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Advice please

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        06-10-2013, 04:51 AM
      #11
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SamAM    
    thank you for your tips. Today I walked her a few yards with out me holding her in any way, she just followed me her head next to me all the time tho, I know a few yards is nothing but its a start.
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    Different countries and different takes on how to get the horse to behave.

    I have two horses at present and they are as different as chalk and cheese. Trust issues. I don't agree with foxhunter in her reply. A horse that has been shifted from piller to post with several owners over a very short period of time has to have developed some behavour traits. And that can show as being hard to control.

    Try deciding if you like the horse, then if you are going to spend the time required to gain its confidence. Start small Try leading the horse with its head not infront of yours and walking an arms length out to the side. Stop and start making sure it learns to stay in the position described. Turn to the left and to the right and make it walk with you. If its on your right side, turn to the right, and walk straight at its head and make it move away but stay with you. Do this on both sides. What I have tried to describe is an exercise I do to get the horse paying attention. And to follow my instructions.

    Now for the horse following you, if it does that without prompting an't that the greatest feeling. :) My horse Bugs gets involved when I am working on the fences so much I have to remind him to stand at arms length from me. That is for safety reasons. Mine. But he sticks his nose right up to what I am working on and has a sniff. I let him do that then inforce the arms length rule.

    If the horse choses to follow in a relaxed way and is not encouraged by food in your hand or pocket then it is chosing to be with you. Take advantage of that by being kind and including it and prase it by a scratch on the cheek.

    When Bugs follows me I have a conversation with him. I include him, I make the experience of being with me pleasant. But he is not a dog and it is a mistake to treat them in that manner.

    Don't get yourself in a dangerous position always think the horse needs to escape if threatened. So, don't have the horse next to a fence, Bush, or what ever and you blocking his escape, because he will run over you.

    The photo is Bugs getting invloved with some fencing repairs after he has completed his inspection close up he is now content to look. The other horse is Stella she holds back. Bugs though less experienced will be the better riding horse as he is braver, more relaxed, and less likely to spook.

    So get out there and spend time if you like the horse. If you don't like it, move it on because it knows how you feel. It can see your feelings a hundred yards away. Good luck.
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    SamAM likes this.
         
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        06-10-2013, 07:14 AM
      #12
    Super Moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Stan    
    Different countries and different takes on how to get the horse to behave.
    Also, Stan different experiences.

    I do not agree with what you said and it is not different to what I said in that you are setting rules and boundaries.

    I have dealt with many horses that have been messed with both mentally and physically. Many coming to me as a 'last chance'.

    I always start with the horse in the stable. Making it stand where I put it, untied. If it moves forward, which they will all do unless taught otherwise, I correct with a finger in their chest and push them back. If they ignore the finger then I will use the pointed end of a hoof pick, not to dig it in but so that they feel it. No temper or annoyance a simple firm correction.
    I am constantly using my voice.

    A horse that has been shoved from pillar to post is far, far happier knowing the rules. I do not advocate beating them up (only for dangerous transgressions) and even then it is usually more with voice and body posture than anything else.

    Once a horse has learned the inside rules and that you mean what you say, it transfers to outside and they rarely try anything very much.

    This in turn transfers to being ridden.

    I do you my voice a lot but more I will use 'brain picturing' and think in pictures which they seem to latch onto once you are tuned together.
    Might sound a bit loopy but, on more than one occasion I have gone to skip out a pile of poop after I have fed a horse and he is standing in the way. I can just picture them moving their foot so I can get to it and they do. One old horse I had for many years would just pick up that foot and hold it up whether it was a front or back, so I could get to the poop.
    vermontrider likes this.
         
        06-10-2013, 07:19 AM
      #13
    CRK
    Foal
    Start with lots of groundwork, there are a lot of different methods out there, but spending time on the ground working with your horse, whether on the line or in a round pen is the best way to start building a bond. Be loving, but firm and assertive when handling your horse. Also, be consistent - consistency builds trust because the horse knows what to expect from you.
    SamAM likes this.
         
        06-10-2013, 09:42 AM
      #14
    Foal
    "Now for the horse following you, if it does that without prompting an't that the greatest feeling. :) "

    Yes she did it without any prompt. I was stood and started to walk and she just followed I had no food in my pocket or in my hand. Infact she walked past hay and walked thourgh grass. Normaly she would try and stop to eat even when I have hold of her,but she didnt she just followed me.
         
        06-10-2013, 09:44 AM
      #15
    Foal
    Foxhunter I do not like the way you said my friends don't know horses, they know plenty about them they have take in a horse on its last chance as no one can cope with him a few months ago. And now he is a completely different horse! I posted for help and advice not to have my friends insulted, I would rather you post helpful advice
    Stan and TBforever like this.
         
        06-10-2013, 04:41 PM
      #16
    Green Broke
    Horse following you when it suits horse is not the way to do it, as that lets horse call the shots and will lead to more problems.

    As to the personality thing? Hogwash. Same with the heifer on the beach, and you can add dangerous as hell to that one too.

    Horses do not dwell on "oh I had such a bad life and I am so damaged" either, so get that out of your head.

    Calm and quiet approach to horses is always the best policy.

    And less worrying about "bond/trust" and more showing that you are the leader will serve you well.
    smrobs, Stan and sparklefox like this.
         
