Softening up a board.... - Page 3
   

       The Horse Forum > Training Horses > Horse Training

Softening up a board....

This is a discussion on Softening up a board.... within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category

     
    LinkBack Thread Tools
        02-19-2010, 12:21 PM
      #21
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by justsambam08    
    I was not talking about cranking his nose back to his hip, I was talking about the equivalent of a direct-reined turn. Only with baling twine. And with me on the ground.
    Forget the twine it probably is stronger than your bridle rein anyway. Move your stirrup forward 8-12 inches and tie one rein in a quick release knot then let go of the stirrup and step away. The stirrup should only have to move 6-8 inches to hang straight.
         
    Sponsored Links
    Advertisement
     
        02-19-2010, 01:18 PM
      #22
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by kevinshorses    
    If you want to get on a horse that doesn't bend then go ahead you will probably get away with it. I have gotten in bad situations that way enough that I choose not to get on a horse unless I have some bend in them.
    Exactly. That's how I managed to get dropped off the last time, because I assumed he was actually giving to the pressure enough from the saddle, and he really wasn't. He jerked his head back from my hand and then took off. So now I'm paranoid about getting him as responsive as possible.
         
        02-19-2010, 01:38 PM
      #23
    Trained
    Like mls said, he will bend his neck, but he will not be round or supple or even learn to give to contact. Like I said, a circle has almost NOTHING to do with the inside rein. The outside rein acts as your wall, the inside rein is nice and light and fluffy, encouraging your horse to go to that "open" door. Also keep in mind that you have to look at yourself as the reason why your horse is acting up and not responding. Is your core allowing him to bend? Your legs, your seat, your thoughts? You can't just expect your horse to work with you, you have to work with him too.

    But go ahead and put a band aid on it. It seems my advice isn't being considered, so I won't be offering it anymore.
         
        02-19-2010, 01:55 PM
      #24
    Banned
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by riccil0ve    
    Like mls said, he will bend his neck, but he will not be round or supple or even learn to give to contact. Like I said, a circle has almost NOTHING to do with the inside rein. The outside rein acts as your wall, the inside rein is nice and light and fluffy, encouraging your horse to go to that "open" door. Also keep in mind that you have to look at yourself as the reason why your horse is acting up and not responding. Is your core allowing him to bend? Your legs, your seat, your thoughts? You can't just expect your horse to work with you, you have to work with him too.

    But go ahead and put a band aid on it. It seems my advice isn't being considered, so I won't be offering it anymore.
    I failed to mention this because it didn't really have relevance to the topic, but I ride him in a bitless bridle, so contact is nonexistant, and for the most part we neck rein. I asked for bending and stretching exercises that I could do from the ground in the OP. Although figure eights and circles help for balance and suppling, I want to be able to do a one rein stop on him if I need to, which requires bend.
         
        02-19-2010, 02:00 PM
      #25
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by justsambam08    
    I failed to mention this because it didn't really have relevance to the topic, but I ride him in a bitless bridle, so contact is nonexistant, and for the most part we neck rein. I asked for bending and stretching exercises that I could do from the ground in the OP. Although figure eights and circles help for balance and suppling, I want to be able to do a one rein stop on him if I need to, which requires bend.

    If you want to do a one rein stop then you also have to have control of the hindquarters. If you can't disengage the hindquarters then all you will do is pull your horses head sideways while he is running off with you. I used to think the One rein stop was the cure for all ills but for horses that are hard to stop I prefer the pulley rein or calvary stop.
         
        02-19-2010, 05:21 PM
      #26
    Trained
    Ah dear. Fight fight fight. You were going to tie his head around with bailing twine sweet. Totally different concept to what kevinshorses has explained, his method the horse CAN straighten it's neck. Tying with bailing twine forces the horse to have his neck pulled to the side. It will teach submission, but will not create a supple horse.

    Anyone can bend a horses neck left and right and touch their foot. It's a standard pony club 'trick'. Yes it is good if you want them to give their jaw, but if you don't have their head around without them being 'round' and vertically flexed, it will be a fruitless exercise anyway.

    As has been described again and again throughout the forum in detail and a number of times by posters on this thread, starting with the head has little to no effect on the rest of the horses body. You can pull his head to the left to 'bend' his neck, but his body will simply remain rigid and stiff. Bending the neck WILL NOT create a supple body. The only bend in the neck I ever use is a little flexion in lateral work, and in trot and canter I will lightly flex a few degrees to the left, a few degrees to the right so test the softness of the jaw and poll.

    Suppleness/bend.. whatever you want to refer to it as, comes as a direct result of an engaged hind end under saddle. You also have horses who are naturally very flexible, but this is certainly not the case for your horse by the sounds of it.

