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Join Up

This is a discussion on Join Up within the Natural Horsemanship forums, part of the Training Horses category

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        07-08-2012, 03:55 PM
      #41
    Foal
    I was just in a trailer incedent with my horse and I have been looking for ways to cure it but after hearing this I am definitely going to try it. I have heard of joining up but I haven't had acess to a round pen but im going to try it just with a lung line and whip and see what happens!
         
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        07-08-2012, 04:10 PM
      #42
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Angel5000    
    I was just in a trailer incedent with my horse and I have been looking for ways to cure it but after hearing this I am definitely going to try it. I have heard of joining up but I haven't had acess to a round pen but im going to try it just with a lung line and whip and see what happens!
    My favorite tool is a flag. Had to use a lariat with my OTTB who played the 'you can't reach me' game for a little while. Then when I just held it coiled up in my hands, he thought I could still reach him from anywhere, even if I couldn't.
         
        07-08-2012, 06:59 PM
      #43
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Angel5000    
    I was just in a trailer incedent with my horse and I have been looking for ways to cure it but after hearing this I am definitely going to try it. I have heard of joining up but I haven't had acess to a round pen but im going to try it just with a lung line and whip and see what happens!
    So IOW, you're going to try teaching some different cues on a lunge to see if it 'cures' fear of the trailer?
         
        07-09-2012, 12:59 PM
      #44
    Banned
    Push your horse away from you by waving your arms and "chasing" him.
    The way to know a horse is ready to join up with you are by several signs
    Inner Ear Turned Toward You
    Snorting
    Mouthing
    Sticking Tongue In & Out
         
        07-09-2012, 01:14 PM
      #45
    Weanling
    you're 'prepared & informed' I don't get why you're asking us? I would also make a point of understanding horse ethology(natural behaviour) & bodylanguage well before you try it, don't just be 'informed' about it from an 'NH' theory. I also recommend everyone learn the principles of basic behavioural training - not as heavy as it might sound - so they can know when to be, when not to be & why. Then you should be able to work out when & why to do something like roundpenning.

    I just meant that I know how to do it and why it would be beneficial, but there wwere some comments about how it doesnt work and it sends a bad message. I was just a bit confused:)
         
        07-09-2012, 02:19 PM
      #46
    Weanling
    I haven't been able to do join up with my riding horse yet, once we move I will be able to put up a round pen. Yaaay :) She already does Liberty Work, I'll betcha she'll be even better.
         
        07-10-2012, 12:19 AM
      #47
    Trained
    Snorting's now been added to the list of desirable stress signs... What the heck, why don't we add grinding teeth too??
         
        07-13-2012, 09:31 PM
      #48
    Weanling
    The idea of join up is: if the horse doesn't do what I want then I'm going to make him work harder. It teaches a horse to listen because if they don’t they’re going to have to do more work than the initially would have if they’d just done what you’d asked in the first place. Some people say it builds a bond but really the horse learns that whatever you want them to do is easier than not doing it or doing what they want. For example, I want the horse to pay attention to me and stand by my shoulder but it won’t so I’m going to make it do work until it does, then when it does what I want I’ll reward it by letting it stop working. Doesn't scream natural to me.

    It won’t work if the horse doesn’t know what you’re asking it. So if you want a horse to move a certain part of its body a certain way with a single cue you have to put the horse in that position, give them the cue, then reward them. Then once they know the cue, if they don’t send them out to do work. Join up is a crack pot idea that gives people a superiority complex and makes them think they are being integrated into the herd as a dominant member. It does teach a horse to listen to you but it does that by teaching them your way is easier.
    The idea that it works to create a bond is crazy to me. If you’re going to use it be careful because you can teach a horse to resent you or try harder to prove they are the dominant one in the relationship. If it isn’t working then stop trying. Horses are bigger and stronger than their human counterparts and if you’re not paying attention to what’s working or not you’re going to get hurt.
    loosie and corymbia like this.
         
        07-13-2012, 10:45 PM
      #49
    Showing
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by loosie    
    Snorting's now been added to the list of desirable stress signs... What the heck, why don't we add grinding teeth too??
    Next it'll be blinking!
    loosie likes this.
         
        07-14-2012, 03:11 PM
      #50
    Weanling
    Personally I just look for the inner ear, relaxation and licking/chewing. Also if they tilt their head in a little toward me, I take that as well. I never heard of using snorting as a sign on relaxation, probably never will take it that way either.
         

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