut.. and a lot of that brain is used for stuff like breathing and digestion.

PLEASE do not try to fix this on your own. Find an experienced horseman/woman to help that does not suggest eggs, whiffle bats, riding the horse home and getting off (rewarding her) etc.

This is a horse that needs more foundation and a rider that likely needs the same thing. BTW that is not meant as a put down. Every good rider can learn more.
     
    03-04-2013, 04:50 PM
  #24
Yearling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elana    
I HATE to get on "my horse rears" threads because of all the bad advice.

Rearing is dangerous. It can get you killed. Find someone who knows what they are doing to train this horse or sell this horse. Your life is worth more than the horse.

Now I will say a little bit on rearing. Rearing is a form of RESISTANCE. It usually happens because the horse has an incomplete education at some point in its training. Most horses people ride out on trails are pretty uneducated and a lot of the people riding those horses are not terribly educated about training either. I give horses a lot of credit for all the ones who do this day in and day out and no one dies. I mean that.

As to bad advice in this thread I have the following quotes:



While the horse is rearing you should be thinking about leaning forward and not pulling the horse over backward. Seriously.. you are going to CARRY and EGG with you and NOT break it when the horse starts to rear somewhere out on the trail. Really? REALLY???



Nice. Now along with the egg you are carrying a whiffle bat with beads in it. So you ride along and the beads rattle in the whiffle bat and the horse spooks and the bat rattles and the horse spooks and the bat rattles.. finally about 100 miles from home the horse no longer rears, no longer spooks, and can't take another step. You have to get off and lead the horse home.. and carry the stupid whiffle bat. If you haven't dropped it.



I can tell you that a horse does not make that connection. Fact is for every horse that whacks its head when it rears and stops rearing there are 6 more that EXPECT to whack their heads when they rear and will rear higher.

Then there are the horses that rear, whack their heads and then always rear at that location because in their pea size brains they associated the whack with something in the environment at that spot and always rear when they get to it (had a filly like this).



Oh boy.. No.. this expects the horse to make an association between rearing and work. You have to put the horse to work the instant the feet come to ground. And even then it may not work. Remember.. 1200 pound animal with a brain the size of a walnut.. and a lot of that brain is used for stuff like breathing and digestion.

PLEASE do not try to fix this on your own. Find an experienced horseman/woman to help that does not suggest eggs, whiffle bats, riding the horse home and getting off (rewarding her) etc.

This is a horse that needs more foundation and a rider that likely needs the same thing. BTW that is not meant as a put down. Every good rider can learn more.
What would you suggest, if one couldn't get professional help?

I'm serious, not trying to be an ass. I don't have a horse that rears, and I've never had to deal with rearing. My horse seems to lazy to rear (LOL). But I absolutely don't have the money for a trainer, or for lessons. So if she started up, I would be the one to deal with it. We've been able to fix any issues she's had thus far, so I think I could do it.... If I knew the right way.

Honestly, I know NOTHING about how to fix rearing. To me some of these suggestions sounded logical... Until you pointed out fallacy, and now I'm back to square 1. So for someone with a rearer, who does not have access to a trainer what would you propose to do? And please don't say 'if you don't have a trainer sell the horse' type things. As well as it would be to have a trainer we can't ALL have one... And I would do anything before I would sell Clementine, even if she reared up on me. I would definitely give it a go, but it'd be nice to learn the proper way to deal with it.

Again - my horse doesn't rear. She never has. I'm just curious.
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    03-04-2013, 04:59 PM
  #25
Yearling
Let's not forget that I have mentioned before that I am getting into an apprenticeship with a certified trainer.
     
    03-04-2013, 05:54 PM
  #26
Weanling
No kidding. I share the same sentiments, Elana. Rearing threads always make me cringe and seeing the advice people give makes it worse.

