Who else rides in rope halter - Page 7 - The Horse Forum
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post #61 of 81 Old 07-05-2012, 11:11 AM
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I think all horse need to know how to work well and be soft in a bit even if you do not use one. B/C most people who might look at him if he was ever for sale are going to want to at least know the horse was properly trained in a bit. I would not even look at a started horse who was not going well in a bit.
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post #62 of 81 Old 07-05-2012, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by nrhareiner View Post
I think all horse need to know how to work well and be soft in a bit even if you do not use one. B/C most people who might look at him if he was ever for sale are going to want to at least know the horse was properly trained in a bit. I would not even look at a started horse who was not going well in a bit.
That's a fair call & the reason I started a mare I had in a bit, after having ridden her a few years. I had difficulties & couldn't keep her. But my horses are with me for life, emergencies aside & if I did think of selling them, I'd want a good, experienced home, so that shouldn't matter.
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post #63 of 81 Old 07-05-2012, 09:44 PM
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I'm a firm believer in bits. I don't believe in riding in halters, because I'm a worker. When I get on a horse, its rarely to just amble around on the trails. When I trained, my horses worked, and they worked hard.

When I passed them off to their owners or riders, they were light in the mouth and their riders appreciated that they were trained in bits. If I were to take a training horse and only work it in a halter, I'd be a laughing stock. That horse would be good for trails and putzing around in the arena. Not serious work.

A lot of competitions require bits. Some of them take hackamores. When I showed (and I hate showing, so I didn't do it for long) my horse went in a hackamore, and I had to switch him to a bit because hackamores weren't allowed. Its a good thing he was trained in both or I would have been up chocolate creek without a popsicle stick.

I like bits. Hackamores and other bitless bridles can be just as abusive and painful as a bitted bridle. They all use one thing: pressure on the horse's face. With the wrong person, the right tool can be very harmful.
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post #64 of 81 Old 07-05-2012, 09:57 PM
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Originaly posted by Loosie Interested to know, why do you feel horses should be trained with a bit as well? Or perhaps you just mean it's just important to *you* that your horses are?
I feel it is iportant for a horse to be trained to both a halter and a bit because if the horses is every rehomed. Every ridder likes something diffrent. for an example, I like ridding with out a bit, but my sister likes ridding with a bit. One of my friends also uses a hackamoor, when she rides. Its the same as ridding I find, some people like western better then english and vise versa. My 14 year old mare is very responsive in a bit but not in a halter, she is learning though. Well there is my 7 year old mare is responsive with out a halter or a bit. Everyone is diffrent, horses included.

Last edited by Running Hooves; 07-05-2012 at 10:00 PM. Reason: Didn't typ inth Quote in properly
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post #65 of 81 Old 07-05-2012, 10:39 PM
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IMHO, a well trained horse will ride in whatever the heck you want to ride them in. I can ride mine in a bit, or a halter, or nothing more than a string around their neck. Personally, I would never look at buying a horse that was advertised as "Never worn a bit" or "Trained in a halter/bitless bridle/etc" because, to me, that horse is missing a huge section of training.

Whatever you put on the horse's head should never be about "control" and if that's what you're using it for, then you're using it wrong. When a horse gets to the point of being well trained, then the headgear you choose becomes all about subtlety. A neck rope doesn't offer as much feel or subtlety as a halter and a halter doesn't offer as much as a snaffle and a snaffle doesn't have as much as a curb.

On one end, you're trying to have a complex conversation with your horse using those old play telephones that everyone made as a child...you know, with the 2 tin cans and the length of string? You go into different rooms and pull the string tight and talk into the can back and forth. Yeah, it works, but you have to speak relatively loud and things still come out muffled. The range of communication is very limited.

On the other hand, you've got a good quality digital landline. You can whisper into the phone and whoever you are talking to can hear every single syllable, regardless of whether you are 5 feet or 5000 miles apart.

I'm all for folks who wish to ride their horses in halters or sidepulls or bitless bridles or what have you, but I do get very tired of everyone just assuming that those of us who choose to use bits are automatically hurting our horses, that the bit itself causes pain regardless of how it's used...that every horse would be happier "without some hunk of metal in their mouth". Unless a person has experience with every single horse everywhere in the world, then blanket statements like that are just straight up incorrect.

My horses do not get hurt with the bit. If they did, then they would not be nearly so quick to pick it up out of my hand as if it were a treat. They would resist being bridled and they would be cautious and hyper-reactive every time I picked up my hand to give a cue (the way horses are when they have been handled roughly).

