My Journey in Becoming a Strong Leader - Page 51 - The Horse Forum
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post #501 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 12:25 AM
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Originally Posted by elle1959 View Post
I think it's okay to just be straightforward. You could simply tell her that you don't think the relationship is working out and that you won't be continuing. You don't have to provide additional details. I know it's hard to be blunt sometimes, we want to cushion the blow because we're told all the time that we need to be nice and protect others' feelings, but sometimes you just have to yank the band-aid off quickly because it's less painful in the long run.
I agree with Elle. Don't provide any details. Just say the relationship is not working out and don't get into a long discussion because she will to talk you out of stopping. Say thanks for everything and just say "Gotta run, good bye". Personally, I would say "Don't let the door hit you on the way out." (I was one of the ones that thought she was taking advantage of you) I'm glad you are finally getting rid of her!
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post #502 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 12:29 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ChristineNJ View Post
I agree with Elle. Don't provide any details. Just say the relationship is not working out and don't get into a long discussion because she will to talk you out of stopping. Say thanks for everything and just say "Gotta run, good bye". Personally, I would say "Don't let the door hit you on the way out." (I was one of the ones that thought she was taking advantage of you) I'm glad you are finally getting rid of her!
I know she didnt have many fans on here but I still think she is a great person and I know she wasnt taking advantage of me. Shes not that kind of person. Its just with her Parelli style, she has ridiculously high expectations for all horses when it comes to groundwork. I just dont like burning bridges, cause afterall the horse world is small.
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post #503 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 12:32 AM
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Good job!!! sometimes you just need one step thwn build from there. i might have a vid of my mare where im "plying" with her too at liberty. and no i rarely see licking or chewing from him unless he is eating something lol (or trying to at least).

here is a vid a dug up. not the best of what i can get her to do but its the only one thats good. most the vids i have are of her goofing off and im not asking much of her. pretty much of this vid but she was more for playing and wanted to "work"

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post #504 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 12:35 AM
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I didn't say not to reward them with each try they make. I said not to go all petting on them every single time.
the best reward to them is to allow them to just stand, unbothered, for a bit.

you might put your hand or your stick quietly on each time after they've complied, and rub if you are doing something really phyysical on them , like flagging them over in very close quarters , or applying some really big pressure on them if they are dulled out, and you want them to know that the item you are using as a tool on them (which may have been scary to them) is just an item. by rubbing on them after they done what you asked with the tool, you show them that it is your body language INTENTION that was transmitted with the tool, not the tool itslef. so, you are both flagging them big with it, then softly rubbing them with it, with a completely different intention in your body.

I know that Parelli and CA both rub the horse with the stick, after they have applied any kind of real push on it, to kind of 'rub out' the pressure.


I think all that is far from the level you are working at.

my real point is to not overly pet the horse after everything. they don't like it, and it will create a horse that is too close and too muggy on you.
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post #505 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 12:38 AM
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here slightly better one of my doing round pen work with my mare. you can see she likes it more and is more in tune with me. odie wants do chase butter flies and puppy dogs all day so two very different horses.
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post #506 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 12:43 AM
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^ YES! the paint was raised by my fiance and loved on quite a bit. its not a bad thing but my fiance and him literal lean on each other and push each other. its how they are. me not so much. so im dealing with a horse who is pushy and has a major "step mom" complex with me. he will jump over the moon for my fiance. he wont even stand still for me -_-'. i love on the horse after im done and the halter is off. when i was loving on the paint it was because he gets WAY to amped with Clinton Anderson (hence why i no longer do ca with him). my mare loves me but dose not want me to touch her lol! so both are polar opposite there too.
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post #507 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 12:57 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tinyliny View Post
by rubbing on them after they done what you asked with the tool, you show them that it is your body language INTENTION that was transmitted with the tool, not the tool itslef. so, you are both flagging them big with it, then softly rubbing them with it, with a completely different intention in your body.
What do you mean by this?

Quote:
I know that Parelli and CA both rub the horse with the stick, after they have applied any kind of real push on it, to kind of 'rub out' the pressure.


I think all that is far from the level you are working at.
Im not sure if its far from the level Im working at cause Ive seen enough of it with my own eyes to know what you mean when you first mentioned this.

Quote:
my real point is to not overly pet the horse after everything. they don't like it, and it will create a horse that is too close and too muggy on you.

True. I just wish Ive seen some trainers who dont pet after each time as a reward.
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post #508 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 09:00 AM
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A bit OT but do you guys think that horses (for the most part field owners) who arent handled often, arent ridden get sad or depressed about this? Do you think they know that they dont have a "caretaker" for them who doesnt come to halter them, work with them, brush them?