I had a chronic rearer who had been rearing all his life. I sought professional help and only found one trainer who was willing to work with my horse. She refused to get on him. It wasn't cowardice on her part. It was a smart decision. This horse had a history of backflipping and had gone over on me before. I had other riders get on him which only ended up disastrous and making him even more difficult to move forward. This horse had impeccable ground manners and drilling ground work into him didn't translate to much undersaddle. He had been started and restarted over again. His problem was never going to be "cured" but we found ways to manage it. However, no solution ever worked twice. I tried riding him bitless and bridleless in a situation I knew would make him rear and he was incredible! Totally different horse! The next time I tried it, it didn't do jack. Keeping him forward was the best way of preventing his rearing tantrums and it most often kept him under control. However, this horse was exceptionally athletic. He could be moving nicely round and forward and in front of my leg then BAM. Out of the blue he suddenly jumps underneath himself, shoots straight up, slides, and tumbles backward. He did not have a predictable pattern of behavior and was vet checked for underlying injuries, had numerous saddle fittings by a professional, routine chiro, massages, etc. Long story short, this horse was an extreme case that couldn't be cured. Xrays, ultrasounds, lameness exams could not determine anything but a nuclear scan had shown he had a traumatic injury to his hip socket he most likely received in his younger years. His rearing tantrums were significantly worse when he had time off and lost conditioning. His pain turned into resistance and violent behavior undersaddle even though he had a heart of gold on the ground. Yes I've had people give me nasty insults about my riding ability and my horse's intelligence. How coud they have known? How could I have known? Even when you've tried and exhausted every possibility on this planet you just have to accept that there are things beyond anyone's control.

I've seen a wide spectrum of different rearing cases from ones solved in a single session with a trainer to extreme cases which ended with the horse being put down. I don't recommend just sending a horse off to a professional unless you are there as well working in conjunction with the horse and trainer. Newspaper and eggs don't do jack and can sometimes exacerbate rearing.

I know a case (which I personally would never ever try or recommend) of a woman using a shock collar in a situation where she knew her horse would rear. She only shocked the horse once. It crashed down and lay on the ground for a long time in a daze. The horse never reared in its life again and went on to have a career as an upper level eventer.

I know another woman who bought a six figure horse that suddenly turned up with a rearing problem and aggression issues a few weeks after she bought it. The horse went backward onto her trainer and broke her pelvis when she mounted it. Turned out the horse had a brain tumor and was subsequently PTS.

I'm not going to give any advice as to solve a rearing problem because I don't know you, your horse, and the factors contributing to her behavior. There is no "do XYZ" solution that a person on a forum can offer without witnessing you and the horse first hand. Please find a professional or a trainer who has experience working with this type of horse. Work closely with them and be honest. There is no shame in admitting something is too much for you. However, I hold no respect for those who get themselves or others hurt because they let their ego get the better of them. You can say I love Sugar so much and I could never sell her because she's my baby but things changes really quickly when someone gets seriously hurt.

/Rant
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    03-04-2013, 05:59 PM
  #27
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wanstrom Horses    
When she rears, break an egg or a water balloon between her ears. A bit unconventional, but it's always worked for me, or pop her between the ears with a bridle rein or a quirt.
I was going to Post just this!
     
    03-04-2013, 06:14 PM
  #28
Yearling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canterklutz    
Please find a professional or a trainer who has experience working with this type of horse. Work closely with them and be honest. There is no shame in admitting something is too much for you. However, I hold no respect for those who get themselves or others hurt because they let their ego get the better of them. You can say I love Sugar so much and I could never sell her because she's my baby but things changes really quickly when someone gets seriously hurt.

/Rant

Let me just say it one more time, before anyone feels the need to suggest it again. I am getting into an apprenticeship with a certified trainer. I'm quite aware that there is no shame in admitting there is something I can't do on my own, I wouldn't be here, or seeking help from another person if that was not the case.
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    03-04-2013, 06:14 PM
  #29
Started
I love when some one Says "THIS WILL NOT WORK. "
Maybe not for every horse But guess what? Horses have minds and they think.
Some may get the egg Idea some may not but your not pulling a horse backwards and you lean forward to crack a egg on the head. It is not Painful It breaks there concentration on what they are doing and then they think they are bleeding. It may take 2 or 3 eggs But even at the slightest pop up you do it.. But seriously not if your not a good rider.
I can't say anything about the other Ideas cause I have not used them.. But I have issues with people who say tend to think its not my way so it Will Not Work.
That's why there are many Ways to train. Smiles :P
     
    03-04-2013, 06:16 PM
  #30
Yearling
Have this horses teeth been checked? Is the bit whacking a wolf tooth? Try jacking yourself in the molar with a tuning fork. No bueno.
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