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The Road to the Horse

37K views 381 replies 30 participants last post by  Peggysue 
#1 ·
I've started this thread to talk about what is happening and to announce the winners.
 
#2 ·
Here's what happened yesterday:

Ya I've been watching and even my hubby came to watch. OK we're both hoping "my hero" wins :smile: However, Chris has got some good moves too. But what's happened thus far is that Pat is way ahead with his horse in that he focused on building rapport and then respect. He got up onto the horse within 40 minutes and he had him moving thru obstacles and things were looking good. Then he put the saddle on - still good - then he got back on and asked him to move a bit - lateral flexion if you please - perhaps the hind end too - and then after a few step boom he started bucking and reared up and poor Pat fell off. He fell OK thou and said he was OK but I fell off a warmblood 6 years ago just like that and I tell you I was sore for at least a week. But anyway he took the saddle off and then got back up just to sit a bit. Then he was done.

Chris got his horse to accept him on without a saddle and then with a saddle and then he rode him around a bit. He did very well. He reminds me of a colt starter I met about a year ago Daryl Gibbs very good, studied with Tom Dorrance before he died. He talks a lot about the horse's spirit - very cool. I always think that words - especially written words just can't describe things very well. So much of what we do is feel and knowing is feeling.

Then there was Clinton who didn't get very far with his horse today. No saddle but he did manage to lay on him. The horse did seem to accept him more at the end. I don't think he got as much rapport as either Pat or Chris got. He seems kind of over confident and was pushing the edge by desentizing his horse from outside the pen when he was supposed to be taking a break. Clinton constantly clucks and breathes really heavy like please guy stop with all the clucking and heavy breathing for goodness sakes you're the youngest guy here :wink:

So I guess we'll see what happens tomorrow - I can hardly wait :smile:
 
#4 · (Edited)
Thanks for posting, natisha! CC is very good - I've seen his demonstrations (with problem horses) at the Expo several years back and he's a very confident trainer. I'm surprised CA didn't get very far though. May be indeed he doesn't feel well... BTW IMHO that was a shame PP couldn't sit that buck (given his riding experience). He fell off almost on 1st one when horse didn't even went bronco yet. Not trying to criticize here (yes, I don't think I'd stay either), just really surprised.
 
#6 ·
You're welcome.
I like CC too. He would win in the filling jeans nicely category.
CA always is the last to get on. He does as much ground work as possible.
To be fair to PP that horse didn't just buck. See how its hindquarters were at an angle to the shoulders when it went up? That's very hard to sit as it spins you off, however it is one of the softest landings (guess how I know?)
 
#5 ·
Thanks, TLO & natisha! Super fun to see the video of Pat getting bucked off - or falling off, which? Just ribbin' ya, Pat!

It's educational to study what went wrong there: looks to me like Pat needed to cut horse slack instead of taut rope & causing the spin - horse felt trapped. When horse went to buck, Pat still kept rope taut.

If you have to fall, though, that was a nice, harmless fall, thank goodness!

I loved how Pat just got up with a smile on his face & kept on doing his job! No anger, no frustration vented upon the colt. :)
 
#7 ·
^^ i agree. Good fall though lol! I think the horse just got really spooked which is why he started spinning faster & because of the momentum of the spin i can't see many people staying on.
I am quite able (knock on wood!) to stick with my mare when she bucks & spooks "normally" ha ha but there's a certian move she pulls at times when she really spooks that gets me off everytime because she does a little jump to the side that sets you off balance & then rears a little & leaps backwards and to the side which results in me pitched over her shoulder (little brat).
 
#8 ·
My husband corrected me too... ha. So Pat didn't get bucked off as you all saw. The horse reared up and it seemed that Pat just kind of let go and let himself fall. Maybe it was a good idea rather than pulling the horse overtop of him. He did talk about the mistake today and thought that he was a little tense on the one side and Pat thought that he pushed him too far and that's what happened.

So far today....

Chris is doing real well. He's got his horse going under saddle well despite what happened when they first brought the horses in. They tried to bring in Chris' horse and he got real scared and I think he jumped the coral panel. Then they decided to bring them in all together to reduce the stress and that worked out better. But poor Chris had to start with that and his horse was most affected by the incident. But all in all he's still doing well but I think he's a bit down.

Pat is also doing really well. He's got his horse working so nicely now under saddle. It looks real cooperative between them. He spent a lot of time on the ground working through obstacles and then standing up over him playing the squeeze. He also put balloons on his saddle and asked him to move out and that was interesting. By the time he got on he was in a pretty good state of mind. At the end Pat seemed content and I think he spoke a lot today as an educator. I think that makes him happy - you know to share.