    You say he tracks up... I bet he's just running through your hands and you have near to no control of the exact speed, tempo>>>??? Tracking up does not always mean that the horse is truly forward and engaged. Does he move off the second you put a light leg aid on? If not, he is just running on through the aids. You have to be able to put your leg on and expect an immediate forward reaction, and touch your rein and expect an immediate slowing reaction.

    You want to have him doing wide circles, spiralling in and out, and teach him leg yield, then turn on the forehand an shoulder in. These lateral exercises are fantastic for suppling and getting full body bend, not just a neck that is pinned around sideway having no effect on the body what so ever.

    You said you wanted to do figure of 8's, serpentines and one rein stops. Well sorry to say by tying the neck absolutely, will NOT help you with this, he may bend his neck but the body will stay rigid and useless. The only way you will achieve this movements is by working on the hind end with transitions and such.

    But again, you seem like the type who wants a quick fix and a pretty head on your horse. So by all means. Go tie his head. I wish you luck.
         
        02-19-2010, 08:26 PM
      #27
    Banned
    Kayty, I have to ask where I explained that I was going to tie his head with 4 inches of baling twine and make him incapable of moving, since your tone kind of says you've read it somewhere. That doesn't really matter, I just kind of want to know where you're getting the idea from. I've noticed on this forum that people seem to jump down peoples throat for suggesting something, since that's all I did was suggest it. A simple "no don't do that here's why" would have sufficed, but instead I've been told I would perform the equivalent of rollkur. Kevin and I merely pointed out that it has its uses, neither of us advocated its use in this particular situation.

    The reason I am focusing so much on his head and neck area is because that's where all of his stiffness and problems are. These things don't just happen under saddle, they happen on the ground, in the round pen, and in his stall. If it was in his back, I'd have asked for massage/stretching/whatever other techniques to get him a little looser there. I understand that the figure eights and serpentines will get him more supple under saddle overall, but if you went to the chiropractor and told him you have a stiff neck, he wouldn't ask you to try and touch your toes.
         
        02-19-2010, 10:58 PM
      #28
    Trained
    Calm down ladies!! (you have no idea how many times I say that in a day) I think sometimes people look at the same thing from two different sides and think their seeing different things. No you can't get collection from hanging on a horses head and forcing it into frame but you can't ride the hind end into collection if you have no control of the front. You have to be able to hold up the front end. It isn't a one versus the other. The answer is in getting both. You have to have control of every part of teh horse to have any hope of getting any collection. If there is brace anywhere in the horse from the tail to the nose the chances of the horse moving in the best way is next to none.
         
        02-20-2010, 02:11 AM
      #29
    Trained
    Um... well when you said you were going to use bailing twine to tie his head. That kind of explained it. Kevinshorses method allows the horse to straighten it's head, bailing twine is a fixed tie with no give and will not teach a horse to give my making it uncomfortable to have its neck straight.

    Kevinshorses, you are right saying that you need control of all parts of the horse to get collection. However collection does not come from being able to pull the neck left and right. This doesn't do anything for you undersaddle other than being able to haul their head around if they take off, which by the way you can do anyway if you really need to stop them, without having to tie their head initially.

    Doing movements such as serpentines just cannot come from a bending neck, which is what the OP is so definintly suggesting in their responses. It comes from riding the hind end up to the bridle, once the horse is moving off the hind end, you can then start to play with the front end, getting it to yield and supple. Hence the lateral work. Within a week of teaching leg yield you should have a horse that is already starting to bend be more willing to yield, and is far more supple, then move onto turn on the forehand and shoulder fore which will increase the suppleness of the horse and the shoulders. It just does not come from a bending neck
         
        02-20-2010, 05:23 AM
      #30
    Banned
    At my barn we keep probably 7 or 8 feet of baling twine just laying around for whatever we may need it for. Its actually pretty great for a tie that needs to be strong but will break if an 1100 pound pulls on it. I'm fairly certain if I tied some of those pieces together, eventually I would get something that's long enough to have some give to it. I could just ask easily shorten my reins to allow no give when I tied them as I could use a four inch piece of baling twine. Making assumptions doesnt do anything for anyone.
         

    Thread Tools

    Similar Threads
    Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
    Softening and rounding angelsgrace Dressage 17 01-11-2010 10:44 PM
    Softening New Leather? apc11196 Horse Tack and Equipment 26 01-05-2010 09:51 PM
    Softening leather split reins ridesapaintedpony Horse Tack and Equipment 3 08-15-2009 03:48 PM
    leather softening in oil?? horseyhmg27 Horse Tack and Equipment 13 08-15-2009 03:22 PM
    Softening...? BluMagic Horse Training 17 04-05-2008 08:53 PM



    All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:36 PM.


    Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
    Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
    Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0