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        11-20-2009, 10:40 PM
    I just want to point out that they don't always evade the bit because they are not comfortable. Personally, I love using a flash on one of my horses, it helps so much. Its not like its really tight on them, I put it just as tight as the regular cavasson. About 2 or 3 fingers. My horse in particular likes to lock his jaw & try to run away bc he wants to run. Having a flash prevents him from gaping open his mouth. Yes he can still chew [he eats all the time with it one] yes he can breathe, NO his mouth is NOT tied shut. I would rather have someone put a flash noseband on a horse then a way harsher bit.

    Yes some people do abuse the flash, but 'some' people tend to abuse anything & everything.
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        11-21-2009, 12:40 AM
    The idea would be to use the flash or drop to settle a green or young horse - then move on to a simple cavesson. Whatever noseband, it should be a training tool to help correct a fault or certain behavior -- i'm not advocating that you should always use a flash/drop, rather, that it be used temporarily to encourage a solution. My arab, for instance, holds her head high for trot and canter. It is how she naturally moves her body, but it does not mean that it is the most efficient way for her to move her body. It feels comfortable to her, but in dressage, well there are standards for how a horse should look while moving. So I used a chambon, that applied pressure on her poll if her head was high, but released the pressure if she lowered it. No, it wasn't necessarily comfortable for her, but it provided a temporary suggestion of sorts to teach her a new way of moving that would, in the end, strengthen and tone her body in a more ideal way. I would never use it all the time.
        11-21-2009, 02:57 AM
    Green Broke
    So what I am getting is that it is used like one would use a tie down or ect. To correct or change how a horse moves and/or acts to keep it looking better esthetically and as a mechanical aid (or crutch) to prevent unwanted behavior, not something completely necessary. Ok, thanks guys, I think I got it.
        11-21-2009, 03:52 AM
    Some horses can get the bit between their teeth then take off, having a flash on means they can't open their mouth wide enough to get the bit between their teeth. To be honest it's not really for looks except in certain competitions, things like hunter classes usually want a cavensson as it suits the type of horse that's in those classes and in the show pony/horse classes they want a narrow noseband as those horses suit that noseband. As for a crutch, everything in riding is a crutch from your saddle to what you wear.
        11-23-2009, 06:04 PM
    Green Broke
    Lis, there is a difference between regular equipment and a crutch. If a horse is taking the bit between its teeth and running away, it needs to have that issue addressed in training rather than just using a nose band to keep it from opening its mouth wide enough to act badly. That situation makes the nose band a crutch, I.e. A piece of equipment or an artificial aid used to correct a behavior issue instead of correcting it through training.
    I have the answer to my question, thanks everyone! You have been very helpful!
        11-23-2009, 07:35 PM
    Green Broke
    Honey - I love this post that you made...

    If I see a problem with my horse im not going to put some equitment on it for quick fixes!!

    I don't punish my horse for showing me how she's feeling!

    I take it and listen to it.... show or not.

    I use lunge reins for the reason of helping her give to pressure with me off her and not have to be in her way and ruin her balence while she's trying to figure it out.

    Chance recently was gaping her mouth open even with out much contact but even still she felt trapped so im still trying to figure her out and work with it. But I refuse to use a stronger bit... or tie anything down or closed ;)
        11-24-2009, 07:48 PM
    Green Broke
    Good job,HorsesAreForever, I'm glad you are looking for the issue rather than just going for a quick fix, and I understand about the lunge reins, they are a useful piece of equipment that you are using for training...

    And I'd really really like to reiterate the fact that I am in no way bashing anyone with this thread. Hope I haven't stepped on any toes or anything.
        11-25-2009, 06:03 PM
    Originally Posted by Honeysuga    
    So what I am getting is that it is used like one would use a tie down or ect. To correct or change how a horse moves and/or acts to keep it looking better esthetically and as a mechanical aid (or crutch) to prevent unwanted behavior, not something completely necessary. Ok, thanks guys, I think I got it.
    Actually, a tie down is used to help horses brace against for tight turns (such as barrel racing) Or cat leat I'm pretty sure that's the reason (or something close) Its most popular strap-the-head-down is not it's proper use

    And how exactly would you fix my horse with "proper training and basics" I"m honestly curious.
        11-25-2009, 06:18 PM
    The literal purpose of a noseband is to keep the horse's mouth shut. I believe that the flash noseband continues to further keep the horse's mouth shut. With the noseband working properly and the horse's mouth shut then there is more pressure on the nasal bones, which directs the horse's nose towards the pressure of the reins. It basically just increases the horse's interaction with the bit.
        12-11-2009, 01:22 PM
    The age old rub. English requires pressure on the bit at all times as this provides the avenue for lots of cues. Western does not use the bit in the same way.

    Both ways work very well if properly taught and used. Neither works well if not properly taught and used correctly.

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