Which training methods to follow???
   

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Which training methods to follow???

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    08-28-2011, 03:47 AM
  #1
Foal
Which training methods to follow???

I got my Horse she is 18 and needs an advanced rider she is quick and changes direction quickly.
Anyway the last person to work with her used John Lyons methods hope I spelled his name right.
Some of his stuff makes sense but some of it I just don't like.
I prefer respect from my horse versus love I don't want my horse to hate me or fear me so to speak but I don't treat my horse like a dog it is a horse with a purpose.
I know there are a lot of good trainers out there but which has had the best result for people here I don't want to confuse her with training styles but her biggest problem is she gets herself all worked up and than listens to nothing I need good calming down techniques. She is a Thoroughbred by the way.
     
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    08-28-2011, 04:20 AM
  #2
Green Broke
Do not align yourself with one single trainer. There is no foolproof method. Different things work for different horses.

Instead start absorbing knowledge from every possible source. Remember that you will never finish learning.

Don't only look for the good either. When watching a trainer work absorb the good things, the things you can see yourself learning. Observe the things you disagree with. Contemplate why you would not do things that particular way, why would someone choose to do things that way. File that knowledge away too.

There is no sense in committing to one particular style. I guarantee you will do far better arming yourself with a wide variety of techniques to choose from.
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    08-28-2011, 12:06 PM
  #3
Foal
Well there is Clinton Anderson's method...I am kind of a fan of his work..its based off of respect....but I agree to look at different training ideas to see which works best for your horse....when you say she gets all worked up is that in the saddle or on ground....Clinton has some great videos for ground work and round pen work he really explains what he's doing it and why he doesn't want you to just do the training techniques he wants you to understand why you are doing them ...If its in the saddle you might need to go back and really work on her ground work before you start riding her...I def wouldn't be getting on a horse that gets so worked up she doesn't listen to anything
     
    08-28-2011, 12:35 PM
  #4
Foal
I don't really have one method. I don't think John Lyons is about loving your horse instead of gaining respect tho. I do pick & choose but I've felt John Lyons has a majority of good idea's. I also like Clinton Anderson- not a big fan of Pat Perelli tho haha. I would read thru em all & pick what you like but MAKE sure you understand what a lesson is actually teaching or proving before making an assumption on something. Most of em might be hard to figure out at first as to the why's of a lesson. :)
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    08-28-2011, 01:04 PM
  #5
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by HowClever    
Do not align yourself with one single trainer. There is no foolproof method. Different things work for different horses.

Instead start absorbing knowledge from every possible source. Remember that you will never finish learning.
I gotta ditto, ditto, and ditto that.

I never realized how fortunate I was to have the grandfather I had. He was a generation ahead of the Dorrance Brothers and gave me the most solid horse foundation a kid (or adult) could ask for.

It is aggravating that NH trainers all tout their methods as new. Nothing new about them - they are things that were forgotten, got remembered, marketed, and someone's making a bundle off, carrot sticks and whatever other widgets and gidgets that are inferred to make a novice horseman an expert trainer.

Now that I've said that. Here are my two favorite folks

The Carolyn Resnick Method - Horse books

Mark Rashid Horse Training <----HE resembles the movie actor Sam Elliott, which doesn't hurt a thing either

The most crucial thing in horse training is to establish just who the alpha dominant horse is when you put the halter on that horse. That does not mean the human beats the skin off the horse, it means the human IS in charge and the horse will respect that. Some horses will challenge that on occasion but the handler just says "no, I am still the boss for five more minutes".

My very strong alpha-dominant horse will walk out of his stall, stand under the overhang, without moving a hoof unless his arthritis acts up, to get a 30 minute bath/scrubdown<----WITHOUT a halter on him. Nothing, not even a binder twine dangling off his neck. He respects me being the dominant one over him because I am fair and he reciprocates that kindness by not walking away and also blowing in my ear during the bath process.

