some advice needed!

Actually, hitting a horse is about the poorest way to make one mind. The only time I would even think of hitting one would be if he turned his butt to me and I knew he was threatening to kick.

It is much more effective to jerk hard on the lead-rope and make a horse back up and turn his shoulders to the right -- away from his handler. These are 'acts of submission' to a horse. I want one to back up or over from me in a controlled manner when I ask him to. This is also much more effective than running one around forward in circles around you.

You win when you control a horse's feet. I would rather control them by making them step back or over than to let them run around me going forward.

I would tie him up in a safe place and use a big soft cotton rope to 'sack him out' and would then pick up his hind feet with that rope.

I would tie this rope to his front pasterns (one at a time) and run it up over his back and pick each front foot up in that way. If he throws a fit, just step back, hang on to that rope and out last him. Set the foot down as soon as he relaxes and gives it willingly. He will quickly learn to give his feet in this way and you can stay out of harm's way.

Thank you cherie, I recently just found that method online somewhere.

I understand some peoples belives in hitting. It works for some but like people not all things work.
I will try the backing and turn to the right. What I understood about jerking the halter was it could make a horse head shy. When I have tried that with him before (just backing him) it never seemed to work, so next time I will add the turn of the shoulder to right.

I apperciate all the input, thank you guys
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Well just to be sure, I'm not talking about hitting just to be mean into a submission. I'm talking about with an elbow - mainly something to get her attention and especially if she deserves it. And hard enough so she knows I mean business.

Getting the horse to move his feet would be great. But in her situation, I'm not sure she could get her horse to do so in such a controlled manner. Just get him moving away from her. I wouldn't trust him yet to move him like you say.

Since you've been given all the advice you need, I just want to say you got this girl! :)

I am not a horse trainer and will not venture to guess anything that might work on this particular horse. But I just wanted to mention that I had a friend some years back whose horse reared and flipped over and crushed her withers while trying to load into a horse trailer and after a lengthy recovery (I don't know how long) she did go back to being a riding horse. The only lasting affect that her owner mentioned was that her withers were flatter than they used to be.

So I know of at least one successful outcome. This was a show horse, not a pleasure horse.

Personally, I think your horse acts the way he does because of the way he's been trained. More than a few people have dealt with former "Parellized" horses and have had the same problems as you.

I.e this is how Parelli leads and his rationale for it…

Being a natural leader to this uppity animal requires being aware of him AT ALL TIMES. If you learn and read the differences between his 'good' behavior (I.e. Any calm behavior) from the bad, you'll be able to one-up him, which may establish you as an adequate leader.

I don't know much about various horse training methods, but PP maximizes the energy you can get out of a horse, as opposed to setting the energy level for the animal. He has good ideas, but Id rather a horse ( or any animal Im training) to take their position and energy cues from me... not my grip on a lead rope.

If you feel intimidated by his sauciness, he WILL monopolize you on that. And from your posts, it sounds like you have more often than you'd prefer. I say be calm, even-toned and aware, as opposed to stressing about the next time he's going to be pushy and bratty.

If you think it, they'll do it.
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Thank you guys!

Honestly the whole pp idea of training has turned me off.

I have trained 6 horses so far (I am not calling myself a trainer) but none of them have ever acted like this guy. Kinda leaves me wondering if its the previous style. Either way I need this horse to obey me and understand me. I am not blamming the previous owner what so ever.

Kinda makes me laugh that his add said true gentillman, compared to what I have now he nothing close.

I do not think I have ever hurt him or put any cruel tack on him. I have not even used a bit to attempt to ride him. Just a side pull bossal. The only think I have used is the twitch and that was for medical reasons that could not wait as blood was flowing.
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