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Something to ponder

This is a discussion on Something to ponder within the Natural Horsemanship forums, part of the Training Horses category

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        04-06-2013, 01:02 AM
      #41
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Saddlebag    
    Hey, I see in another training thread someone has posted a video of Warwick Shiller doing as I tried to explain about moving the horse's front end.
    Heard that name elsewhere recently & looked him up on youtube - found a very silly vid of him doing a silly dance kind of thing!
         
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        04-06-2013, 03:02 AM
      #42
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by its lbs not miles    
    Some of what Parelli does works with some horses, but you'll never hear him admit that it doesn't work with all of them and that sometimes you have to do things more slowly
    Firstly, not defending the guy - he's big & ugly enough to do that himself if he feels the need. Not in the least trying to justify the eg. You gave either - I didn't see it, for one. I also am aware that the times they have a-changed as far as 'Parelli Natural Horsemanship' & their teaching, since being into it nearly 20 years ago, but...

    I do still have a lot of respect & mostly agree with the *principles* he taught originally(mostly basic behavioural stuff), which do indeed include, in his words, 'never say never' & it's no good just trying to copy me & follow a 'recipe' approach, but you need to know when to be, why to be... & why not to be in any situation. But I think in too many cases people just hang on to the 'recipes' & forget they... mightn't have the appropriate ingredients for it to work.

    Re 'taking the time it takes', I also think that a lot of these 'clinicians' get carried away(maybe not right term) with the pressure of being performers - they have to deliver, or the show is a flop. So principles may suffer. Not justifying that either...
    AnrewPL likes this.
         
        04-06-2013, 03:52 AM
      #43
    Trained
    ...& then I just looked at the 'what in the world is going on' thread and yup, it seems like principles are weeell & truly out the window these days! That has just put any respect I had 50' under! Don't you sometimes wish horses weren't such a pushover & that more didn't fight back??
         
        04-09-2013, 09:40 PM
      #44
    Showing
    Loosie, you watched the one goofy video Schiller made. Watch the others. He good and uncomplicated and explains clearly.
         
        04-10-2013, 12:26 AM
      #45
    Yearling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by loosie    
    Firstly, not defending the guy - he's big & ugly enough to do that himself if he feels the need. Not in the least trying to justify the eg. You gave either - I didn't see it, for one. I also am aware that the times they have a-changed as far as 'Parelli Natural Horsemanship' & their teaching, since being into it nearly 20 years ago, but...

    I do still have a lot of respect & mostly agree with the *principles* he taught originally(mostly basic behavioural stuff), which do indeed include, in his words, 'never say never' & it's no good just trying to copy me & follow a 'recipe' approach, but you need to know when to be, why to be... & why not to be in any situation. But I think in too many cases people just hang on to the 'recipes' & forget they... mightn't have the appropriate ingredients for it to work.

    Re 'taking the time it takes', I also think that a lot of these 'clinicians' get carried away(maybe not right term) with the pressure of being performers - they have to deliver, or the show is a flop. So principles may suffer. Not justifying that either...

    Yeah, I’m pretty surprised by a lot of the reception, or perhaps, interpretation of Parelli’s gear recently. As I have said elsewhere I learned from a guy who learned from him directly, I don’t know how much was filtered through my friend vis-a-vis pure Parelli stuff, however I have read the guy’s book, and seen a thing or two here and there and what I learned conformed to that stuff pretty closely. Now however the thing that strikes me as amazing is how DIFFERENT the stuff I learned is from what I see the Parelli horde doing now. Not to mention the attitude behind a lot of it; I find it hard to understand really. And on that video with his wife trying to back that horse up I was stunned that it was the guys wife, I’d have assumed shed know it as good as him.
    I know that the stuff I learned worked, I have put it to the test working as a working cowboy, training my own horses and others, and using them day in, day out, as working stock horses. It doesn’t work 100% of the time on 100% of the horses I have dealt with without modification, but the principals remain the same though the actual technique may change. But it works.
    I used to think that the problem was that the Parelli crowd are probably primarily never in a position to use a horse for anything other than a recreation and therefore probably have a bit of a, I don’t know, unrealistic, lovey dovey fluffy attitude to horses? Could be a fair bit of that but the guy must have changed his stuff over the years to sell more of it I guess.
    The other possibility is that with each generation of teaching the message changes a little. I have had experience with this, I teach something that could be compared to horse riding, have done for 13 years, and I can think of two people. I taught them both exactly the same thing in exactly the same way. And how they ended up doing it are worlds apart; one is awesome at it, the other, not so awesome, but she thinks it’s as good as the other persons. Could just be that few people actually have the concentration to actually understand what the guy actually says. I don’t know.
    loosie likes this.
         
        04-11-2013, 05:02 PM
      #46
    Trained
    I haven't read all the post, I am only familiar w Parelli by the name only, however, I lunge my mare at liberty b/c it is what works best for us. At present, I don't really see my filly ever reaching the same level at lunging off the lead - it just isn't her "personality". So, yeah...I see a use for having a horse circle you at liberty if you are going to build on it...or in my case, remove the lead.
         

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