Natural H'ship, No Way ! (video) - The Horse Forum

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post #1 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 03:16 AM Thread Starter
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Unhappy Natural H'ship, No Way ! (video)

Does this tactic of training qualify as natural horsemanship ? I think NOT ! This is one training video that really disturbed me.

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post #2 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 04:08 AM
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poor man probably thinks he has control of the situation
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post #3 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 04:09 AM
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What in the world?
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post #4 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 04:23 AM
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Eh, I have seen a lot of trainers using a rope around the middle for 'bucking out' a horse. Here is clinton anderson using it.


I personally have no problem with it. Honestly where I stand I saw nothing horribly wrong with what the guy was doing. I don't like how often he gets jerked around by the rope that is on the flank, but honestly I don't think I, or anyone for that matter could have avoided it. Yes the horse was having a violent reaction, but for one this is a video to only show the horrible parts. I am looking this guy up now to find more proof one way or the other. Maybe the horse turned out to be a wonderful horse under his supervision, or maybe it turned into a monster. Can't judge by that video. I am always very slow to judge because I have seen tons of people confront horse training / sports and will base facts off of limited information.
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post #5 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 05:12 AM
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The part that confused me (and the horse, too, by the looks of it) is where he was "charging" the horse when the horse wasn't doing anything seemingly wrong. It wasn't even like he was trying to change direction or anything; just kind of throwing himself at the horse.
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post #6 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 06:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Horsesdontlie View Post
Eh, I have seen a lot of trainers using a rope around the middle for 'bucking out' a horse. Here is clinton anderson using it.

YouTube - ‪NEW!! On FSN, Sunday July 10, 2011: A bucking problem is no match for Clinton and the Method.‬‏

I personally have no problem with it. Honestly where I stand I saw nothing horribly wrong with what the guy was doing. I don't like how often he gets jerked around by the rope that is on the flank, but honestly I don't think I, or anyone for that matter could have avoided it. Yes the horse was having a violent reaction, but for one this is a video to only show the horrible parts. I am looking this guy up now to find more proof one way or the other. Maybe the horse turned out to be a wonderful horse under his supervision, or maybe it turned into a monster. Can't judge by that video. I am always very slow to judge because I have seen tons of people confront horse training / sports and will base facts off of limited information.
agree totally. I am not sure what he was trying to achieve when the horse had the saddle on tho....that confused me also.

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post #7 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 07:32 AM
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I've seen several BNT's use a lariat to prepare the horse for girth and flank pressure, including CA and Dennis Reis. My understanding of the point is that it's like another level of desensitization, beyond tossing the rope all over the horse. The horse in the video was reacting pretty dramatically, but the video was clearly edited for dramatic effect. It's hard to pass judgment over training ability based on videos like that. All shock value, and no information.

What exactly he was trying to accomplish in the clips where the horse is saddled, though, I have no idea. The thing that concerns me most about the entire display is that he seems to have the horse's head tied down in a few shots - with what I can't quite tell; too much dust and too much movement for my early morning eyes to spot it, lol. IMHO, if the horse is that willing to buck, then "headset" shouldn't be a factor at all, much less to the point that the horse is put in some sort of gadget to fix it.

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post #8 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 08:54 AM
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This method is certainly crude and a demonstration of a lack of real horsemanship expertise or knowledge. However it is an effective method of 'training' and a common one.

Trainers I have seen use this include Pat Parelli, Clinton Anderson, Chris Cox, Craig Cameron, Buck Branaman and Monty Roberts.

Monty ties them down with what he calls the 'buck stopper' then asks them to go forward and try to buck. Much like what was being done here when he chases the horse away, saddled and tied down.
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post #9 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 09:06 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by christopher View Post
poor man probably thinks he has control of the situation
He's being tossed around like a rag doll.. clearly he doesn't know what he's doing. This is the type of trainer that makes horses dangerous and problematic.
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post #10 of 41 Old 07-09-2011, 09:09 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Sunny View Post
The part that confused me (and the horse, too, by the looks of it) is where he was "charging" the horse when the horse wasn't doing anything seemingly wrong. It wasn't even like he was trying to change direction or anything; just kind of throwing himself at the horse.
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The horse was bitted up laterally when he charged the horse. Makes no sense to spook a horse when it's bitted up. Only causes the head to go up and the bit to cut into the horse's bars. The horse definitely had a sour mouth after that one I'm sure.
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