If the handler is a timid individual and is not able to set well-defined but fair boundaries for the horse, all the books, DVD's, carrot sticks in the world are not going to help if the horse is strong-willed.
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    08-28-2011, 03:19 PM
  #6
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by walkinthewalk    
I gotta ditto, ditto, and ditto that.

I never realized how fortunate I was to have the grandfather I had. He was a generation ahead of the Dorrance Brothers and gave me the most solid horse foundation a kid (or adult) could ask for.

It is aggravating that NH trainers all tout their methods as new. Nothing new about them - they are things that were forgotten, got remembered, marketed, and someone's making a bundle off, carrot sticks and whatever other widgets and gidgets that are inferred to make a novice horseman an expert trainer.

Now that I've said that. Here are my two favorite folks

The Carolyn Resnick Method - Horse books

Mark Rashid Horse Training <----HE resembles the movie actor Sam Elliott, which doesn't hurt a thing either

The most crucial thing in horse training is to establish just who the alpha dominant horse is when you put the halter on that horse. That does not mean the human beats the skin off the horse, it means the human IS in charge and the horse will respect that. Some horses will challenge that on occasion but the handler just says "no, I am still the boss for five more minutes".

My very strong alpha-dominant horse will walk out of his stall, stand under the overhang, without moving a hoof unless his arthritis acts up, to get a 30 minute bath/scrubdown<----WITHOUT a halter on him. Nothing, not even a binder twine dangling off his neck. He respects me being the dominant one over him because I am fair and he reciprocates that kindness by not walking away and also blowing in my ear during the bath process.

If the handler is a timid individual and is not able to set well-defined but fair boundaries for the horse, all the books, DVD's, carrot sticks in the world are not going to help if the horse is strong-willed.
Thank you I will check them out.
And I agree with you I have seen some of the best trained Horses play may games with there owners because they knew they could.
I am not letting her get there but I also have to believe in the method in order for me to use it effectively.
I have looked at a few things and some are too weak so to speak they may work for some but not for me.
I expect any horse I deal with to respect me they are to big not too I also own a Drafthorse I have never seen her back down from any other horse even other drafts.
She was a handfull when I got her she belongs to my son now. She would push anyone around I have her now to the point where she waits on my ques to do what I want her too.
But I found her easier do deal with that the new horse.
     
    08-28-2011, 06:16 PM
  #7
Started
Quote:
Originally Posted by FIREBLADE    
She was a handfull when I got her she belongs to my son now. She would push anyone around I have her now to the point where she waits on my ques to do what I want her too.
But I found her easier do deal with that the new horse.
You didn't say you've at this awhile and happened to get one that says "no just to say no"

I have one like that. He is 16 and has been with me since he was 2-1/2. He used to be a real snotface but also one of the best trail horses I could ask for. His 16.1H self is capable of being a real bully to a human or another horse.

While he can still be a Pip, I hate that it took my senior horse becoming insulin resistant 4 years ago to find out the Snotface is oat/corn/soy intolerant.

I had taken all my horses off grain and put them on the same base diet as my metabolic horse.

It made such a difference in Rusty's willingness to please that I haven't had to put the riding crop in the bath bucket since. My non-horse husband also noticed the huge difference in Rusty's personality.

I don't feed legume hay to him either - I also know he can't have alfalfa for the same reason. I feed everyone a mixed grass hay that is locally grown.

In Rusty's case, the food intolerance was so minor that I spent all those years blaming his snotty disposition on his bloodline. Never dawned on me he might be oat/corn/soy intolerant but he is.

This is the same horse that I can "forget" to close the gate from his stall going down the aisle and he will get out. He really doesn't want out so he will half halt himself down the aisle way until I say "Rusty stop and step back for a cookie". He will stop and back clear out of the aisleway into the open end stall and I'm not even standing in the barn.

