What do YOU think of clicker training - Page 8
 
 

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What do YOU think of clicker training

This is a discussion on What do YOU think of clicker training within the Horse Training forums, part of the Training Horses category

    View Poll Results: Do you recommend clicker training?
    Yes 22 48.89%
    No 23 51.11%
    Voters: 45. You may not vote on this poll

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        08-12-2012, 04:45 AM
      #71
    Foal
    well yes...

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by christopher    
    other than the fact that you've mixed up negative reinforcement and positive punishment, I agree.
    I agree I got them mixed up and will get them mixed up the second I am not actively looking at this post...lol, my main point however, was that a clicker was great to use with positive reinforcement. And that you would have to be insane to only use one kind of tool or approach when working with horses lol

    Not sure why clickers are getting such a bad rep on here...?
         
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        08-12-2012, 04:57 AM
      #72
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mnl764    
    Not sure why clickers are getting such a bad rep on here...?
    I think it's just down to not understanding the principles behind it. Eg. That an actual plastic clicker is not a necessary part of it - just a handy, practical tool of choice for many. Or that you can only teach certain animals/tricks. Or that a certain type of reinforcement creates 'respect' while another type creates 'rudeness'. Or that 'clicker trainers' use food treats/+R to the exclusion of any other methods or feedback - as you said, 'you would have to be insane to only use one kind of tool or approach when working with horses' - I agree!
    christopher likes this.
         
        08-12-2012, 06:48 PM
      #73
    Foal
    You definitely don't need the clicker! Any noise or cue that the horse can perceive and you can repeat will do. I use a kiss noise because I kept dropping and losing my clicker-esp when riding.

    And for those who think that we shouldn't treat our horses like dogs (why not?) clicker training was actually developed by people who train killer whales and dolphins. Elephants in Nepal are now being trained with it instead of being tied up and beaten into submission. If you can use it to gain control of a three tonne elephant what is wrong with using it to gain control of a 1000 pound horse.

    The most dangerous horses I have ever encountered have all been trained (very badly) with negative refinforcement. Very few horses learn to buck, rear, bolt or shy because they got carrots at the wrong time, but plenty of horses learn to do all these things because of negative reinforcement gone wrong. This forum is full of stories about such horses.
    loosie likes this.
         
        08-12-2012, 11:57 PM
      #74
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by loosie    
    You don't see any point in it, you don't like the examples you've seen and you don't understand the principles. That's fine by me. But I don't get the dog comment??
    Have you ever watched the show on AnimalPlanet, Is It Me Or The Dog? She does clicker training.
    Then have you ever watched Pat Parelli or Clinton Anderson work with horses?

    Point is, Clinton Anderson and Pat Parelli treat their horses like horses. Not through clicker training like dogs.
         
        08-13-2012, 01:24 AM
      #75
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TheAQHAGirl    
    Point is, Clinton Anderson and Pat Parelli treat their horses like horses. Not through clicker training like dogs.
    I don't get your point. Have you seen Gwenneth Santagate(for eg) training horses & have you seen that 'dog whisperer' or anyone training a dog with a choke chain or related 'methods'? Since you mention the name, have you seen Parelli deal with his dogs... & what they appear to think of him?
         
        08-13-2012, 02:18 AM
      #76
    Foal
    I show horses.

    Unless I can take a training aid into the show pen with me, I try not to use it.
         
        08-28-2012, 06:10 PM
      #77
    Weanling
    My 32 y.o QH mare is not up for an invigorating ride, but her mind is as sharp as a tack. We are having fun clicker training for tricks. It is great to see her engaged and lively. I am mindful of how she takes treats; there is no mugging.
    My gelding loves to learn as well. I c/t every once in awhile and try to be consistent in my delivery of praise/pats/treats when he "gets" it. I think he's enjoying it, too.
         
        08-28-2012, 08:00 PM
      #78
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TheAQHAGirl    
    Have you ever watched the show on AnimalPlanet, Is It Me Or The Dog? She does clicker training.
    Then have you ever watched Pat Parelli or Clinton Anderson work with horses?

    Point is, Clinton Anderson and Pat Parelli treat their horses like horses. Not through clicker training like dogs.

    I train with treats (and my "kiss" clicker) and I treat my horses like horses. No mugging, no pushing, no bossing. It all comes down to the behaviour I want the horse (or dog, or cow, or dolphin) to perform, the cue and reward for the animal. Getting something nice to eat is often much more motivating for a horse than having a pressure taken away, which is how negative reinforcement works.

    We can't avoid NR in horse training, but adding () food rewards can make the job of training that much easier. A French study compared horses trained to perform a task with positive reinforcement and those trained with negative reinforcement. They found that in the short and longer (12 months) term, the PR trained horses volunatarily spent considerably more time with and simply hung out with both their trainers and unfamiliar trainers compared to the NR horses.

    A link to the study http://paardengedrag.be/wp-content/u...-in-horses.pdf
    loosie likes this.
         
        08-28-2012, 08:07 PM
      #79
    Started
    I've begun training my pony with clicker (smooch) training. He has excelled SO fast. I can't believe how incredible. He went from a frightened aggressive pony who was returned to our rescue after 'attacking' his NH trainer to a pony I can take Anywhere - including walks near cars, busy trails with dogs, everything! I'm working on teaching him agility by following his target now.

    I feel so bad for my mare who I'm still training using NH- I think it's time I start teaching her with smooch training too ^^
    loosie and corymbia like this.
         
        08-28-2012, 08:24 PM
      #80
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by corymbia    
    and I treat my horses like horses. No mugging, no pushing, no bossing. ...
    We can't avoid NR in horse training, but adding () food rewards...
    Yeah, I just don't get the 'don't treat horses like dogs' attitude at all & all I can put it down to is that some people may have the attitude that dogs don't need to learn 'manners' or some such - personally I don't like dogs 'mugging' me any more than horses.

    Re the 'can't avoid NR', *apparently* according to 'purist' PR trainers you can, but I personally don't have a problem in the least with using 'normal' training & feel like doing away with it would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Perhaps this is where the myth of 'spoiling' horses with PR comes from - people that don't understand assume that's the only technique used.
    corymbia and PunksTank like this.
         

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    clicker training, horses, opinon, pros cons, training

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