What do YOU think of clicker training - Page 8 - The Horse Forum

View Poll Results: Do you recommend clicker training?
Yes 23 50.00%
No 23 50.00%
Voters: 46. You may not vote on this poll

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post #71 of 94 Old 08-12-2012, 04:45 AM
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well yes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher View Post
other than the fact that you've mixed up negative reinforcement and positive punishment, I agree.
I agree I got them mixed up and will get them mixed up the second I am not actively looking at this post...lol, my main point however, was that a clicker was great to use with positive reinforcement. And that you would have to be insane to only use one kind of tool or approach when working with horses lol

Not sure why clickers are getting such a bad rep on here...?
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post #72 of 94 Old 08-12-2012, 04:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mnl764 View Post
Not sure why clickers are getting such a bad rep on here...?
I think it's just down to not understanding the principles behind it. Eg. That an actual plastic clicker is not a necessary part of it - just a handy, practical tool of choice for many. Or that you can only teach certain animals/tricks. Or that a certain type of reinforcement creates 'respect' while another type creates 'rudeness'. Or that 'clicker trainers' use food treats/+R to the exclusion of any other methods or feedback - as you said, 'you would have to be insane to only use one kind of tool or approach when working with horses' - I agree!
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post #73 of 94 Old 08-12-2012, 06:48 PM
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You definitely don't need the clicker! Any noise or cue that the horse can perceive and you can repeat will do. I use a kiss noise because I kept dropping and losing my clicker-esp when riding.

And for those who think that we shouldn't treat our horses like dogs (why not?) clicker training was actually developed by people who train killer whales and dolphins. Elephants in Nepal are now being trained with it instead of being tied up and beaten into submission. If you can use it to gain control of a three tonne elephant what is wrong with using it to gain control of a 1000 pound horse.

The most dangerous horses I have ever encountered have all been trained (very badly) with negative refinforcement. Very few horses learn to buck, rear, bolt or shy because they got carrots at the wrong time, but plenty of horses learn to do all these things because of negative reinforcement gone wrong. This forum is full of stories about such horses.
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Horses are blameless participants in training- its up to us to get it right

Last edited by corymbia; 08-12-2012 at 06:56 PM.
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post #74 of 94 Old 08-12-2012, 11:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loosie View Post
You don't see any point in it, you don't like the examples you've seen and you don't understand the principles. That's fine by me. But I don't get the dog comment??
Have you ever watched the show on AnimalPlanet, Is It Me Or The Dog? She does clicker training.
Then have you ever watched Pat Parelli or Clinton Anderson work with horses?

Point is, Clinton Anderson and Pat Parelli treat their horses like horses. Not through clicker training like dogs.
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post #75 of 94 Old 08-13-2012, 01:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAQHAGirl View Post
Point is, Clinton Anderson and Pat Parelli treat their horses like horses. Not through clicker training like dogs.
I don't get your point. Have you seen Gwenneth Santagate(for eg) training horses & have you seen that 'dog whisperer' or anyone training a dog with a choke chain or related 'methods'? Since you mention the name, have you seen Parelli deal with his dogs... & what they appear to think of him?
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post #76 of 94 Old 08-13-2012, 02:18 AM
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I show horses.

Unless I can take a training aid into the show pen with me, I try not to use it.

There are gonna be so many people in your life that are gonna tell you you can't. What you gotta do is turn around, look them in the eyes and say "Watch me."
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post #77 of 94 Old 08-28-2012, 06:10 PM
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My 32 y.o QH mare is not up for an invigorating ride, but her mind is as sharp as a tack. We are having fun clicker training for tricks. It is great to see her engaged and lively. I am mindful of how she takes treats; there is no mugging.
My gelding loves to learn as well. I c/t every once in awhile and try to be consistent in my delivery of praise/pats/treats when he "gets" it. I think he's enjoying it, too.
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post #78 of 94 Old 08-28-2012, 08:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAQHAGirl View Post
Have you ever watched the show on AnimalPlanet, Is It Me Or The Dog? She does clicker training.
Then have you ever watched Pat Parelli or Clinton Anderson work with horses?

Point is, Clinton Anderson and Pat Parelli treat their horses like horses. Not through clicker training like dogs.

I train with treats (and my "kiss" clicker) and I treat my horses like horses. No mugging, no pushing, no bossing. It all comes down to the behaviour I want the horse (or dog, or cow, or dolphin) to perform, the cue and reward for the animal. Getting something nice to eat is often much more motivating for a horse than having a pressure taken away, which is how negative reinforcement works.

We can't avoid NR in horse training, but adding () food rewards can make the job of training that much easier. A French study compared horses trained to perform a task with positive reinforcement and those trained with negative reinforcement. They found that in the short and longer (12 months) term, the PR trained horses volunatarily spent considerably more time with and simply hung out with both their trainers and unfamiliar trainers compared to the NR horses.

A link to the study http://paardengedrag.be/wp-content/u...-in-horses.pdf
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Horses are blameless participants in training- its up to us to get it right
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post #79 of 94 Old 08-28-2012, 08:07 PM
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I've begun training my pony with clicker (smooch) training. He has excelled SO fast. I can't believe how incredible. He went from a frightened aggressive pony who was returned to our rescue after 'attacking' his NH trainer to a pony I can take Anywhere - including walks near cars, busy trails with dogs, everything! I'm working on teaching him agility by following his target now.

I feel so bad for my mare who I'm still training using NH- I think it's time I start teaching her with smooch training too ^^
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post #80 of 94 Old 08-28-2012, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corymbia View Post
and I treat my horses like horses. No mugging, no pushing, no bossing. ...
We can't avoid NR in horse training, but adding () food rewards...
Yeah, I just don't get the 'don't treat horses like dogs' attitude at all & all I can put it down to is that some people may have the attitude that dogs don't need to learn 'manners' or some such - personally I don't like dogs 'mugging' me any more than horses.

Re the 'can't avoid NR', *apparently* according to 'purist' PR trainers you can, but I personally don't have a problem in the least with using 'normal' training & feel like doing away with it would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Perhaps this is where the myth of 'spoiling' horses with PR comes from - people that don't understand assume that's the only technique used.
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