Clinton is probably doing the worst of the three. He did get up on his horse today but the cooperation or partnership is still pretty weak. He feels that it'll get better once they're outside the pen and that'll separate the boys from the men. He was a little nasty today as well. Both Pat and Chris have offered clinics to people attending RTTH for free - like wow how great. Then Clinton said something like anything good is not worth giving away. Like what an insult to both Chris and Pat - not very good sportsmanship there. At the end he didn't seem very happy but I can't really read him.

I'll post again very soon....
 
#10 ·
I don't understand why PP continued to put pressure onthe colt after he got up from the ground and the colt was bucking around the pen. What is purpose of puttig pressure on the colt after the colt just went to the extreme of bucking , due to being overpressured to begin with?

Just to add, I have NO favorite in this game. I don't know enough about any of the three. I think it is very strange to make horse gentling a timed, competitive event, but whatever . . .
 
#58 ·
I agree he over pressured the horse to begin with. However after the fact you need to make the horse think it is your idea that he is running and bucking. Nothing a horse does should be their idea when you are working with them.
 
#11 ·
TLO, thanks for update! Your club dues are waived!:)

Re: whether Pat bailed deliberately or was unhorsed: you can see, if you stop the vid at crucial points, that when the horse reared, he unseated Pat to point that Pat's left leg was behind the cantle. Yet the horse spun to the right coming down, causing Pat to be spun with him & pitched off the right side.

Pat took up too much slack off rope, horse did really nicely turning in response to that, yet Pat not offering a release (had to have been nerves; he so knows this!) caused the horse to want to get rid of the pressure.

Tinyliny, good question; Pat didn't pressure him immediately, however, in fact, he bowed to him in respect, as the horse jumped the barrel.
 
#12 ·
And the winner is Chris Cox. A true horseman and a sportsman!

I thought that both Chris and Pat did really well. It was close. I think that the fall cost Pat in the end but it's only my guess since everything else was performed equally well.

I'm not going to say anything about Clinton but only this ... my husband was very upset at his "performance" and almost couldn't watch. I hope someone good buys that colt.
 
#18 ·
And the winner is Chris Cox. A true horseman and a sportsman!
No wonder, he did really good in that video posted! Congrats to him! That was a tough competition though for all of them!
 
#14 ·
Well in my opinion I think that was the only real difference. The only other thing was the backup which I couldn't really see since the camera was on Pat's horse's butt. But I think it was real good anyway judging from the back. Pat went through one obstacle with better competence but Chris went through the poles a little better. Honestly, I could not see that Chris was so much better than Pat. Tootie did say that it was the toughest to judge and it was really close. So I guess someone had to win. Maybe they should consider ties in the future ...? I would have loved that even more. Chris and Pat talked about the welfare of the horse and it's future. I so bow to them for that and their incredible performances.
 
#17 ·
Well in my opinion I think that was the only real difference. OUCH! I was afraid of that happening! The only other thing was the backup which I couldn't really see since the camera was on Pat's horse's butt. But I think it was real good anyway judging from the back. Pat went through one obstacle with better competence but Chris went through the poles a little better. Honestly, I could not see that Chris was so much better than Pat. My heart tells me that he wasn't!Tootie did say that it was the toughest to judge and it was really close. So I guess someone had to win. True, as the rules now stand, but in that case, they should've had Pat win cos Chris has won twice. Maybe they should consider ties in the future ...? Agreed! Three-ways, too, because that's possible to have happen. I would have loved that even more. Chris and Pat talked about the welfare of the horse and it's future. I so bow to them for that and their incredible performances.Ditto! Awesome![/QUOTE]

Thanks very much, TLO!:-p
 
#15 ·
Honestly, i've never even heard of Chris Cox lol All the other's i know but i was very dissapointed with Clinton. He & Pat are 2 or my favs.
 
#25 · (Edited)
Oh! Thanks for telling us, TLO! That was the right thing to do!

After reading the articles, I'm more convinced than ever that Pat was as good as Chris! Pat did all obstacles cleanly, with a calm horse!:cry:

Does anyone know if they're judged by the training + obstacle course/freestyle, or are they judged by the obstacle/freestyle alone?
 
#24 · (Edited)
Cox, Anderson, Parelli.
Interesting video. I think what struck me most was how much stuff there was in Parelli's pen. Camera panned past: clean pen, clean pen, pen full of desensitization stuff.
I also noticed that the other two got their horses' minds off the ruckus in Parelli's pen, and didn't try and do anything too heroic while that was going on.
What I saw in the video: he got too cocky. Got the horse to yield to pressure, and got the crowd going. Instead of releasing and saying "good horse," he pushed just that one bit too far. Part of being a great horseman is knowing when to quit pushing and say "good horse. Well done."
 