I know ideally horses just care about food, water and safety but I would think that stuff beyond that (grooming etc) eventually does play a factor. Ive heard some possible long term effects, no handling can have on a horse and just curious if it can affect them mentally.

Even though they are out in the field and are in a herd. I would think that horses know when they see me go in and catch my mare often and see the other boarder go and catch her mare as well. But these two boys are field horses and the only time they come out of the field is when they get their feet trimmed.

Reason I ask is because I am the person who spends the most amount of time in their field so Im the one person who interacts with these two boys the most. Whether im hanging out with them or doing whatever. So these two boys have become really attached to me. First it started with one but over the past few weeks Ive started to notice the other gelding start to get noticably more attached to me.

I give them some attention, rubs, scratches when I go in the field and my BO doesnt mind it (theyre technically his horses), but lately they have been wanting a lot of attention from me. One gets jealous when he sees me give my mare attention and when my mare sees me give either of them attention, she gets jealous and will try to come up as well. But because she is below these two in the herd, she cant push them around. So next thing you know all 3 are standing next to me wanting attention. These two boys are very respectful of my space every time I enter the herd and if they do get in my space I can easily move their feet with very minimal pressure.

But I wonder if they are a bit sad because they are looking for that leader. They are looking for someone to brush and groom them.
No they do not.
Horses do not need people if they have other horses.

No matter what sort of relationship you have with any horse, that same horse will kill you quick is that, see you dead on the ground, sniff you.. maybe paw you.. and then go back to eating.

My Father worked at a livery stable when he was a kid (1930's). Brought a horse there carrots every time he came to the barn (Jim Dandy was the horse). That horse would dump a paying customer when he heard my Dad anywhere on the place. They had a relationship born of carrots.

One day Dad was out riding Jim Dandy. They hit a patch of loose deep sand and the horse tripped and fell, wrenching a shoulder in the process. Horse was 3 legged at that point.. and it was a good thing. Dad was hung up on the saddle (Dad was 8 years old). Jim wanted to run, but could not (3 legged lame). So.. the horse took to trying to kick my Father who was hanging off one side of the saddle. If my Father had been a little larger or a little lower, Jim would have killed him. If the horse had not wrenched a shoulder so he was 3 legged, he would have killed him.

And that is what horses are. They are capable of killing you and you should never ever ever forget that. They are quite happy living without any human.
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There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man. ~Winston Churchill
(or woman!!!! ) Dinosaur Horse Trainer
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post #509 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 09:01 AM
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Lick and chew is thought to indicate a release of endorphins. It really has nothing to do with daily training. She may or may not do it, and it may or may not mean anything.

Far as teaching the horse not to reach for grass, this is difficult to explain. In the presence of the LEADER! The horse may try once to eat the grass. The horse gets punished. The horse does not try to eat grass again.

Before you try to teach an animal to differentiate between conflicting commands, you MUST have ONE perfected. If she is still trying to eat when you LEAD her, there is no way to teach her when it is OK to eat.
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post #510 of 5235 Old 05-16-2016, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Hoofpic View Post
Heres something that Ive always wanted to ask you guys that my outside trainer taught me on the first day seeing her.

She taught me to never ever scratch or rub any horse on their withers with 1) your palm of your hand and 2) you facing them. Because its confrontational and in their face.

She said the correct way to do it is to turn away from them (so your shoulder is away from them) and rub their withers with the back of your hand.

What do you guys think about this?
This is what I would call over thinking things.

Standing sideways to a horse is non confrontation. Facing them and making eye contact is confrontational. If you are working around a horse, such as grooming and so forth, you need to face the horse. You need to watch the horse if for no other reason than to be able to get out of the way if they suddenly move. Which side of your hand you pet the horse with is immaterial and is REALLY over thinking.

I trained with very little petting the horse. A single stroke on the neck when taking a break sitting on them was about it.

Training is really simple. It is the application of pressure and the release of pressure at exactly the correct time. Pressure, both positive and negative, creates stress and stress can be both positive and negative.

The way to learn horse body language is to sit outside a pasture or paddock (NOT interacting with the horses in the paddock) and watch a bunch of horses interact with each other (especially at feeding time). You will see horses pressure each other and they will use no more pressure than necessary to get a response from another horse.

There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man. ~Winston Churchill
(or woman!!!! ) Dinosaur Horse Trainer
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