Rusty would've never listened like that back in the day when he was eating oats, corn, and soy

I've had my own horses 52 of my 64 years and I would have never believed that food allergies would make that subtle a difference in a horse's personality and behavior, until I saw it with my own eyes, in my own barn

If you're feeding grain, can you experiment by taking the grain away and just feed him a ration balancer? If he's already on a ration balancer, maybe there's something the ingredients list that he's intolerant to.

Even if the horse has food intolerance, it will still need to un-learn the nasty habits it's developed. Rusty will occasionally try me but he isn't anything like he used to be
     
    08-28-2011, 09:57 PM
  #8
Foal
I agree with trying to change the horses diet...I also read that a lot of horses have ulcers because they are made to graze constantly their digestive system doesn't stop like ours does it keeps producing acid even if theres no food in their stomach and it causes them great pain and can cause problems training and riding because they are just hurting so bad inside....most says to have your vet check the horse out and that giving mint Milk of Magnesia really helps but you should have a vet tell you the amount to give the horse
     
    08-28-2011, 11:25 PM
  #9
Foal
Quote:
Originally Posted by walkinthewalk    
You didn't say you've at this awhile and happened to get one that says "no just to say no"

I have one like that. He is 16 and has been with me since he was 2-1/2. He used to be a real snotface but also one of the best trail horses I could ask for. His 16.1H self is capable of being a real bully to a human or another horse.

While he can still be a Pip, I hate that it took my senior horse becoming insulin resistant 4 years ago to find out the Snotface is oat/corn/soy intolerant.

I had taken all my horses off grain and put them on the same base diet as my metabolic horse.

It made such a difference in Rusty's willingness to please that I haven't had to put the riding crop in the bath bucket since. My non-horse husband also noticed the huge difference in Rusty's personality.

I don't feed legume hay to him either - I also know he can't have alfalfa for the same reason. I feed everyone a mixed grass hay that is locally grown.

In Rusty's case, the food intolerance was so minor that I spent all those years blaming his snotty disposition on his bloodline. Never dawned on me he might be oat/corn/soy intolerant but he is.

This is the same horse that I can "forget" to close the gate from his stall going down the aisle and he will get out. He really doesn't want out so he will half halt himself down the aisle way until I say "Rusty stop and step back for a cookie". He will stop and back clear out of the aisleway into the open end stall and I'm not even standing in the barn.

Rusty would've never listened like that back in the day when he was eating oats, corn, and soy

I've had my own horses 52 of my 64 years and I would have never believed that food allergies would make that subtle a difference in a horse's personality and behavior, until I saw it with my own eyes, in my own barn

If you're feeding grain, can you experiment by taking the grain away and just feed him a ration balancer? If he's already on a ration balancer, maybe there's something the ingredients list that he's intolerant to.

Even if the horse has food intolerance, it will still need to un-learn the nasty habits it's developed. Rusty will occasionally try me but he isn't anything like he used to be

I will look into that the last owner had her for 8 years she was going to use her as an advanced lesson horse but people always bought horses before they got to her.
She was ridden only 11 times this year and it isn't that she is really bad she just workes herself into a panic sometimes so to speak.
She goes faster and faster and than just won't listen to anything anymore.
I have been working with the person who rode her the most and getting an idea where some of her issues are.
I jusplan on starting from the bottom and fill in the gaps that someone may have missed without knowing it.
I belive training is a building block you have to follow thru and not skip over things at least with certain Horses again this is just my opinion.
She came from a farm the breed polo horses.
     
    09-04-2011, 07:51 PM
  #10
Foal
Great answer, HowClever - I'm a greenhorn but seems that many good trainers use a system of pressure and release. I like to learn from a variety of trainers. I like watching several of the trainers on tv. Right now, I "beginning all over again" and using Clinton Anderson's dvds to help me out. So far, the instructions have been direct and easy to understand. I'm making progress. I'm the one who needs the training! I tell about it at http://www.TVhorsetalk.blogspot.com - I love being back in the horse world.
     

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