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Stereotypes about NH and how to overcome them

This is a discussion on Stereotypes about NH and how to overcome them within the Natural Horsemanship forums, part of the Training Horses category

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        12-18-2012, 11:48 PM
      #31
    Green Broke
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SorrelHorse    
    There are crazies in every training method.

    Good horsemanship is good horsemanship. Respect from a horse is respect from a horse. A good trainer is a good trainer. There's no grey area there as far as I'm concerned.
    I think that is part of the problem, the crazies stick out, so that is all people remember.
    PunksTank likes this.
         
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        12-19-2012, 12:06 AM
      #32
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tinyliny    
    I think that one reason NH is not always given much credence by traditional persons is that they do not see how it is useful to their purposes.
    They do not see how having a horse circle around you , unconnected , has any relevance to lunging for strength and building muscles to carry a bit and stay balanced and such. How having a horse stand on a pedestal has anything to do with having a horse go down a trail and cross a creek. How having a horse walk beside you wiht 6 feet of loose rope draping will be at all helpful if they have always lead the horse by holding just below the halter and never had any real issues doing such.

    As long as NH is seen as an ends in itself, instead of a means to bringing the horse into better use to the human, then it will not be relevant to an awful lot of horsemen/women.
    I have been stalking this thread and your post really got me to thinking about what I have experienced, so I thought I would share.

    I think that as a whole, most show horse trainers are considered or lumped into the "traditional" group of horse training. But in my experience, the trainers I have worked for are the ones that introduced me to NH methods more than anyone else. I never used a flag on a horse before starting colts for a cutting horse trainer in central CA. I learned a version of "join up" from a top cow horse trainer that proved very handy for young/aloof horses. Granted in a show barn situation the NH methods seem reserved for starting the colts and then it gets melded with more traditional methods as the horses mature. But it obviously works. That is one issue I have with some hard core NH followers, those methods can be used in conjunction with other methods. Just because you use Clinton Anderson, or whoever, it doesn't mean you have to stick to his program ONLY. If you do a little thinking and use some common sense it can be integrated into most any program.

    I don't consider myself to be in one camp or the other. I use both and it seems to work well for me and the horses I ride, but of course it needs to be tweeked to the individual.

    I think some of ill feelings towards NH has come from the extremists that think that NH or whatever clinician they are following at the time is the only way and if you don't follow then you are a horse abuser. Also the over marketing of products is an issue. It leaves you with the feeling of that it is about selling items rather than teaching about how to train your horse.
         
        12-19-2012, 03:16 PM
      #33
    Trained
    ^ I agree.

    I do follow Clinton Anderson. I find him just to be all around easy to watch, easy to understand, and frankly he's just hilarious. I went to one or two of his clinics out here a couple years ago and it really was an experience.

    I'm not going to have my eyes turn red, head spin around, and suddenly become the CA exorcism case though.
         
        12-19-2012, 08:31 PM
      #34
    Trained
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SorrelHorse    
    ^ I agree.

    I do follow Clinton Anderson. I find him just to be all around easy to watch, easy to understand, and frankly he's just hilarious. I went to one or two of his clinics out here a couple years ago and it really was an experience.

    I'm not going to have my eyes turn red, head spin around, and suddenly become the CA exorcism case though.
    LOL!
    But you can tell from your posts that you are well rounded and capable of deviating from CAs methods.
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        12-19-2012, 08:57 PM
      #35
    Started
    I am not a big fan of Parrelli or CA or Stacy Westfall's type of NH but the the three type of NH horsemanship guys I really do like are Buck Brannaman, Ray Hunt, and Tom/Bill Dorrance. I studied Buck Brannamans way of horse training and wrote paper on him, and I justfind him plain amazing. He doesn't shove things in your face, he is opened minded, he listens, he is not kn it for the money he is in it for the horse, and best of all, he does what is right and best for the horse. (Aaaand I tried to make that make as much sense as possible but I'm exhausted)
         
        12-19-2012, 09:24 PM
      #36
    Started
    Interesting to note that the Dorrances, with Tom as the unanimously elected Patron Saint of vaquero hms, Ray Hunt, & Buck are all held in the highest esteem by a microcrosm of the traditional group: coth long-time members (Chronicle of the Horse forum composed of serious "dressagers" hunters in the field, & eventers), but these same folks will bash Parelli to within an inch of his life (not to mention Linda's dressage teaching, not to mention endless conjecture as to why Walter Zettl took up teaching them dressage, etc.) There's a complete 180 in their esteem when it comes to Parelli.

    I don't find justification for it, (I've read Tom's words & read Bill's often, & have seen several videos of Buck riding/teaching, & audited a Ray Hunt clinic, & I don't see that they & PNH are at opposite poles).
    Fargosgirl likes this.
         
        12-19-2012, 09:33 PM
      #37
    Foal
    Interesting to note that the Dorrances, with Tom as the unanimously elected Patron Saint of vaquero hms, Ray Hunt, & Buck are all held in the highest esteem by a microcrosm of the traditional group: coth long-time members (Chronicle of the Horse forum composed of serious "dressagers" hunters in the field, & eventers), but these same folks will bash Parelli to within an inch of his life (not to mention Linda's dressage teaching, not to mention endless conjecture as to why Walter Zettl took up teaching them dressage, etc.) There's a complete 180 in their esteem when it comes to Parelli.

    I don't find justification for it, (I've read Tom's words & read Bill's often, & have seen several videos of Buck riding/teaching, & audited a Ray Hunt clinic, & I don't see that they & PNH are at opposite poles).


    I don't know that what they teach is so different as how they teach it and how different their perceived humility is. Pat just rubs a lot of people wrong.
         
        12-19-2012, 09:49 PM
      #38
    Started
    I agree with old97fan. Also, I should add I learn from every horse trainer, even if it is NOT what to do.
         
        12-19-2012, 10:08 PM
      #39
    Trained
    To start out I never liked ANY of them(NH clinicians). My first taste of NH was Monty Roberts. Watched some videos then I had worked for a trainer that used to show with him and was close friends with a person who had dated one of his "daughters". They both, without knowing the other, had very similar stories about Monty's training and what it really consisted of. It left a sour taste as far as NH goes admittedly.

    I too will admit to not being a fan of Pat and Linda Parellli. And I did try breifly when he first came onto the scene. I just couldn't get on board and I still can't. I can handle Clinton Anderson in small doses and I have actually used some of his methods. Not they are actually his, mostly the NH stuff I do use seems pretty universal. I have came around to Buck as well, at first I thought he was a little boring and playing off the cowboy end too much. But I realized that doesn't bother me because I would rather information rather than a laser and fireworks show. (The first set of Buck tapes I had(VHS) I used to put on when I couldn't sleep...LOL.)
         
        12-19-2012, 10:20 PM
      #40
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by COWCHICK77    
    ... (The first set of Buck tapes I had(VHS) I used to put on when I couldn't sleep...LOL.)
    I put on older vids of PNH when I've got insomnia, but it's seeing the horses that helps me sleep, not how boring P&L are, lol.
         

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