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Rearing on command

This is a discussion on Rearing on command within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category

     
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        02-05-2009, 08:06 PM
      #21
    Foal
    I worked with a acting group of knights for a summer. They used horses that knew a number of tricks and I rode a mare that could rear on cue. Her cue was two part 1) preasure on the sides, but only from the heel and well behind the girth (further back than you'd press for normal cues) 2) draw back on the reins in a slightly downward manner.
    I discovered this by accident one day while we were taking them swimming and she tried to kick at another horse, thus the leg pressure to move her away. (she refused to walk into the water and had to be backed, but would then swim around freely) Anyway, she never came off the ground more than 10 inches or so and it was always in a very purposeful manner, you knew you were rearing.
         
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        02-05-2009, 08:34 PM
      #22
    Kim
    Foal
    Nothing like a bit of controversy!!!

    My friend is only 18 and been riding for 5 years, she works in Spain at a training stable, she rides stallions, trains them to do all this awesome stuff I could only dream about!!

    I reckon, If you know what you're doing, you're obviously aware of dangers etc etc. You've got a trainor helping you if you need it, I assume you're a pretty good rider. It's your horse, you're not planning on selling it, you're smart eough not to use a cue that would be confusing, and tell any future owners etc.

    Stallions in spanish schools rear on cue, are controlled, and I've never heard about any that go crazy from my friend... well any more than your average horse anyway.

    I don't think it is any less dangerous than other tricks. They could all go wrong if they weren't trained properly.

    You sound like you've thought it through. So why not...
         
        02-06-2009, 08:47 AM
      #23
    Yearling
    Here is the differences between your horse and the lipizzans...

    -They are worked every day by professional trainers.
    -They have a routine. It is in sequence so that they know when to do it unlike randomly like you would be doing.

    The difference in my tricks and yours is they are done in a sequence. He doesn't just lay down or sit randomly. Laying down is much more difficult for a horse than rearing, therefore making that less likely than rearing. It is also much easier to prevent a horse from laying down than rearing.

    Kissing doesn't involve teeth and its a low stress situation so a horse is no liking to bite. Spanish walk, or counting may cause he horse to do it randomly but its not going to kill anyone like rearing. It won't even cause them to strike, they may do a slow paw which might cause a bruise. I wouldn't teach pick pocket to a known biter unless I've broke him of that habit.. this is also why I use a red hankie or a whip.. Those two things are the ONLY things he's allowed to bite.

    The one thing that prevents all of the randomness is a routine. Everytime I do tricks my horse bows, kneels, camal walks, lay down, roll over, sit, sit salute, pivot sitting, sit salute, up!, Stand in front and talk to your audience let him pick pocket and wave it.. act surprised. "Hey now! You want a whippin?!" he shakes his head No. "Your a good pony arn't you??" he knods Yes. Put the hankie back in the pocket and he picks it again and waves it... "Why do you want that hankie so bad? Got a cold?" Hold the hankie to his nose and he blows his nose. He says thank you by giving me a kiss on the cheek.

    I could go on an on. Yes you can change up your routine, but then you do it for a while so that he knows what is expected.
         
        02-06-2009, 09:30 AM
      #24
    Started
    Please quit with the comparing your horse with the Spanish horses. These horses are trained by people who have devoted their entire lives to creating this art form... much like a geisha devotes her entire life to doing her geisha thing. The horses do not live lives that even closely resemble that of a normal horse's. I met an Andalusian who had come from one of these programs at one time. He was absolutely amazing, but the reason they sold him is because he didn't have the right mindset or quite the physical ability to do their tricks. You aren't taking into account that the Spanish trainers go through a lot of uber-fancy well-bred gorgeous horses before they find the few that have what it takes. Also, he had been in such a rigorous program with so much training and so little "normal" horse life that he had to learn how to graze as a seven year old. It was pretty pathetic watching a full grown horse pull up as many clods of dirt with his grass as a 6-month old foal.

