So I just watched the Parelli Level One DVD...
 
 

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So I just watched the Parelli Level One DVD...

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    11-13-2010, 12:08 AM
  #1
Green Broke
So I just watched the Parelli Level One DVD...

DISCLAIMER - THIS IS NOT MEANT TO BE A PARELLI BASHING THREAD AND I WOULD GREATLY APPRECIATE IT IF WE COULD ATTEMPT TO REFRAIN FROM UNHELPFUL COMMENTARY. THANKS!

I have to say - I'm a bit baffled. My friend at the ranch does it a little bit, and she happens to have a burned copy, so I said what the heck, I'm ALWAYS down for learning new things! And I DID enjoy parts of it, he made some good points and created some new suggestions for things I can work with on my Arab mare for the winter while she's laid up.

But I really and truly feel that he contradicts himself. He's speaking of using a carrot stick because people have a changed demeanor with a whip so it's supposed to re-school the horse to associate carrot stick with good. And yet all I saw was a horse that was increasingly afraid of the stick. He started out quite calm, and the more Pat tapped and whacked and poked with that stick, the more of a nervous wreck the horse seemed to become. I did like some of the things he accomplished, but he's talking about being "partners" when it seems like the horse is running scared from him and his flailing stick. I can do virtually everything he did with that horse with my own horses.

I was a little dis-illusioned I think. I always thought that the things I did with Zierra were different from NH because I was training her to do them. I thought that NH was about moving in a way that made the horse WANT to follow you. I don't feel that at all now - the horse does things the Parelli way because it's been drilled into his head 60 times, the same as any other method!

I definitely took some good things away from it and some interesting new perspectives, but I think I was expecting more for some reason? I just wasn't all that impressed with him flailing a stick around and the horse leaping and jumping and bolting to try and get away from the pressure. How is this ANY different from what most of us do to train our horses?

I'd like to discuss this with both Parelli followers and non-Parelli trainers to gain some insight on what I watched if possible? Thanks!


     
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    11-13-2010, 12:43 AM
  #2
Weanling
As they state in the video, the stick is meant to be an extension of your arm. My gelding, Scotch, had to become sensitized to the stick at first. As you slowly work up the "phases of friendly firmness," your horse has the opportunity to respond at lower levels of stimulation with the stick. Wacking or tapping with the stick is the consequence--similar to what a dominant horse would do to get a submissive horse to move (eventually lunge or bite if the submissive horse didn't heed the warnings).

The stick isn't just used for directing, either. You use the friendly game all the time with it--toss the rope all over the body, rub them with the stick, etc. None of my horses fear the stick because they pay attention to my body language--I'm not going to run up and wack them without giving them the opportunity to comply at a lower phase of firmness. They also are perfectly comfortable when I give them a good scratch with the stick.

It's all about who is holding the stick and how they are using it...
     
    11-13-2010, 12:55 AM
  #3
Green Broke
My horses are the exact same way with the whip - it's never been used to hurt or frighten them, only to direct them.
     
    11-13-2010, 04:22 AM
  #4
Trained
Interesting thread! I'll be following it because I'm curious too. My whip is an extension of my arm and never used to hurt or punish them -- I have never understood how a carrot stick is anything new.
     
    11-13-2010, 08:19 AM
  #5
Trained
First, kudos for getting through it! I kept falling asleep.

Anyway, I have watched the first Parelli also, as well as some of the other NH people. They all have some very valid points, as well as some techniques that work. I always find it helpful to have more ideas and techniques, and don't think any single person has ALL the answers. More tools and ideas are always helpful until we find what works that day, on that issue with that horse.
     
    11-13-2010, 04:31 PM
  #6
Foal
I have also wondered about this training. I was following the Clinton Anderson training and found that his Handy Stick aka Carrot Stick was great for desensitizing but when I whack my arab mare with it or try to lunge for respect she turns on me. I can disengage her hind quarters with my thumb, but the stick makes her mad at me for whacking her. I did get some training aspects from this, though and my friend swears by it. My girl did much better under Gawanni Pony Boy training, she follows me everywhere, now that, she respond to, no sticks or gimmicks just bonding and letting her know what I want, I use my body language, hands and ropes, Simple. It, I guess depends on the horse, and my girl won't have it. You want natural go Native, wether eastern or american, I find great things in both, watch Ali Al-Ameri (you tube)he's awesome.
     
    11-13-2010, 05:41 PM
  #7
Weanling
Gimmicks!

You do not need an arm extension.

What is needed is a change in how you present yourself.
In other words, do you present trust and respect of the horse, or do you present an attitude of 'I'm superior to you [horse].

I have had many horses display their dominance only to find out that I am not impressed. Recently I had a Fresian stallion try and push me with his chest, I did not budge and as a result he heeded to me.

In fact, I have seen so many people whom have become dependent upon the usage of extra 'tools' that they cannot seem to accomplish tasks without the presence of said tool.
     
    11-13-2010, 07:00 PM
  #8
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by spirithorse8    
Gimmicks!

You do not need an arm extension.

What is needed is a change in how you present yourself.
In other words, do you present trust and respect of the horse, or do you present an attitude of 'I'm superior to you [horse].

I have had many horses display their dominance only to find out that I am not impressed. Recently I had a Fresian stallion try and push me with his chest, I did not budge and as a result he heeded to me.

In fact, I have seen so many people whom have become dependent upon the usage of extra 'tools' that they cannot seem to accomplish tasks without the presence of said tool.
While I agree with some of what you say, generally, however, something about 1200lbs (I am guestimating here) against 200 just doesn't sound quite right to me.
     
    11-13-2010, 07:26 PM
  #9
Green Broke
^

Very true - I've stood my ground to a horse before, but I've also been hurt before by standing ground and losing. In the end, they CAN move you, it's a matter of the mental battle and not the physical one. And if you can't get through to them mentally, you're going to find yourself pretty sore pretty fast.

I think I was just very surprised to see the horse so "worked up". He started out unafraid of the stick, and near the end when he's "combing" him towards him, the horse sees him lift the stick and immediately flings his head and tries to go backwards.

Very interesting, I just don't see how it's any different from what MOST of us do anyway, minus the thousands of dollars worth of equipment and movies.
     
    11-13-2010, 09:41 PM
  #10
Weanling
Did not say anything about leaving physical out. In this case as he stepped into me, I stepped into him and he got the point.
One must always be prepared to move out of the way without giving ground. Attitude carries alot of weight with horses....
     

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