I guess I just subscribe to a different way of thinking. So many people think "I must use the absolute softest headstall on my horse so that there is no chance of ever hurting him", whereas I feel like "I should work to improve my ability and my hands so that I can ride my horses in whatever I choose with no chance of ever hurting him".

IMHO, a person can never hope to advance beyond a certain level (or advance their horses beyond a certain level) unless they are willing to challenge themselves to learn to effectively use more advanced pieces of equipment.

Always remember that feeling of looking at a big, open country over the ears of a good horse, seeing a new trail unwind ahead of you, and that ever-spectacular view from the top of the ridge!!! Follow my training blog: http://robertsontraining.blogspot.com/
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post #66 of 81 Old 07-05-2012, 10:41 PM
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I think a bit is neccessary at some point if you want to do more than just trail ride. But you guys need to stop making it sound like just trail riding is a bad thing. I think a bit is neccessary to first teach a horse to reallyyy be soft, supple, and collected simply because the cues from a bit make more sense than from a halter... Like the bit can move in more directions. But I think it is possible to have a working horse in a halter once they're finished. No one ever tries, though, because it's not neccessary.

Last edited by RosiePosie06; 07-05-2012 at 10:43 PM.
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post #67 of 81 Old 07-05-2012, 11:29 PM
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I agree with Smrobs. Any tool can be used incorrectly or can be the best thing ever. My horse seeks the bit out when I'm holding it. I wouldn't go so far as to say I wouldn't buy a horse never having worn a bit, because I would love the fact that they didn't have (possible) baggage from someone with loud hands or rough hands tugging on their mouth.

This isn't such a big deal, halter/bridle...
It's the way you use them that is correct or incorrect as well as personal preference. You could probably use a neck string incorrectly and cause your horse problems.

Also, just because you have a bit in your horses mouth or a halter on their head doesn't mean you aren't riding bridleless. You don't actually have to pick up the reins, or neck string. They are there for corrections not control. You only get true bridleless riding from not using the tools sitting on your horses head. It's their job to uphold their responsibility, if they don't then they are corrected.

We all agree that we want the best for our horses, none of us is going to go out there and purposely harm them, we are all doing the best that we can. Even those people out there using the tools wrong just haven't learned the correct way a lot of times, or a way that is better communication for the horse. I'm sure everyone of us is out there screwing something up, but our heart is in the right place. Tom Dorrance, Ray Hunt, all those guys were still making mistakes they didn't know yet. No one is perfect, as long as we try to be the best we can be for our horses and are constantly trying to be better, we are doing the right thing.

Last edited by SassaSavvy; 07-05-2012 at 11:31 PM.
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post #68 of 81 Old 07-06-2012, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smrobs View Post
IMHO, a well trained horse will ride in whatever the heck you want to ride them in. I can ride mine in a bit, or a halter, or nothing more than a string around their neck.
I agree with that

Quote:
Originally Posted by smrobs View Post
I'm all for folks who wish to ride their horses in halters or sidepulls or bitless bridles or what have you, but I do get very tired of everyone just assuming that those of us who choose to use bits are automatically hurting our horses, that the bit itself causes pain regardless of how it's used...that every horse would be happier "without some hunk of metal in their mouth". Unless a person has experience with every single horse everywhere in the world, then blanket statements like that are just straight up incorrect.
I like especially one sentence: if you leave a bit on a horse's pasture with a horse, will a bit hurt a horse? No.
Unfortunately there are many many people who shouldn't use bits. In their hands bits are very painful for horses. But pain could be done with anything so...

Quote:
Originally Posted by smrobs View Post
IMHO, a person can never hope to advance beyond a certain level (or advance their horses beyond a certain level) unless they are willing to challenge themselves to learn to effectively use more advanced pieces of equipment.
It always remainds me Nevzorov and his achievements with horses (before he'd given up riding). As far as I know he didn't put anything on horses head and his horses still looked amazing while being ridden
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post #69 of 81 Old 07-06-2012, 10:42 PM
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IMHO, a person can never hope to advance beyond a certain level (or advance their horses beyond a certain level) unless they are willing to challenge themselves to learn to effectively use more advanced pieces of equipment.
...Like that advanced piece of equipment everyone carries around on top of their shoulders!
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post #70 of 81 Old 07-09-2012, 02:01 PM
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I ride my horses in both. However, I only train horses with halters. (:
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