#27 ·
Totally agree. Pat worked more on getting his horse's confidence around more than just himself than the others did & although he got dumped, it was obvious why and the other's didnt "push" or test their horses as much as Pat.
 
#28 ·
I'm not a big Parelli fan, but something I respected in the article I read was that he agreed with JustDressageIt:

“I’m not sore in any way,” Parelli replied. “You need to focus on four things with a horse: rapport, respect, impulsion and flexion. The two things I’m gonna focus on today are respect and flexion. He gave me a green light on the left side, but a yellow light on the right side. I made a mistake yesterday and pushed over the limit.”

Inside the 2011 Road to the Horse | EquiSearch

I respect someone who is under a lot of scrutiny, and will still say, "I screwed up."
 
#30 ·
I prefer Cox and Anderson, and am not shocked at the results of the competition. I think Parelli tried too much in too little time. In my humble opinion, he didn't need all that stuff in his pen, and I think perhaps it was a case of asking for way too much all at once.
Posted via Mobile Device
 
#35 ·
There are THREE scores turned in by each judge
Day One Round Pen
Day Two ROund Pen
and obstacle course...

the difficutly of the horse is judged... Pat's horse SHOULD have been easy he did NOT set that horse up to succeed I ... this was my sixth or seventh RTTH and I have never watched a trainer and been as confused as I was by Pat. Good thing he took that colt home since he taught it to buck. Clinton showed his true colors when they announced the winner by riding out without even congratulating Chris once again. Pat was a good talker and I wanted to shove his mike where the sun didn't shine his is sooo irratating.

Chris is a true horseman thur and thur hopefully some of the PP followers will realize the error of Pat's ways now.

Chris had a nice started horse at the end of today, Clinton has reactive horse that IMO he did what needed done to be get it's respect....
 
#36 ·
There are THREE scores turned in by each judge
Day One Round Pen
Day Two ROund Pen
and obstacle course...

the difficutly of the horse is judged... Pat's horse SHOULD have been easy he did NOT set that horse up to succeed I ... this was my sixth or seventh RTTH and I have never watched a trainer and been as confused as I was by Pat. Good thing he took that colt home since he taught it to buck. Clinton showed his true colors when they announced the winner by riding out without even congratulating Chris once again. Pat was a good talker and I wanted to shove his mike where the sun didn't shine his is sooo irratating.

Chris is a true horseman thur and thur hopefully some of the PP followers will realize the error of Pat's ways now.

Chris had a nice started horse at the end of today, Clinton has reactive horse that IMO he did what needed done to be get it's respect....
Pat made a single error of judgement on the first day, I'd hardly call that setting the horse up to fail.... the softness in the horses eyes today spoke volumes of the horses mental state. The horse doesnt' lie.

From all reports it didnt' buck on the second day - So I'd say bucking issue solved?

As a recently dissallusioned parelli follower, I would say that Pat actually did VOLUMES in settling the worried hearts of his fans. Mine included.

Pats horse was the ONLY horse not sweated up on teh first day.

Chris did an absolutely amazing job, and I will be following him closely, I will learn so much from him - he deserved his win

Clearly, you are a CA follower. He DID NOT do what was required to get that horses respect. because if he had, he would have won, if he had, he wouldn't have been arguing on teh second day. If he had, I wouldn't have been staring at pictures of Clints horse, gaping mouthed, bit practically severing blood supply to his tongue. Terrified whites of his eyes for basically the ENTIRE time Clint was in the saddle. he wanted a horse with more go - he got it.

I only pray that someone like Pat or Chris buy that poor damn colt and start the poor soul again.

A disgusting show of horsemanship that doesn't deserve the title of "Natural"
 
#37 · (Edited)
Gosh, I wish I'd been there! I've been sucking up all the information about how it went all night lol

It seems like all did well, but Chris Cox is just something else. What a horseman. I don't expect anybody to beat him as long as he is competing. Never have, never will.
I've been watching his show for years and saw him at a few expos, always just loved his style. IMHO there's not a single popular clinician in today's horse world who comes close to him.

I was so disappointed to read what somebody (me being too lazy to read all the way back to find who it was) had posted, about the free clinics and the comments made by Clinton about that (and the other instances). Very poor sportsmanship from somebody I had always very much respected. I don't consider him to be anywhere near the best horseman, but felt that he has had a great program for beginners (while somebody like Cox for instance probably wouldn't be the best for most beginners). I've been noticing him seeming cockier over the years. Don't know how I feel about promoting somebody with that kind of attitude...
 
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