        06-10-2013, 06:40 PM
      #17
    Green Broke
    A lot of people seem to be very fixated on getting a "bond" early on with a new horse.

    The thing with horses though is that they don't bond quite like people. When you first move your horse to a new place with other horses you'll notice that it can take them a few weeks to really settle in and establish trust and security with other horses. They constantly try to work out where they stand, who the leader is and what that means for weeks. Not just the sometimes violent few hours you first see. This is the way that horses develop relationships.

    When you consider that they spend perhaps 2 or 3 weeks, 24/7 working out their differences, you can see that the hour a day or so we spend actually work with them is just a fraction of that time. Not only that, but the time we do spend, such as in the saddle, isn't usually working on things in the "horse's language" but in ours. In this way I think it usually takes somewhere near a year to really start to develop a "bond" or understanding between horse and owner. So if you were to ask me how to develop a bond I would say consistent and varied work for 6 months to a year.

    I'd work on establishing the basic ground controls. Lunging at walk/trot each way on a 12 ft or so lead. Halting on command. Backing up, moving forward, yielding both hind and fore each way. I usually run through these commands most days. Whether it be when I catch my mare, or before I ride or just while I am doing what I normally, sending through a gate, yielding her hindquarters, backing out of the way etc. Once a horse does this calmly and obediently, then both you and your horse can feel safe doing most things on the ground. Maintaining these skills, while working on whatever else, is what I think helps to develop a bond and trust.
    vermontrider likes this.
         
        06-11-2013, 12:51 AM
      #18
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SamAM    
    "Now for the horse following you, if it does that without prompting an't that the greatest feeling. :) "

    Yes she did it without any prompt. I was stood and started to walk and she just followed I had no food in my pocket or in my hand. Infact she walked past hay and walked thourgh grass. Normaly she would try and stop to eat even when I have hold of her,but she didnt she just followed me.

    My horse will stop eating and follow. It is a good trait and one a lot of my friends look for in their horse. It is a leadership thing the horse is following not challenging. With Bugs I put him through his paces stopping, turning, on voice command and my body que. I have never had a problem with a horse that followed. If a horse choses to be with you that's a real plus in the horse human relationship and a number of books and studies have been complied on just that subject which make interest reading. It does not mean you are not training it. It does not mean you lose control and if the horse gets pushy, I push back and the boundries are adhered to. But its a great feeling to walk around the property and the horse is following, checking out what I stop to look at. See the photo at the bottom that is Bugs following and he kept following until I decided it was time to ride.
         
        06-11-2013, 05:22 PM
      #19
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Boo Walker    
    Sometimes it helps to think of your new partnership as being between you and a new friend who doesn't speak your language. Time and patience is the key. She has had lots of homes and lots of different languages to try and grasp.
    Ground work is essential and skipping it or going too fast will leave the both of you frustrated. She needs to learn not only your verbal cues but your body language as well. It may help to keep a journal of what you are currently working on. Keep it simple with 4-5 basic things and work on these every day for a month. (I actually have them on a 3x5 notecard that I keep in my back pocket as I work with my horse). Remember- you may be bored with it, but it's new to her. They are building blocks, so she will need to understand them completely, respond quickly-quietly & consistently before you can move on to other things. Do them in the arena, in the field, every place you can think of. If you get stuck just get creative and try to "explain" it to her another way. This will help you understand how she learns best.

    Another great tool to help you get started is to determine her personality (see http://www.freewebs.com/mypnh/Horsen...e%20traits.JPG)
    "The Right Brain Extrovert needs safety. Never push him past the threshold until he's calm. You will need to retreat and to interrupt the pattern. You must have a strong focus and must match the horse's high energy level. Give him a job to accomplish to replace his fear with something positive. He must think of you as his "safe place."

    The Right Brain Introvert needs comfort. The worst thing you can do is push this horse before he's confident. You'll ruin his trust in you if you push him before he's ready. Taking your time is important because you'll need to wait on this horse to process things. He needs to believe in you.

    The Left Brain Extrovert needs play. He craves creative, imaginative tasks and can't stand to be forced into anything. Because he hates to be bored, you'll need to speed things up, be enthusiastic and come up with variety in your lessons.

    The Left Brain Introvert needs incentive. There are plenty of ways to offer incentive without "bribing" him. (Think rest, grazing, treats, scratches.) This horse needs to have a purpose and wants to go somewhere. Riding circles in an area with this horse will lead to resistance and defiance. Use reverse psychology for best results."

    *although I'm not a "fan" of Parelli, this tool really does work!

    Good luck and let us know how things are going!!
    This is an amazing tool!! Thank you!
         
        06-14-2013, 11:47 AM
      #20
    Foal
    I think one of the best things you can do to help your horse trust you and build a better bond would be to go out and just spend time with him.Go out and give him a massage, a really good brush, make him a nice meal, give him lots of pets, etc. Personally, I like to go out and just let my horse graze by me while I read a book! Don't always go out there just to ride, or else he'll think that every time he sees you you're going to get on him, when it's nice to just relax with you horse. Of course there are other ways to gain your horses trust, but this is just one of my personal favorite cause it allows both you and your horse to relax with eachother, and build a better bond :)
         

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