    I can also assure you that before these horses come anywhere near to taking feet off the ground, they are extensively trained in advanced dressage on the ground to build up their body condition and teach them good form. These are a few hundred steps that you are skipping, and while your horse may be able to do it, it will never be quite as good or quite as "safe" as it is with the Spanish horses.

    Another thing that you are not taking into account is that having the weight of a rider on its back changes a horse's balance dramatically. Just because a horse can rear in a field and be fine does not always mean that he can rear with you on his back and be fine. And honestly, I've never in my 12 years of living, riding and working with horses, seen one rear any higher than the rear in the picture you've shown while at liberty. They usually only go up really high to do some serious fighting.

    Finally, I don't understand what you're trying to prove with this. If it's all about ego and "being on the side that can do fine while rearing" and "not looking like some fair little lady in a medieval fair"... these are not legitimate reasons. In my opinion, most things done with a horse should be meant to improve yourself, improve your horse, or get a practical job done. Teaching your horse to rear is not really accomplishing any of this.
         
        02-06-2009, 10:14 AM
      #25
    Foal
    Hi
    I must agree with my fellow horsemen above.
    You are comparing apples and oranges. You may be a good rider I don't know. But the spanish rding school are dedicated to the art of riding and have been doing this for hundreds of years. Secondly, the rear you keep refeering to in the spainsh riding school is called the levade. It is not the straight up rear, like in the movies . But it is a higher level rear which is not that high but a very controlled and hard to perform. Since the horse must hold it for seven seconds

    Also they do not just teach any stallion they choose a specific stallions to do the job. Some will learn the levade some the courbette
    One of these factors is more or less how is the horse mentally.
    This applies to any horse.
    I have taught my horse to rear on commmand. But I only did so knowing
    1. My horse had the mind set for it. I wouldn't train a horse right off the race track to do this.
    2. We toke our time
    3.We had an experianced horseman to guide the way.

    Sorry for the lengthy note. But I do wish you the best if you want to do it go ahead what ever the out come may be.
         
        02-06-2009, 03:29 PM
      #26
    Yearling
    I have to agree with the last two posters and would like to add that there is a big difference between the horses that they speak of and a back yard trainer trying to make a horse do a trick(for what purpose?).
    There is a big difference between a circus act and riding.
    I would throw anyone off my ranch trying to teach their horse to rear like that and I know many professional trainers that would do the same thing.
    Do as you wish.
         
        02-06-2009, 04:31 PM
      #27
    Yearling
    I agree, I would probably ask someone to leave my farm if they did this because I know one day, that horse will rear when I'm leading it some where and chances are that person isn't paying me enough to deal with that BS.
         
        02-06-2009, 05:26 PM
      #28
    Showing
    I would like to make two points:

    1) The horses in the Spanish Riding School are taught to LEVADE, not rear. There is a distinct difference; the levade is the ultimate in collection. The horse is extremely low to the ground, using its haunches in an extreme way to balance.

    2) Perhaps everyone who wants to help Zab should contact her through PMs - there are children who frequent this forum that think rearing is "cool" and want to know how to teach their horsey - and we all know where that would end up.

    Thank you.

    Edited to add...

    My voice command for the canter is "up" ... I say it without thinking most times...
         
        02-06-2009, 07:37 PM
      #29
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Zab    
    Well, to quote a trainer: "Do you teach your horse to canter? If yes.. does he canter all the time even if you don't ask for it?" I think that sums it up pretty much. As long as it's done in a good way, it won't be a problem.

    I will answer this.

    Yes they will canter with the right aids, however someone else on your horse could easily give a canter aid and not know it and may not be able to stay on the horse....a recipe for disaster.

    I saw one girl get her head split open when she rode her friends horse and made a aid known to the horse and owner only. The horse galloped and the new rider had only just barely mounted and hadn't been prepared for the result. Not a happy end.

    As others have said, it is one thing to have professionals ( like the horse trainers in the movies for example) that work daily with horses at liberty but they know what they are doing and they enact safety precautions as well as no one else is allowed to handle them.
         
        02-06-2009, 08:45 PM
      #30
    Showing
    Generally those horses are never sold to the "general public" as well, Spyder
         

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