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post #31 of 37 Old 10-06-2013, 02:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Francisco Abreu View Post
LOL, i think jumping is not very dangerous, but u need to train alot, and i will train alot now, cause i dont wanna fall etc... and u can use other safety clothes not only the helmet
riding in it's self is very dangerous you risk your life every time you get on a horse and yes most of the time nothing happens but that doesn't mean the danger isn't there, the horse could spook, you could lose your balance, the tack could come loose, the horse could decided he doesn't want you on his back any more an buck/rear/crowhop etc.
also you never answered my question, how did the horse "go crazy"? did he spook?

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post #32 of 37 Old 10-06-2013, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by updownrider View Post
bsms - Again, that article is old. Dated 1999.

I'm not the one quoting statistics, you are.

So I am surprised you post "Jumping is a fairly dangerous equine sport, with risks going up 1,000-4,000%" (September 11) and you are not using the most up to date data you can find, but instead rely on statistics from reports from 1990, and since that time safety standards have improved drastically.
Other than helmets, which were seeing use in some of the studies, there has been no dramatic change in standards. I am using the best information I could find. If you have better, post it. Until then, all you have are your feelings, which are not backed up by ANYTHING.

The point is not that people shouldn't jump, but that they should realize it IS more dangerous and takes steps to reduce the danger - primarily by good instruction. The studies I've seen indicate helmets reduce the risk by 50-75%, and that means they are not a cure-all. A 75% reduction in a 2000% increase would still be a 500% increase.

The link I had to data from 2008 is no longer posted. In it, the ONLY statistics they kept were falls DURING a jump vs falls NEAR a jump. Hmmm...what does that tell you about the number of falls between jumps or during dressage? I'm sorry that study is no longer available on the Internet.

If you think jumping involves no added risk, you can join the backyard jumpers practicing jumping over lawn chairs and tables without helmets or instruction. But I've posted the data I've seen. You have offered nothing.
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post #33 of 37 Old 10-06-2013, 11:51 AM
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From 2002:

In 1972 an improved protective helmet was introduced for professional jockeys and D’Abreu of the Jockey Club noted a reduction in head injuries from 46 in the 1967–8 season to 27 in the 1973–4 season.

Mills in 1988 was concerned that this helmet was still not providing enough protection.Many of the injuries he investigated were to the side of the head where protection provided by the helmet was minimal.

The European standard (CEN) was introduced in 1996 and all protective helmets worn in this country have to at least conform to the minimum performance requirements....

...In 1984 Lloyd noted that 50% of admissions were from a head injury and at Oxford it had reduced from 66% in 1971 to 26% in 1991. Muwanga found that six riders wearing a helmet had a skull fracture. McGhee found that all the severely injured had a skull fracture despite the wearing of a helmet.

In our study isolated head injuries accounted for only 17.3% of all injuries and only 15.6% of these were admitted. One can conclude that asmost riders are wearing a helmet conforming to the European Standard (or equivalent), it is reducing the incidence of a skull fracture and the severity of the injury.

The relative incidence of upper limb injuries would appear to be increasing when compared with other studies. Whitlock found that 24.3% of injuries affected the upper limb with 42.3% having sustained a fracture.

In our study 29.2% had upper limb injuries of which 61.8% sustained a fracture. Fractured wrists/scaphoids accounted for 22.4% of the upper limb injuries whereas Whitlock found only 10.8% to have a fracture.

A changing pattern of injuries to horse riders
P S Moss, A Wan, M R Whitlock / Emerg Med J2002;19:412–414

In eventing it has been mandatory to wear a helmet that conforms to Bs4472, similar to that for professional jockeys. The design has been criticised as not offering enough protection, and the standard was amended in 1988.

After six deaths in eventing in 1993, four from a head injury, efforts have been made to improve the design of the helmet."

Injuries to riders in the cross country phase of eventing: the importance of protective equipment / Br J Sports Med1999;33:212–216

Notice the dates...helmets have been in use in eventing for a long time.

"Make the right thing easy and the wrong thing...well, ignore it mostly."
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post #34 of 37 Old 10-30-2013, 04:39 PM
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Speaking of riding accidents, it doesn't matter how good you are, or what discipline you chose, you can still get hurt. The horse can trip and fall and you can get stuck underneath your horse.

My dressage instructor has been to the ICU 3 times over the course of her life. She has broken most of the bones in her body at least once - all freak accidents.

My horse recently tripped and fell during a dressage lesson - fortunately, I did not get hurt. But that could have easily turned out differently.

You just have to decide for yourself if the benefits of riding outweigh the risks.
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post #35 of 37 Old 10-30-2013, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by bsms View Post

If you think jumping involves no added risk, you can join the backyard jumpers practicing jumping over lawn chairs and tables without helmets or instruction. But I've posted the data I've seen. You have offered nothing.
I've been away so I didn't see your comments until now.

Point out to me where I said jumping involves no added risks? I absolutely never said or implied that, and you have no idea what I think. I merely questioned the accuracy of the statistics you posted over and over. I do not intend to offer anything, but you are the one that is defensive and now has resorted to insults.

Backyard jumper? That is rich coming from someone who has only been riding for only 5 years and doesn't even jump. I've been jumping for 45 years and I've worn a helmet with a harness since the 1960s. My parents were strict about safety long before most people.

I'm done on this thread, and would have been done, but I do not want someone putting words in my mouth.

Oh, and if you think there has been no dramatic change in safety standards except helmets, you might want to research body vests, safety cups and frangible pins.
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post #36 of 37 Old 11-01-2013, 12:05 PM
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Point being, 8 lessons is nowhere near enough, you have ages to go. I've been doing flatwork for a year now, it doesn't mean I'm bad, but I learn every day! And tbh, i don't mind doing just w/t/c, it's fun just being around the horse.

Good luck :)

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post #37 of 37 Old 11-01-2013, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Francisco Abreu View Post
I've had 8 riding lessons and wanted to know more or less when I start jumping. I'm not afraid of falling, I almost fell in the last class because the horse was stubborn! I still have many lessons to start jumping? thank you :P
I have had lessons for five months and just had my first jumps last week. While it was a tremendous feeling I had to admit that I wasn't quite ready. There was no fear, but my form was inconsistent and I approached the jumps a bit too fast ( breaking into a brief cantor).
I still want to jump, but more importantly I want to relax and jump correctly.
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